TC957
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Wed Mar 02, 2016 6:10 pm

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 48):
No word how much longer BA will be sticking with 744s on LHR-YVR?

YVR will go A380 from 1st May - this was announced some months ago already.
 
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TedToToe
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Wed Mar 02, 2016 8:06 pm

Quoting RayChuang (Reply 46):
In short, by 2021, the busy JFK-LHR route will be a mix of A35K's with some A388's for the busiest takeoff times.

As Andy33 pointed out, probably not in that timescale, but I do agree that in time a BA A380 (whether it be at T7 or T8) must be a possibility. There is no real need to increase frequency further, so at the popular times upgauging must be an option.
 
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Wed Mar 02, 2016 10:59 pm

Quoting TUGMASTER (Reply 17):
Here's a spanner in the works/ fly in the ointment for you....
Rumour that the LGW 777's may head back to LHR , to be replaced with a mix of 788/789 down at Gatters.!!
?????

Might not be as crazy as it sounds. Thomson are doing a lot of advertising about their use of the Dreamliner on longhaul flights. VS is using a small number of A330s out of LGW too. If VS were to move more A330s to LGW, BA is left using 772s against carriers with aircraft that are more efficient. So using 788s/789s out of LGW could be a way of improving yield in a competitive sector that BA wants to stay in (LGW longhaul has had some interesting growth). The question would be what mix of aircraft - BA only has 8 788s plus 4 more on order. Would it base all 12 at LGW, or split the already small fleet?
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Boeing778X
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:33 am

Quoting RayChuang (Reply 46):
I think BA will likely consider a large A359/A35K buy within the next 3-4 years to replace the 77E and 744 fleets in one fell swoop.

I believe they'll order more A350s regardless. As 747 replacements, sure, but as 777 replacements? They did say the 77Es will hang out for some time, and I'm sure the 77Ws will for longer.

But I do see A350-900s and additional -1000s for BA.
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hkcanadaexpat
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 3:09 am

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 52):
The question would be what mix of aircraft - BA only has 8 788s plus 4 more on order. Would it base all 12 at LGW, or split the already small fleet?

All this talk of sending the 788s from LHR to LGW makes little business sense. Whether LGW ops would be better served by 788s rather than 772s, perhaps but LHR needs all those 12 788s. The reality is there are a number of routes out of LHR that were served by 763s that need the 788s. Namely YUL, YYC, BWI, PHL, MAA, HYD, NAS, etc... These markets are low volume, lower yield and more importantly low-premium. A 3-class 772 is too much capacity and a 4-class 789 is too premium heavy. There is a reason why BA is swapping 4x 789 orders for 788s because there aren't enough aircraft on hand to handle these type of very specific routes.

So talk of taking those 8x 788s away from LHR when in actual terms, BA needs 12 and not 8 of them there makes no sense. i think the focus of the discussion should be what will BA replace the LGW 772s with down the road. 788-789s makes a lot of sense i agree. Whether the competition (VS/TOM) drives this replacement sooner rather than later is certainly a good argument. but from my perspective, if/when BA goes down that road, it certainly won't be stealing the very few 788s from LHR.

A
 
parapente
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 7:06 am

Reply 54
Sounds like BA need a MOM!
But seriously,you make a good point.Guess will have to see whether there is any truth in the rumour.They could split the 12 778's I suppose and/or as the rumour suggests throw in some 789's into Gatwick as well.
 
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scbriml
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:23 am

Quoting parapente (Reply 55):
Sounds like BA need a MOM!

Nah, I really cant see BA operating anything smaller than a 788 on long-haul.
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Andy33
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:55 am

Quoting scbriml (Reply 56):
Nah, I really cant see BA operating anything smaller than a 788 on long-haul.

Well there are the three 757s flying ORY-NYC for BA OpenSkies, but they're pretty much a special case, and I wouldn't rush out and buy Boeing shares on the strength of a replacement order for them!
 
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JerseyFlyer
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 11:05 am

Quoting hkcanadaexpat (Reply 54):
All this talk of sending the 788s from LHR to LGW makes little business sense.

I agree BA needs a small widebody presence at LHR, so I think the 788s will stay there.

It would make sense to me to place the yet-to-be delivered 9-across 7810s at LGW, and transfer the 9-across 772s from LGW to LHR, although these are earmarked for LHR to east coast North America at the moment. The BA LGW operations do not really have a competitor for comfort on the routes they serve, whereas from LHR they do.
 
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Richard28
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 11:23 am

Quoting Andy33 (Reply 57):
Well there are the three 757s flying ORY-NYC for BA OpenSkies, but they're pretty much a special case

Don't forget the A318's out of LCY!

but I agree I doubt the MOM would be on BA's agenda
 
richardw
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 12:48 pm

I think BA has to decide if it is going to be a long haul narrow seat economy airline or not, if it isn't, then change the current B787s to 2-4-2.
 
parapente
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 2:08 pm

"I think BA has to decide if it is going to be a long haul narrow seat economy airline or not, if it isn't, then change the current B787s to 2-4-2."

Bold idea! But too late and too expensive for the 8's and 9's. But for the 10's (which will be on some premium routes).Yes personally I would do it. 18" economy X 8 and 18.5 X 8 for Y plus. Would give them a real edge and match well with the 350's they have on order.
 
MPadhi
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 3:56 pm

Quoting parapente (Reply 61):
Would give them a real edge and match well with the 350's they have on order.

Don't BA use exactly the same seats on all their longhaul aircraft?
 
jumpjets
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 4:21 pm

The introduction of super hi J 744s adds an interesting element to their future fleet replacement plans.

I assume that BA has increased the J cabin to 86 seats because there is a real need and not just to provide upgrades to frequent flyers and therefore any replacements for them will require a similar sized J cabin- which then begs the question as to when these newly refurbished 744s finally fly off into the desert which of the new generation of aircraft [apart from the A380] has the floorspace for a 4 class service including a similar number of J seats as the super hi J 744s.

Is this where the 778/9 or A350-1100 might come into play? I don't see the 787-10 being big enough to accommodate that many J seats and an economic number of F/Y+/Y seats.
 
AirbusA6
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 4:21 pm

Quoting MPadhi (Reply 62):
Quoting parapente (Reply 61):
Would give them a real edge and match well with the 350's they have on order.

Don't BA use exactly the same seats on all their longhaul aircraft?

But presumably with wider cabins they'd have wider armrests, which in terms of comfort has much the same effect as a wider seat?

For example the 777 is considerably wider than the 787, and you're not going to use all that space on a massive aisle!

Quoting parapente (Reply 61):
"I think BA has to decide if it is going to be a long haul narrow seat economy airline or not, if it isn't, then change the current B787s to 2-4-2."

Bold idea! But too late and too expensive for the 8's and 9's. But for the 10's (which will be on some premium routes).Yes personally I would do it. 18" economy X 8 and 18.5 X 8 for Y plus. Would give them a real edge and match well with the 350's they have on order.

Boeing picked a cabin width that makes 8Y really hard to justify. For airlines who don't want 9Y on the 787, I guess the best best is not to buy the 787! SQ for example have sent all their 787s to Scoot
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parapente
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 4:55 pm

Reply 64
For example the 777 is considerably wider than the 787, and you're not going to use all that space on a massive aisle!

The 777's are X9 (and 18"plus seats) , the 787's could reduce to X8 at 18" (as opposed to the X9 -17" they are now doing)

"Boeing picked a cabin width that makes 8Y really hard to justify. For airlines who don't want 9Y on the 787, I guess the best best is not to buy the 787! SQ for example have sent all their 787s to Scoot"

The negative feedback BA has had from customers on X9 has only arisen 'after' they have gone into service (of course).So they have already committed - cant give 'em back now. Hence the discussion as to whether they are now trying to 'push' as many 787's as possible to Gatwick where customer expectations (holidays etc) are lower. And bring back the 777's with the wider seats.

Others have pointed out however that some 787-8's will be required to remain at Heathrow for specific destinations - particularly replacing the 767's (which had narrower seats- than 772's- anyway).Hence less of an issue for their customers on these specific routes.
 
AirbusA6
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 6:00 pm

Quoting parapente (Reply 65):
The 777's are X9 (and 18"plus seats) , the 787's could reduce to X8 at 18" (as opposed to the X9 -17" they are now doing)

The 8Y 787 is nearer 19 inches than 18! I can understand why airlines wouldn't have such a generous Y seat, which is a consequence of the width Boeing chose

Quoting parapente (Reply 65):
Others have pointed out however that some 787-8's will be required to remain at Heathrow for specific destinations - particularly replacing the 767's (which had narrower seats- than 772's- anyway).Hence less of an issue for their customers on these specific routes.

The 767 seats don't feel so bad as there is only 1 middle seat. 4 out of the 7 seats are aisle seats, and as the aisle aren't the puny ones on 10Y 777s, shoulder room is decent.
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Sooner787
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 6:21 pm

Anybody have insight on why BA has 2 of their 789's at Everett
going into what appears to be short term storage?
 
Andy33
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Thu Mar 03, 2016 7:35 pm

Quoting Sooner787 (Reply 67):
Anybody have insight on why BA has 2 of their 789's at Everett
going into what appears to be short term storage?

Well, all six that have already been delivered flew in passenger service yesterday, so this could only involve planes that Boeing hasn't yet delivered. There does seem to be something odd happening, in that BA always applies for registrations in sequence with the makers production number, but while the first 6 were delivered in registration order, the order will be all over the place for the next few months.
G-ZBKG would normally be the next delivery, but in fact BKI will arrive next, later this month, then BKJ, BKH, BKK, BKL, BKM in that order, and only then BKG, in August.
 
richardw
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Fri Mar 04, 2016 12:51 pm

Quoting parapente (Reply 61):
"I think BA has to decide if it is going to be a long haul narrow seat economy airline or not, if it isn't, then change the current B787s to 2-4-2."

Bold idea! But too late and too expensive for the 8's and 9's. But for the 10's (which will be on some premium routes).Yes personally I would do it. 18" economy X 8 and 18.5 X 8 for Y plus. Would give them a real edge and match well with the 350's they have on order.

My view is that it's an expensive mistake for the 8's and 9's. Hey let's not forget BA does expensive mistakes though.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Fri Mar 04, 2016 1:06 pm

Quoting JerseyFlyer (Reply 58):
The BA LGW operations do not really have a competitor for comfort on the routes they serve, whereas from LHR they do.

Just about every LGW route has VS flying on it as well.

Quoting jumpjets (Reply 63):
I assume that BA has increased the J cabin to 86 seats because there is a real need and not just to provide upgrades to frequent flyers

The consensus is that you have more chance of seeing Shergar riding past with Lord Lucan in the saddle, than getting an upgrade from BA.
 
 
parapente
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Fri Mar 04, 2016 1:36 pm

Reply 66
"The 8Y 787 is nearer 19 inches than 18! I can understand why airlines wouldn't have such a generous Y seat, which is a consequence of the width Boeing chose"

Well... no they are not (19 ins).They were originally advertised (in the 2X4X2 config) as 18.5 inch seats which (granted) they deff' can do.IE the same as the A380.

But yes you lose some potential Y pax numbers no doubt about that.The question (which only BA can answer) is whether their 'Y' is totally commodity oriented or not.If so this would mean that BA is not a brand and has no 'brand value' (for Y customers).

It's just a personal view but from the people I know - it does have brand value.
People would prefer to fly them (particularly with so many airlines going 'super economy') and they would pay a bit more to have more. The key is (IMHO) 'how much more' ie the' price elasticity' of the product.

I am sure BA does a lot of research around this key factor.Who knows, those 2 787's in Boeing 'storage' may be waiting for new seats?

BTW The reason I suggested 18" for Y is so that it would match their offering on the A350's.(OK the 2 aisles would be 2" wider than strictly necessary - but hey. This then would allow 18.5 for Y+ and no loss of additional seating.
But it's all a guess really.Will have to see what they do.
 
pnwtraveler
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Sat Mar 05, 2016 8:01 pm

I would be interested to know by how the new aircraft balance in number of seats vs. what BA had. I suspect in replacing the 763's with B788 and the addition of so many A350, plus the 789,7810 it all adds up to a lot more lift even with the retirement of the 744's. How much more lift that is necessary beyond that I think will determine the A388 additional orders or not.

With so many airlines (AF) struggling with using their A388 effectively, if BA needs some it might be possible to get them used IF they aren't overly customized. The massive customization that airlines were allowed to do within the program I think will turn out to be a problem for resale then if the A380's were built to more of a standard. For example who wants to take an A380 from EK if you have the weight and space used by a shower etc. if you don't want that in your amenities. With airlines limiting newspapers on board to reduce waste and weight, going to large bottles of juice and water to save weight and fuel you don't want to drag around an extra water tank and plumbing if you don't use the shower.

An airline doesn't want to add too many seats to fast and find itself with way too much capacity when the industry is so cyclical. That is the test in the industry is what capacity to forego in order to manage risk.
 
vv701
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Sun Mar 06, 2016 3:21 pm

Quoting pnwtraveler (Reply 72):
I would be interested to know by how the new aircraft balance in number of seats

While we know the cabin configurations of BA's 787-8s (J35 / W25 / Y154 for a total of 214) and 9s (F8 / J42 / W39 / Y127 for a total of 216) and their A380s (F14 / J97 / W55 / Y303 for a total of 469), I am not aware that BA have as yet revealed the cabin configuration of either their 787-10s or their 350s.

However they have stated that revenue per square metre from their F Class cabin is lower than from either their J, W or Y class cabins. This is reflected in the configuration of their 787-8s. That type's eight seat F Class cabin is the smallest of any four-class configured type they have operated and a lot smaller than the 17 F Class seats in their small fleet of three 772As.

Note also that BA's 380s have just 14 F Class seats out of a total of 469 while they are currently reconfiguring eighteen 744s into their new 'Super Hi J' configuration of F14 / J86 / W30 / Y145 for a total of only 275 seats. This is a reduction of 24 seats compared to the previous configuration of these aircraft.

So it looks as if BA are moving in the direction of a smaller proportion of F Class seats, a larger proportion of J Class seats and a smaller proportion of Y Class seats in their four-class long-haul fleet. But we will have to wait and see if this perception is correct.

Like many other airlines BA offers heavily discounted fares on long-haul flights from LHR for passengers willing to fly from primarilly European airports to LHR where they transfer to BA long-haul flights. This enables them to fill seats but protect yields from tickets starting and finishing at LHR. If we assume that most of these discounted tickets are price-conscious Y Class travellers and few are not-so-price-conscious J Class passengers then we might see more of the same particularly as the long-haul LCCs attack the price-sensitive end of the market.
 
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readytotaxi
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Sun Mar 06, 2016 3:34 pm

Somewhere here I read that BA was reducing Club World on the LGW 777's, the holiday fleet, next year.
Are they planning on making the smaller Club cabin into Premium Y ?
I have found that this cabin is usually better than 60% full on my trips x6 each year.


 
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GSTBA
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Sun Mar 06, 2016 9:48 pm

Quoting hkcanadaexpat (Reply 54):
The reality is there are a number of routes out of LHR that were served by 763s that need the 788s. Namely YUL, YYC, BWI, PHL, MAA, HYD, NAS, etc... These markets are low volume, lower yield and more importantly low-premium. A 3-class 772 is too much capacity and a 4-class 789 is too premium heavy.

NAS is moving to the 3 class 772 from July
 
GSTBA
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Sun Mar 06, 2016 10:38 pm

Quoting Andy33 (Reply 57):
Well there are the three 757s flying ORY-NYC for BA OpenSkies, but they're pretty much a special case, and I wouldn't rush out and buy Boeing shares on the strength of a replacement order for them!

Nor would I. In fact I think the A321LR is the likely replacement for the BA Openskies fleet
 
mwhcvt
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Sun Mar 06, 2016 11:35 pm

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 76):

Or closing it down! How much if any profit does it make? To be honest I only ever think about BAOS when I occasionally see one on FR24

It will only make sense to replace the fleet with new A321LR if the airline is make sufficient profit to generate an ROI
Must think up a new one soon, slow moving brain trying to get into gear ;)
 
hkcanadaexpat
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:39 am

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 75):
NAS is moving to the 3 class 772 from July

Because there aren't any 788 available. Upon delivery of the 4 new 788s, you can bet this is going to be a 788 route.
A
 
Andy33
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 7:05 am

Don't forget the seven A321ceo which form what BA calls the mid-haul fleet, complete with lie-flat seats in J.
They'll need replacing in some form or other eventually. Two were to have been converted to short haul config this winter, but it hasn't happened. Whether this is down to a change of plan, late delivery of seats, or shortage of aircraft(or hangar capacity) preventing them being taken out of service for refitting, I don't know. It's possible that the 4 conversions from 789 to 788 have something to do with the A321s, though on balance it probably doesn't.

[Edited 2016-03-06 23:18:34]
 
Tristarsteve
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 9:59 am

Quoting Andy33 (Reply 79):
Don't forget the seven A321ceo which form what BA calls the mid-haul fleet, complete with lie-flat seats in J.
They'll need replacing in some form or other eventually

There are seven A321neo on order.

Quoting Andy33 (Reply 79):
Two were to have been converted to short haul config this winter, but it hasn't happened.

They are operating European routes this summer anyway, There are two flights every week to ARN complete with sleeper seats in Club  
 
hkcanadaexpat
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 10:09 am

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 80):
There are seven A321neo on order.

I thought the 7x A321neo were to replace the 7x short-haul 767s due for retirement in 2017-18?
A
 
Egerton
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 11:23 am

Quoting VV701 (Reply 73):
While we know the cabin configurations of BA's 787-8s (J35 / W25 / Y154 for a total of 214) and 9s (F8 / J42 / W39 / Y127 for a total of 216)

Agreed. But additional thoughts. The original batch of 787-8 have the 9 abreast original tight-fit Y. The later 787-9 have the wide-fit seats in Y, with wider (but still less than 18 inch) seats and presumably narrower aisles, still at 9 abreast.

I wonder if BA have now made their mind up on which is the best fit for them? Maybe they will configure the new yet to be delivered -8s with the wide-fit Y? If so, they might well re-configure the original tight-fit Y to the later wide-fit Y?
 
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JerseyFlyer
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 11:51 am

Quoting Egerton (Reply 82):
The original batch of 787-8 have the 9 abreast original tight-fit Y. The later 787-9 have the wide-fit seats in Y, with wider (but still less than 18 inch) seats and presumably narrower aisles, still at 9 abreast.

Does anyone know what they have actually done to achieve the "wider" seats in the -9? The change represents BA's acknowledgement of a problem. If it solves the problem, well and good. If it does not, a solution may require reconfiguring to 8-across, which will impact the business case for purchasing the 787 fleet, and inform future decisions on option conversions.
 
Egerton
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 12:22 pm

Quoting JerseyFlyer (Reply 83):

I had taken it for granted that the BA future fleet will exclude taking up of any more 787 options, and no new new orders.
This because of the seating issues. Why buy more problems when you can buy A330 neo and A350 with sensible seat widths for European and other non-Asians customers?
 
BA174
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 12:59 pm

I thought 767s leaving the mainline fleet had been discussed as a possibility at OpenSkies?
 
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817Dreamliiner
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:11 pm

Quoting JerseyFlyer (Reply 83):

Its not as hard as you probably think it is. They can theoretically make it 18 inches at 9 abreast if they really wanted too, but of course the extra space has to come from somewhere. My calculations used 17 inch aisles and 1.5 inch armrests.
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vv701
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 4:29 pm

Is the Y Class seat width on BA's 787-8s 17.2 inches but 17.7 inches on their787-9s?
 
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JerseyFlyer
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 4:35 pm

Quoting Egerton (Reply 84):
the BA future fleet will exclude taking up of any more 787 options, and no new new orders.
This because of the seating issues.

Is the feedback that bad?
 
AirbusA6
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 8:54 pm

You can make the seat wider, but if that's at the expense of a narrower armrest, then in the real world there's no actual benefit!
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817Dreamliiner
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 9:07 pm

Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 89):
but if that's at the expense of a narrower armrest, then in the real world there's no actual benefit!

Tell that to Airbus...
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Egerton
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Mon Mar 07, 2016 10:07 pm

Quoting JerseyFlyer (Reply 88):
Is the feedback that bad?

A long while ago, I was listening to the verbal exchanges on a BA recording of a results presentation or other formal meeting with outsiders. In answer to a question, a chief, think it was Mr Walsh, said to the effect that the 787-8 Y seats were too narrow, and the main problem was lifting yourself out of them. I was shocked by the actuality and tone of this comment. There had been widespread complaints, it was said. Separately, the electronic boxes on the -8 destroy leg room on some seats as is well known.

It is known that BA cabin crews listen to customers and report upwards. These crews have a high opinion of the work they do, and take pride in the service they provide. Rightly so. They do not take kindly to being let down by bad decisions from some idiots above.

BA must have jumped about a very great deal to get new arrangements on the -9 in the limited time available. I have not seen any feedback on these -9 arrangements, which is not a good sign. If everything in the garden was good, we should have heard by now. Maybe there are difficulties with the narrow trolleys in narrow aisles ?

On gaining of seat width at the seat cushion, this is half the story. The other half is shoulder width. Mess with either and non-Asians will know the difference. The places where width can be saved is from the aisle, or perhaps from cabin walls.

The totality of the above results in my opinion that IAG-BA will take as few 787 as it can. I may be wrong.
 
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JerseyFlyer
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 1:42 pm

Quoting Egerton (Reply 91):
IAG-BA will take as few 787 as it can.

I wonder if they may eventually find a home at Vueling, should they want to expand the LCC model to long haul a la Norwegian?
 
jumpjets
Posts: 1435
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:17 pm

RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 1:59 pm

I read regular negative feedback on BAs 9 abreast 787s but not so much about other carriers who also have nine abreast on their 787s - is there something peculiar about the BA fleet that makes the experience that much worse than others. Maybe part of the issue is that BA passengers are used to 9 abreast 777s and notice the difference more than other airlines with 10 abreast 777s?

But going back to the main topic - if the 787 is not the flavour of the month does this mean that future growth in the IAG fleet will focus even more on the A350 which should offer a better 9 across experience.
 
parapente
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:24 pm

Reply 93
Maybe part of the issue is that BA passengers are used to 9 abreast 777s and notice the difference more than other airlines with 10 abreast 777s?

I think that is alot to do with it.But 17" (for that is what it is in reality) is very narrow for a 1st division carrier.
IMHO They should get a great deal on some additional 773's and chop in some of their -10's against it. (but RR would be rather unhappy).WW admitted they were too little too late on the 773's (quite right).
 
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Polot
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:29 pm

I have yet to see any firm evidence that BA is shunning the 787 and won't order anymore other than from some hopeful Airbus fanboys (one of whom basically believes that Boeing should just shut down all commercial aircraft production and become an Airbus supplier or something because of the NEO vs MAX and A350 vs 777X).

BA currently has more 787s on order than they do A350. Yes IAG has more A350s on order than 787- but it is important to keep in mind thate out of the 3 long haul carriers in IAG (EI, IB, BA) two of those (EI, IB) exclusively operate Airbus widebodies...(ignoring EI's leased 757s).

BA's passengers may complain, but have you taken a look at their balance sheet lately? That is all BA/IAG care about in the end. It is not like the Boeing 747 (long a staple of BA's fleet) was known for its fantastically wide Y seats at 10 abreast.
 
Egerton
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RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:53 pm

Quoting Polot (Reply 95):
Boeing should just shut down all commercial aircraft production and become an Airbus supplier

Agreed I have written that. I have also suggested Boeing might have been better not give in to AA but to tell them the NSA would be worth waiting for, instead of the A320 series NEO; and they (Boeing) would not be offering AA or anyone else the Max. I also have suggested that Boeing start the NSA/MOM forthwith or they will loose the narrow body fight for a generation. Also that the 777X was a bad move, getting worse by the day.

You may agree or disagree. We will discover in due course if I am correct or otherwise. If I am completely 100% correct, then Boeing will be out of the commercial airliner business. I get the facts, then get all the facts, then think about it, then decide my position. If my position happens to upset one side or the other, tough.
 
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Polot
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Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:01 pm

RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 3:07 pm

Quoting Egerton (Reply 96):
You may agree or disagree. We will discover in due course if I am correct or otherwise. If I am completely 100% correct, then Boeing will be out of the commercial airliner business. I get the facts, then get all the facts, then think about it, then decide my position. If my position happens to upset one side or the other, tough.

Oh I'm not upset at all, I really don't care about Boeing/Airbus that much, they have zero effect on my life. But it is important for people to recognize your beliefs/mindset/bias when interpreting statements such as:

Quoting Egerton (Reply 84):
I had taken it for granted that the BA future fleet will exclude taking up of any more 787 options, and no new new orders.

and how deciding much of it is actually coming from "all the facts" versus your "position" from "thinking about it."  
 
Egerton
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Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 9:50 am

RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 3:24 pm

Quoting Polot (Reply 97):

Respected A-netter that you are, you will have noted that all the information I have used to reach a particular position has always been clearly set out in my Replies. Simple really. If you do not like what I write, then skip my posts.
 
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sassiciai
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Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 8:26 pm

RE: British Airways Future Fleet

Tue Mar 08, 2016 3:45 pm

BA/IAG would be really stupid if it did not listen to passenger feedback. I'm sure that it does, and I even recall being asked on-line to fill in satisfaction surveys after booking, or by email request after flying. If I take these requests seriously enough to spend a handful of minutes to respond, it's because I believe someone will aggregate all received input and the company will make some real use of it

The "rumours" of customer complaints about the B787 seating may be just that - rumours. I can't point to any source or link or website, but just anecdotally have read such comments on many threads here, and not from just a small hardcore set of "antis". Not limited to BA either - there are many adverse comments about the Qatar experience in Y on their 9-across 787s

Boeing initially offered the 787 as an 8-across aircraft (in the back!), and talked up its comfort features - the 6km atmospheric level, the shades, the mood lighting, etc. This was their killer offer to see off the A330, itself mostly delivered as 8-across at the back. Built to be 8-across with all its other nice new features, this would be great!

Now, most airlines have the 9-across version of the 787 in service/on order. Maybe this move from 8 to 9 was done in face of the commercial competition from the cheaper-to-acquire A330!

I'd love to be corrected on this, and learn which airlines offer just 8-across in Y in their B787s

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