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LAXintl
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3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:09 am

Long Beach received total of 20 new slot request from 3 airlines for 9 newly available slots ( LGB To Receive 8-9 Additional Air Carrier Slots (by LAXintl Dec 1 2015 in Civil Aviation) )

Both JetBlue and Southwest applied for all 9 available new slots, while Delta applied for 2.

As request new slots exceeds the available count, the city utilized a round-robin slot allocation method which awarded Southwest 4 slots, Jetblue 3 and Delta 2.

Carriers have up to 180 days from the point of notification to begin operations.

Three Airlines Receive Nine Slots At Long Beach Airport
http://www.gazettes.com/news/three-a...c-d051-11e5-a9b0-dbb200c0468c.html

=

Lets see what schedules the airlines publish now.

[Edited 2016-02-10 17:24:28]
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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enilria
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RE: 3 Airlines Receive LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:14 am

Wow, I hadn't followed this. WN would probably be smart to run 4x to OAK, but that's only if the goal is to make the most money.  
 
N1120A
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RE: 3 Airlines Receive LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:16 am

Wow. Shocking that WN wants to open a station with so few flights. I suppose OAK, LAS or PHX are the most likely candidates. I wonder if it will be all to one or split.
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LAXintl
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RE: 3 Airlines Receive LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:18 am

Coming to LGB would be very far outside the SWA model.

Mere 4 flights per day hardly lends itself to much schedule competitiveness in LA-Bay area market, nor does it provide for much cost efficiency in regards to station staffing and overhead.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
Sightseer
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:22 am

I wonder if WN will bother starting service with only four daily flights. When was the last time they started that low in any non-FL market?
 
asteriskceo
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:25 am

Snatching up LGB slots before the B6 merger is announced.   
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:31 am

So glad this happened!

Now maybe B6 will get up off its behind at LGB. You're gonna sit on a bunch of slots? Here comes WN  
 
usflyguy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:35 am

Quoting Sightseer (Reply 4):
I wonder if WN will bother starting service with only four daily flights. When was the last time they started that low in any non-FL market?

AUA, MBJ, BZE, LIR, SJO, PVR, SJD. Those are all international, but they are stations with very few flights.

CRP, a longtime WN station, is now alternating between 3 and 4 daily flights... all to HOU.
My post is my ideas and my opinions only, I do not represent the ideas or opinions of anyone else or company.
 
dbo861
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:39 am

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 3):
Coming to LGB would be very far outside the SWA model.

Mere 4 flights per day hardly lends itself to much schedule competitiveness in LA-Bay area market, nor does it provide for much cost efficiency in regards to station staffing and overhead.

The question is, will WN take these slots? They were looking for 9, but were only awarded 4. They could very easily say thanks but no thanks to the slots if they don't think 4 flights are worth opening a new city. On the other hand, WN has changed over the years, especially since the merger. They have several cities with only 4 or fewer flights to 1-2 destinations.
 
usflyguy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:43 am

Nevermind, DL only wanted 2 slots..

[Edited 2016-02-10 17:44:47]
My post is my ideas and my opinions only, I do not represent the ideas or opinions of anyone else or company.
 
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Jamake1
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:43 am

Here's Southwest's press release:

They intend to serve LGB...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/southw...-intends-serve-long-005700449.html

[Edited 2016-02-10 17:46:06]
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toltommy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:48 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 2):
Wow. Shocking that WN wants to open a station with so few flights
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 3):
Coming to LGB would be very far outside the SWA model.
Quoting Sightseer (Reply 4):
I wonder if WN will bother starting service with only four daily flights.
Quoting dbo861 (Reply 8):
They have several cities with only 4 or fewer flights to 1-2 destinations.

Thanks dbo861, funny how some people think WN still opens stations the same way they did in 1989. They'll open the station with 4 flights to one destination (likely OAK), and outsource the work to a vendor to keep costs in line. Look at what they did in RIC, there's your example, and your model.
A300/A310/A319/A320/A321/A332/A333/707/712/727/732/733/734/735/738/739/752/753/762/763/764/772/789/DC8/DC9-10/30/40/50/MD81/83/87/88/90/L1011-/250/500/CRJ200/440/700/900/EMB135/140/145/170/175/190/328Jet/F70/SF3/BE1/J31
 
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LAXintl
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:50 am

Quoting Jamake1 (Reply 10):

Here's Southwest's press release:

They intend to serve LGB...

That press release was issued earlier today after the airline applied for slots (9), and not after the lottery award this evening of 4.

Whether they take up the 4 slots, or say forget it, lets see.

Note the press release only talks about desire to serve the airport, and confirming they applied for the slots. Nothing about being awarded slots.

[Edited 2016-02-10 17:51:57]
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
travelin man
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:55 am

My guess:
2x OAK
2x PHX
 
Wingtips56
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:59 am

Can they squeeze another flight into DAL? DAL-LGB?
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

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airliner371
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:59 am

My guess is Delta adds SEA, WN will probably do 4x OAK but I could see them adding DEN too.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 12):
That press release was issued earlier today after the airline applied for slots (9), and not after the lottery award this evening of 4.

The press release says it was released an hour ago.

[Edited 2016-02-10 18:00:31]
 
wnflyguy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:03 am

I'm going to go with 2SFO 1DEN And 1 LAS.

Aircraft flow LGB-SFO-LGB-LAS-LGB-DEN-LGB-SFO-LGB
All 737-800

Flyguy

[Edited 2016-02-10 18:07:33]

[Edited 2016-02-10 18:12:01]
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
asteriskceo
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:10 am

I'm going with 2x OAK or SFO, 1x MDW 1x HOU
 
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lightsaber
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:21 am

Quoting Sightseer (Reply 4):
I wonder if WN will bother starting service with only four daily flights. When was the last time they started that low in any non-FL market?

I hope WN does serve LGB. I LOVE the airport!!!

I prefer B6, but their refusal to build a mid-America hub means about half my domestic flights must be with another airline. I'm not flying LGB-TPA/JAX, or MIA via BOS or JFK.

Lightsaber
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mtnwest1979
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:39 am

I would go 1x DAL 1x MDW 2x DEN. Exclusive carrier in each market to 3 large hubs.
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wnflyguy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:52 am

The flight schedule will be released on the 18th I predict.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
jetbluefan1
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:53 am

Very surprising B6 bothered applying given they are not even using all of their slots. But I suppose it's better to squat rather than let more competition in. I wonder where the 3x will go...maybe we'll see them add PHX, RNO or ABQ?

WN with 4x is interesting. I would bet the flights will focus on markets which do not overlap with B6 - most likely DEN, MDW, or DAL. 2 of the 3, perhaps.
 
crazytoaster
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:05 am

Interesting. For WN I would predict 3x OAK and 1x DEN. Keep that intra Cali flying going and provide the best connection option to the rest of their network.

Quoting jetbluefan1 (Reply 21):
Very surprising B6 bothered applying given they are not even using all of their slots. But I suppose it's better to squat rather than let more competition in. I wonder where the 3x will go...maybe we'll see them add PHX, RNO or ABQ?

Not really sure what B6 would do.
DEN homebase. Frequent traveler to IND and RNO.
 
JetBlueCLT
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:40 am

I'm thinking B6 will add 2X LGB-DEN 2X LGB-PHX.

I know that more slots than they were awarded but I understand B6 isn't currently using all there slots.

Even a redeye to MCO/FLL would be great.
Pittsburgh Penguins, Steelers, Pirates and Charlotte Hornets Fan
 
jetbluefan1
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:44 am

Quoting JetBlueCLT (Reply 23):
Even a redeye to MCO/FLL would be great.

The more I think about it, the more I think this will happen. Fuel is so cheap that it's very low risk to re-introduce FLL and introduce MCO - two B6 focus cities. It also makes strategic sense, given that there are connection opportunities on both ends.
 
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lightsaber
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:02 am

Quoting JetBlueCLT (Reply 23):
Even a redeye to MCO/FLL would be great.

Or LGB-TPA!   

Quoting jetbluefan1 (Reply 24):
The more I think about it, the more I think this will happen. Fuel is so cheap that it's very low risk to re-introduce FLL and introduce MCO - two B6 focus cities. It also makes strategic sense, given that there are connection opportunities on both ends.

Oh, you're being logical and ruining my hopes for a flight I'd use.  

Lightsaber
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BoeingGuy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:34 am

It appears that AS has no intention of resuming LGB-SEA even with the E175s.

Quoting airliner371 (Reply 15):
My guess is Delta adds SEA,

If DL were to add SEA-LGB that would give them a domestic destination from SEA that AS doesn't serve.

Quoting asteriskceo (Reply 17):
I'm going with 2x OAK or SFO, 1x MDW 1x HOU

Not one person has predicted that WN would start SJC-LGB, which I think would be a viable candidate.
 
dbo861
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:57 am

Quoting jetbluefan1 (Reply 21):
Very surprising B6 bothered applying given they are not even using all of their slots. But I suppose it's better to squat rather than let more competition in.

What's even more surprising is that they were even awarded slots given that they aren't even using all of the slots they own. You'd think that the powers that be would take that into consideration. WN would most likely use all of the slots they were awarded. Maybe 7 slots to WN and 2 to DL.
 
Sightseer
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:12 am

Quoting usflyguy (Reply 7):
AUA, MBJ, BZE, LIR, SJO, PVR, SJD. Those are all international, but they are stations with very few flights.

IIRC many of those were started by FL. And I guess I was thinking more about domestic markets. I'm aware that a few are currently served with 4 or so daily flights, but how many opened that way? I think that could tell us more than the INTL markets can.
 
n562wn
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:39 am

Quoting Sightseer (Reply 28):
IIRC many of those were started by FL. And I guess I was thinking more about domestic markets. I'm aware that a few are currently served with 4 or so daily flights, but how many opened that way? I think that could tell us more than the INTL markets can.

Hmm, why did WN and B6, try to make an agreement outside of the current pilot contract to allow "distressed" passengers to fly on each other's metal? Why the drastic change in language about subsets and redeye flying in the failed TA with the pilots? Why the sudden interest in a whopping 4 slots at LGB after all these years? Just greasing the skids for the B6/WN merger.. Nothing more to see here.   
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
wnflyguy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:45 am

I see DL adding 1 ATL and 1 SEA flight.

I see B6 adding back ORD service 2 daily and 1 RNO.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
QANTAS747-438
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:50 am

Aren't 4 slots the same as 2 flights? One in and One out (2 slots)
My posts/replies are strictly my opinion and not that of any company, organization, or Southwest Airlines.
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:50 am

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 26):
If DL were to add SEA-LGB that would give them a domestic destination from SEA that AS doesn't serve.

I think it would be a feather in their cap to fly a non-AS route out of SEA, but it would be a lower yield route and probably not a super good use of their limited gate space at SEA.

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wnflyguy
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:54 am

[quote=QANTAS747-438,reply=31][/quot

LGB classify it's slots as one total round trip each.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
asteriskceo
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 7:34 am

How does the airport decide who to allocate slots to? Why would they give more to jetBlue who is squatting on slots and shrinking their operation? Just curious...
 
bjorn14
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 10:57 am

Quoting JetBlueCLT (Reply 23):
Quoting asteriskceo (Reply 34):

LGB says you have to use the slots 50% of the time to keep the slots.
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
HPRamper
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 11:37 am

Are cargo flights at LGB exempt from the slot process, or do cargo carriers need to apply the same as any other airline?
 
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N776AU
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:05 pm

Quoting wnflyguy (Reply 30):
I see DL adding 1 ATL and 1 SEA flight.

Delta used to fly LGB-ATL didn't they?
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jfklganyc
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:07 pm

Quoting asteriskceo (Reply 34):
How does the airport decide who to allocate slots to? Why would they give more to jetBlue who is squatting on slots and shrinking their operation? Just curious...

That is the Million dollar question isn't it?
 
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LAXintl
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:24 pm

Quoting QANTAS747-438 (Reply 31):
Aren't 4 slots the same as 2 flights? One in and One out (2 slots)

Slots at LGB (and other airports like SNA) come in pair. 4 slots = 4 arrival and 4 departures

Quoting asteriskceo (Reply 34):
How does the airport decide who to allocate slots to? Why would they give more to jetBlue who is squatting on slots and shrinking their operation? Just curious...

Since there was excess demand for available slots, the airport uses and establish rotational allocation which awards the slots.

Also lets be clear, JetBlue is not violating anything and is in full compliance with slot regulations so no reason why it should be denied more. Yes it under utilizes what it can theoretically operate, but fully within policy.

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 35):
LGB says you have to use the slots 50% of the time to keep the slots.

Actual needed annual usage is closer to 2/3 use. Between day of week changes, seasonal cancellations it can be less during winter months, but rises for summers.

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 36):

Are cargo flights at LGB exempt from the slot process, or do cargo carriers need to apply the same as any other airline?

Yes schedule cargo requires a slot also. Both FedEx and UPS each hold a single slot.

Quoting N776AU (Reply 37):
Delta used to fly LGB-ATL didn't they?

JetBlue certainly did. Dont recall DL.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
Midex717
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:33 pm

My guess would be........2x PHX, 1x DEN and 1x LAS.
 
N1120A
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:01 pm

Quoting toltommy (Reply 11):
Thanks dbo861, funny how some people think WN still opens stations the same way they did in 1989

I'm thinking more recently
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
richierich
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:51 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 39):
JetBlue certainly did. Dont recall DL.

Correct. DL has never served ATL-LGB to my knowledge.
When B6 added LGB-ATL, Delta responded by dumping capacity on ATL-LAX, followed by the introduction of FL on that route.
None shall pass!!!!
 
rbavfan
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:07 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 39):
JetBlue certainly did. Dont recall DL.

jetBlue has never served Atlanta from any location. Its been listed as a hole in there east coast operations for a long time. Mind you do you want to compete with Delta on ATL-MCO/ATL-FLL or ATL-JFK? Delta would take a loss to keep them out.
 
mtnwest1979
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:12 pm

Quoting Sightseer (Reply 28):
Quoting usflyguy (Reply 7):AUA, MBJ, BZE, LIR, SJO, PVR, SJD. Those are all international, but they are stations with very few flights.
Quoting Sightseer (Reply 28):
IIRC many of those were started by FL. And I guess I was thinking more about domestic markets. I'm aware that a few are currently served with 4 or so daily flights, but how many opened that way? I think that could tell us more than the INTL markets can.

BZE LIR PVR and SJO are WN adds, others are former FL openings.
Riddle: Which lasts longer, a start-up airline or a start-up football league?
 
N757ST
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:13 pm

Quoting rbavfan (Reply 43):
jetBlue has never served Atlanta from any location. Its been listed as a hole in there east coast operations for a long time. Mind you do you want to compete with Delta on ATL-MCO/ATL-FLL or ATL-JFK? Delta would take a loss to keep them out.

Jetblue did indeed serve ATL from long beach.
 
FlyPNS1
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:14 pm

Quoting rbavfan (Reply 43):
jetBlue has never served Atlanta from any location

Jetblue flew both ATL-OAK and ATL-LGB. They abandoned them both pretty quickly.
 
n515cr
Posts: 1692
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 1:49 am

RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:21 pm

Quoting rbavfan (Reply 43):
jetBlue has never served Atlanta from any location. Its been listed as a hole in there east coast operations for a long time. Mind you do you want to compete with Delta on ATL-MCO/ATL-FLL or ATL-JFK? Delta would take a loss to keep them out.

B6 did fly LGB-ATL and apparently OAK-ATL (never knew about that one). Both discontinued in 2003: http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/trave...oday/2003-11-07-archiveoct24_x.htm

Pretty sure DL has never flown LGB-ATL...if they did, it was pre-2002.
 
ont 737
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:39 pm

With LAX and SNA getting closer to capacity, it makes sense for WN to serve LGB in the long term.

It will be interesting to see how B6 defends its request for additional slots. By my count, the last day they operated all 32 of their slots was September 2, 2012. Their summer 2016 schedule only shows a max of 26 departures (on some days).

Fun trivia:
On 9/2/2012 they operated
1x ANC, AUS, BOS, IAD
2x JFK
3x SEA, SFO, SLC, SMF
4x OAK, PDX
5x LAS
Today 2/11/2016
1x BOS, AUS
2x SMF, SEA, PDX, JFK
3x SLC, SFO, OAK, LAS
 
dc10lover
Posts: 1535
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RE: 3 Airlines Awarded New LGB Slots

Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:46 pm

I am guessing 2 OAK, 1 DEN, 1 HOU
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of. Same with OAK & SJC when it comes to SFO.

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