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Wayfarer515
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SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 2:51 pm

http://bbj.hu/economy/report-hungary...supported-by-russian-sukhoi_111189

New national carrier partly finance by Russia and Hungary's national government.
 
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lesfalls
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:41 pm

Interesting. I wonder how they can start flights from BUD with Wizz air and Ryanair operating majority of the flights from BUD.



[Edited 2016-02-09 08:04:10]
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BestWestern
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:00 pm

Quoting Lesfalls (Reply 1):
Ryaniar

Is that the new Muslim airline?
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MaverickM11
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:26 pm

Russian backed carrier to buy Russian backed plane. Imagine that. What are the odds this carrier actually sees the light of day?
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alfa164
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:29 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 3):
Russian backed carrier to buy Russian backed plane. Imagine that. What are the odds this carrier actually sees the light of day?

"If you can't sell your aircraft... just start an airline that will take them!"   
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winterlight
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:37 pm

Another Solyom Airways methinks.
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SKAirbus
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:14 pm

I really don't think Hungary can support a national airline in a deregulated EU. One of the many reasons Malev failed was the competition from LCC, a market that has a lot of success in Hungary. Also, from BUD many legacy carriers operate including KL, LH, BA, AF etc etc.
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Fly-K
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:17 pm

With the Orban government playing the national card as well as being pro-Russia, it's not unthinkable.
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:22 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 3):
What are the odds this carrier actually sees the light of day?

Very little to none, and even if it does, it won't be around for long.

Quoting winterlight (Reply 5):
Another Solyom Airways methinks.

Me too.

Right below the report linked by the OP you can see the following one. The rest is history:

http://bbj.hu/business/malev-signs-l...ent-on-1-bln-sukhoi-purchase_49082
 
MaverickM11
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:39 pm

Quoting SKAirbus (Reply 6):
I really don't think Hungary can support a national airline in a deregulated EU. One of the many reasons Malev failed was the competition from LCC, a market that has a lot of success in Hungary. Also, from BUD many legacy carriers operate including KL, LH, BA, AF etc etc.

It's interesting to note that BUD has never seen more passengers, without a national carrier

Quoting Fly-K (Reply 7):
With the Orban government playing the national card as well as being pro-Russia, it's not unthinkable.

   gotta lose money, for the country!
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LH748
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 7:33 pm

Nationalist/Patriotic business decisions, are they not usually bound for disaster?
Thank goodness Szydło and Kaczynski are too anti-Russia to ruin LOT this way. Maybe they find another way.
  
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Fly-K
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:02 pm

Quoting LH748 (Reply 10):
Thank goodness Szydło and Kaczynski are too anti-Russia to ruin LOT this way. Maybe they find another way

Well, no Airbus for them either it seems, as with the stalled helicopter deal...
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
rbavfan
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:28 am

Quoting alfa164 (Reply 4):
http://bbj.hu/business/malev-signs-l...ent-on-1-bln-sukhoi-purchase_49082

The current political scene is hurting its sales. The plane operates quite well. InterJet of Mexico has taken up options from whats been posted. They love the way it operates. And before you make comments they have a mixed fleet of A320 series & SSJ's. So they are not stupid with operating cost!
 
Wayfarer515
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:18 am

I think every manufacturer enjoys some protectionism from their government in one form or another, so on that side I think it is business as usual, very much the same way USA is "persuading" Poland to buy their Blackhawks for example.

I do hope to see some more competition in Eastern Europe to A&B, it is about time and in the upcoming years the Russians will have some interesting options to offer. It will also be interesting, if this deal ever comes to fruition, how will they compete or try to compete against the incumbent carriers, maybe playing the nationalistic card is all part of it.
 
mrcomet
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 7:18 am

Quoting LH748 (Reply 10):
Quoting LH748 (Reply 10):
Nationalist/Patriotic business decisions, are they not usually bound for disaster?

In the long run, yes you are right. But the Orban government is very corrupt and its likely to try to hamstring the competition and support the national airline. It will compete in Hungary but it will continue to lose ground internationally. While the Superjet is not a bad choice if prices were cheap enough, Russian businesses tend to bribe and corrupt governments tend to make bad decisions for their people so its likely Hungary paid too much making it a poor choice. Look at Air Serbia and Etihad which got JAT for cheap.
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AirPacific747
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 9:32 am

I don't really see a place for this airline. How will they compete with Wizz on price, or number of destinations? What's the reason that Russia wants to partly finance an airline that most likely would be loss making? And how long can the 'demand' for the SSJ that this airline would create, keep the production alive? Another 6 months?
 
Redd
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 10:41 am

Quoting Fly-K (Reply 7):
With the Orban government playing the national card as well as being pro-Russia, it's not unthinkable.

  

The dumber the idea the more chance it has of seeing the light of day...

Quoting LH748 (Reply 10):
Maybe they find another way.
  

Oh they will. They've already convinced their electorate PZL makes far more superior helicopters than Eurocopter/Aerospatiale, if they can do that they can ruin LOT.
 
cedarjet
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 10:45 am

"SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier" -- Ryanair's buying SSJs?!!
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r2rho
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 11:12 am

There was once a shady SSJ deal signed for Malev, so it is not the first time this pops up. Perhaps this is even the revival of that chapter. Perhaps even there is some money owed to Sukhoi from then, or some deposits that could be recovered. Who knows, the whole deal was all but transparent.

We all agree there is no place for such an airline in BUD, with FR and W6 owning the place. Whether Orban plays the nationalist card and pushes it through nevertheless is another thing.
Then would eventually come the EU forcing to repay all the illegal state aid, Orban playing victim, etc etc...
 
krisyyz
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:00 pm

Quoting r2rho (Reply 18):
Then would eventually come the EU forcing to repay all the illegal state aid, Orban playing victim, etc etc...

Which is what ultimately bankrupted Malev, in conjunction with bad political decisions and bad management decisions especially regarding the MA's fleet.

The Hungarian is government is doing two things, as already mentioned playing on nationalistic feelings and exploiting the current geopolitical situation.

Hungarians still have a hard time accepting Malev is gone, but Hungarian travellers don't really care what flag is above the registration markings of an aircraft, they care about $.

If this deal goes through, which it might. I feel sorry for the people who will once again (post-Solyom) let their love of aviation overrule their sense of realism and apply to work at this "airline", only to see their dreams crushed a few months or years later.

KrisYYZ
 
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Faro
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:03 pm

Unless the Russians get more from the SSJ sales than from financing the airline it doesn't make sense. Russia is bleeding foreign currency reserves by the hour.


Faro
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dean
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:08 pm

I can't see this happening. And even if it does, what kind of airline is it going to be with 6 regional jets? Oh wait, maybe it's supposed to be a domestic airline to compensate the recently downgraded Hungarian railway services?
 
finnishway
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 4:33 pm

Sorry for off-topic, but does SSJ100 have ETOPS?
 
B777LRF
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Wed Feb 10, 2016 5:07 pm

With traffic set for growth, there's nothing in principal against starting an airline based in BUD. It's a tough market, sure, but it's not impossible if you offer good fares in an attractive schedule with service just a notch above the competition. Neither is there anything inherently wrong with the SSJ100; for what it's worth, all the rumours on the street has it as a solid little performer. Initial support issues are largely a thing of the past, and the little jet just trundles along doing it's job.

So it's not the idea, nor the aircraft. The problem, if you will, is that the idea is seemingly not backed by a solid business plan, rather by a nationalistic craving for a flag carrier and a political wish to form closer bonds with Russia.

Under the current Hungarian government I can see it happen, but I can also see that it won't be long before the upstart will coming running to the government asking for more money. This will inevitably lead to a tug-of-war against the EU and the anti-EU Hungarian government over allowed subsidies, or rather the absence thereof. If the EU bows out, and that's almost a given due to its institutional lack of testicular fortitude, that will open a can of subsidy worms so large, it'll make the current ME3 debate look like a mundane punctuation error.

Regardless, I quite like the SSJ.
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mrcomet
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RE: SSJ100 For Hungary National Carrier

Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:39 am

The way it will work is they start up the airline, pay all big upfront costs, pay off large parts of the airplanes, announce they are making huge losses and then privatize it and sell it for pennies on the dollar. These deals are long-term. But corrupt politicians don't make good airline operators and it will fail eventually but maybe not before we get to fly an SSJ.  
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