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cessna53996
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What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 6:48 pm

When the time comes and the E190s need to be replaced, what would B6 replace it with? The C-Series, E190-E2, A319, ...? Would certainly be interesting to find out if/when they do.
 
NASBWI
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 7:15 pm

There have been many rumors circulating around the crew lounges at B6, but *if* it becomes time to replace the E190s, it may be logical to stay with Airbus, and order more 320s (the NEO, by that time). The economics of operating the A320NEO seems justifiable, even with more seats.

As it is now, there are quite a few routes that are served by both aircraft types (both short and medium range). With more A321s coming online, replacing some A320 flying, it frees up a few birds to open new routes for B6. Here, the E190 is an important aircraft. While B6 won't be ordering any more of them, the amount they have will surely meet their needs for years to come. Who knows? By that time, Airbus or Boeing may develop their own "regional" jet (besides shrinking their A32x/737 series).
 
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Boeing778X
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 7:35 pm

How would the E195 E2 work for them?
 
INFINITI329
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 7:48 pm

I think the CS300 compliments the Airbus fleet rather well.
 
flyby519
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 8:38 pm

CS300 would be a nice fit in terms of capacity slotted below the A320 (162 seats). Maybe even add in some CS100s for smaller markets. Somewhere around 130-140 seats for the CS300 and 110-120 seats for the CS100 would be a nice coverage.

110-120seats CS100
130-140 CS300
159 A321 Mint
162 A320
190 A321 high density
 
behramjee
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:01 pm

Quoting flyby519 (Reply 4):
CS300 would be a nice fit in terms of capacity slotted below the A320 (162 seats). Maybe even add in some CS100s for smaller markets. Somewhere around 130-140 seats for the CS300 and 110-120 seats for the CS100 would be a nice coverage.

110-120seats CS100
130-140 CS300
159 A321 Mint
162 A320
190 A321 high density

No need...just the CS 100 is perfect along side the A320/A321s.
 
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Boeing778X
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:05 pm

Quoting flyby519 (Reply 4):
CS300 would be a nice fit in terms of capacity slotted below the A320 (162 seats). Maybe even add in some CS100s for smaller markets. Somewhere around 130-140 seats for the CS300 and 110-120 seats for the CS100 would be a nice coverage.

110-120seats CS100
130-140 CS300
159 A321 Mint
162 A320
190 A321 high density

I like that. Seems like a very comfortable fleet!

Would that work? Will B6's NEOs be CFM or P&W?

[Edited 2016-02-28 13:40:17]
 
flyby519
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:19 pm

Quoting behramjee (Reply 5):
No need...just the CS 100 is perfect along side the A320/A321s.

That might work, I just thought the 110-120seat to 159seat gap might be a bit much.

Quoting Boeing778X (Reply 6):


I like that. Seems like a very comfortable fleet!

Would that work? Will B6's NEOs be CFW or P&W?

The B6 A320NEOs will be P&W powered.
 
AA737-823
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:32 pm

The way things are going in Seattle (er,,, Chicago??) they'll end up with a fleet of free 737-700s!!
 
INFINITI329
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:43 am

Quoting flyby519 (Reply 7):
That might work, I just thought the 110-120seat to 159seat gap might be a bit much.

The gap would be really to 165 seats. As mint is a route specific service. I do agree with you in working the CS100 in the mix as well only I would suspect it would capped at 100 seats though.
 
jetbluefan1
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 12:04 pm

No one has mentioned the E190-E2. Wouldn't it make sense to transition to the newer version of its current E190 fleet instead of switching to a whole new aircraft type? This, of course, is based on the assumption that the E190-E2 has significantly better dispatch rates and fuel burn than the current E190.
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:03 pm

They will not replace it.

They will gradually retire the fleet a LONG time from now and replace them with Airbuses.

They will leave the 100 seat market as most of their routes will perform just fine on the larger Airbus.

The 190 is widely regarded as a mistake.
 
FlyBTV
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:06 pm

I wouldn't be surprised to see them standardize on the A320 line - perhaps add the A319 if they need something a bit smaller. I highly doubt they'd go the route of the E190 E2 - unless the operating economics have significantly changed, B6 was not terribly happy with the economics of the 190 vs the 320.

Of course it is possible that they could go the route of the CS series, but I think given the experience with the 190 there will be a lot of internal resistance to moving away from the tried and true Airbus product, along the benefits of having a relatively standardized fleet.

8-10 years from now I would not be surprised to see the E190 gone in favor of the A319 or A320 and perhaps see the A330neo added on the top end if they decided to get very ambitious.
 
lostsound
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:41 pm

Well we know B6 and Bombardier are in talks. I'd imagine B6 are also talking with Embraer and Airbus.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...alks-on-cseries-order-from-jetblue
 
bjorn14
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:57 pm

I know B6 still has some deferred E190 orders that could be converted to E2s. One of problems for B6 was they were the global launch customer for the E190 and at the time they were a very young airline with not a whole lot of experience.
 
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lightsaber
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:27 pm

Quoting Boeing778X (Reply 2):
How would the E195 E2 work for them?

Very well. The added dozen seats and wing extension change the economics. Perfect for Florida to East of the Mississippi.

Shift to more A321NEOs...

Quoting lostsound (Reply 13):
Well we know B6 and Bombardier are in talks. I'd imagine B6 are also talking with Embraer and Airbus.

B6 is a very desired customer for Embraer, Bombardier, and Airbus will negotiate too. Advantage JetBlue.

I cannot predict anything but a great deal for B6.

And Pratt engine sales.  

GE really should have PIP'd the CF-34-10. Not doing so hurt their reputation. Yes, this means Pratt had better PIP the small purepower core...

Lightsaber
 
flyby519
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:37 pm

Delete please, I had wrong info.

[Edited 2016-02-29 07:08:33]
 
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OzarkD9S
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:00 pm

Quoting lostsound (Reply 13):


Well we know B6 and Bombardier are in talks. I'd imagine B6 are also talking with Embraer and Airbus.

Those 40 Republic Airways orders are most likely going to need a new home. B6 or DL are my hopes for that.
 
bjorn14
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:05 pm

Quoting flyby519 (Reply 16):

E2 will have same type rating as original 190 just a differences course.
 
NoTime
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:13 pm

The incumbent always has an advantage, and for that reason I would expect B6 to take a long look at the 190-E2 or even the 195-E2.

Barring that, I would expect them to all Airbus.
 
MavyWavyATR
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 4:37 pm

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 8):
The way things are going in Seattle (er,,, Chicago??) they'll end up with a fleet of free 737-700s!!

Definitely won't happen. On the types of flights the E190 currently does at B6, the 73G would be a fuel hog, overweight, and uneconomical. Plus, I don't think Jetblue would want to break open the bank again to train crews on a new aircraft that's completely different from their current Airbus & Embraer fleet.

Quoting cessna53996 (Thread starter):
When the time comes and the E190s need to be replaced, what would B6 replace it with?

I think honestly, when the times comes for B6 to replace their early delivery E190's, they'll go for the E190-E2 variant. Reason being is that the E2 shares a common type rating with the current ones and training time & costs would be minimal (Difference is only a max of 3 days, according to Embraer).

Plus, The E190-E2 and the upcoming A320neo's would get along really well in the maintenance department because they basically use the same engine (P&W Geared Turbofan). This would decrease costs significantly since they won't have to stock up parts for each specific engine type in the fleet.
 
flyby519
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 5:02 pm

Quoting MavyWavyATR (Reply 20):
think honestly, when the times comes for B6 to replace their early delivery E190's, they'll go for the E190-E2 variant. Reason being is that the E2 shares a common type rating with the current ones and training time & costs would be minimal (Difference is only a max of 3 days, according to Embraer).

Plus, The E190-E2 and the upcoming A320neo's would get along really well in the maintenance department because they basically use the same engine (P&W Geared Turbofan). This would decrease costs significantly since they won't have to stock up parts for each specific engine type in the fleet.

Doesn't the CSeries also use the same PW GTF?

In the end it would come down to who is more desperate to sell cheaper. And right now Bombardier looks to be really desperate for some sales!
 
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Boeing778X
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 5:26 pm

Just a thought: If Republic does indeed get rid of their 40+40 CS300 order, could B6 potentially pick them up?
 
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lightsaber
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 7:31 pm

Quoting flyby519 (Reply 21):
Doesn't the CSeries also use the same PW GTF?

In the end it would come down to who is more desperate to sell cheaper. And right now Bombardier looks to be really desperate for some sales!

B6 is the 'Belle of the ball.' They well gain great offers. Thus why any choice based on the system economics.

Lightsaber
 
Alias1024
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 7:36 pm

There are good arguments in favor of the E2, the CSeries, and NEO. It all depends on what JetBlue sees as the role for the aircraft and their future needs.

If they feel their current E190 markets can absorb the extra seats, then NEO has a leg up. If they want an efficient 100 seat aircraft for the east coast then the E2 looks likely. If they need a 100 seater and have a business case for adding a bunch of long and thin routes where the A320 is too big, then the CSeries makes sense.
 
Abeam79
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Mon Feb 29, 2016 7:39 pm

Have a hard time thinking b6 will introduce a narrowbody 3rd fleet type. I would surmise they sell the remainder of the E190 slots they have on future orders, and use that to purchase A321neoLR which B6 management has publicly said they really are interested in, even for tatl service.
 
laca773
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Tue Mar 01, 2016 7:23 am

Quoting Abeam79 (Reply 25):
Have a hard time thinking b6 will introduce a narrowbody 3rd fleet type. I would surmise they sell the remainder of the E190 slots they have on future orders, and use that to purchase A321neoLR which B6 management has publicly said they really are interested in, even for tatl service.

Has the E90s been that much of a thorn in B6s side? There are markets that are too large for the 320 most of the year, and then you have high frequency shuttle type markets, JFK-BOS/DCA, etc., where it's good to have a mix of a/c so you can adjust to the demand.
The E2 90/95s sounds like a marked improvement over their current models. Hasn't the range also been increased?
This would be a good a/c for routes like TUS-JFK that proved to be too much for the 320.
If B6 decides not to go with the E2s when it comes time to replace, I definitely could see them going with the A319NEOs as it will give the some flexibility for adjusting capacity to demand, though not a lot. The E2 90/95 a/c would be a great fit, IMO.
 
flyby519
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Tue Mar 01, 2016 2:46 pm

Quoting laca773 (Reply 26):
Has the E90s been that much of a thorn in B6s side?

Not as much right now. The problems came when the 190s were brand new and B6 had to face the teething pains at a financially precarious time in the company history.

Old pilot saying: Don't fly the 'A' model of anything!
 
a380787
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Tue Mar 01, 2016 2:54 pm

Per CAPA, it seems that the recent CS300 is indeed for E190 replacement, even though there's a bit of growth (+39% seats) built into it :

"Mr Rovincescu stated that the first 25 CSeries narrwobodies are replacing Embraer 190s exiting Air Canada’s mainline fleet"

+39% in seats is indeed an aggressive growth target, unless they pare back frequencies to compensate for that. Trading 4x E90 flights for 3x CS300 flights would be essentially flat growth.
 
JFKCMILAXFLL
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Wed Mar 02, 2016 2:02 pm

Simple, they'll just use the A-319s they'll acquire when they merge with VX     
 
laca773
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Wed Mar 02, 2016 4:23 pm

Quoting flyby519 (Reply 27):
Not as much right now. The problems came when the 190s were brand new and B6 had to face the teething pains at a financially precarious time in the company history.

Old pilot saying: Don't fly the 'A' model of anything!

That's what I thought . Introduction of a brand new a/c type will always have teething problems for a while.
 
bjorn14
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RE: What Does B6 Replace The E190 With?

Wed Mar 02, 2016 5:29 pm

Quoting flyby519 (Reply 27):

I heard B6 ground crew had nicknamed them the 'E180' because they'd go out and come right back in.

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