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EZYAirbus
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Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:20 pm

ED FORCE ONE BADLY DAMAGED ON THE GROUND IN COMODORO ARTURO MERINO BENITEZ (SANTIAGO, CHILE) AIRPORT
CONCERTS IN ARGENTINA TOMORROW AND TUESDAY EXPECTED TO GO AHEAD AS PLANNED


Ed Force One was this morning tethered to a tow truck to be taken for refuelling prior to flying over the Andes to Cordoba for the next show. On moving the steering pin that is part of the mechanism that connects the ground tug to the aircraft seemingly fell out. On making a turn the aircraft had no steering and collided with the ground tug badly damaging the undercarriage, two of the aircrafts engines and injuring two ground tug operators, both of whom have been taken to hospital. We hope of course that they make a full and speedy recovery and we will be closely monitoring their progress. The flight engineers are on site and evaluating the damage, but their initial report is that the engines have suffered large damage and will require an extended period of maintenance and possibly two new engines.

We are currently making contingency arrangements to get to the show in Cordoba tomorrow with band, crew and equipment intact. Fortunately the 20 tons of equipment had not been loaded onto Ed Force One at the time of the accident. Although this is tragic for our beautiful plane we do not expect this to affect our concert schedule including the next 2 shows in Cordoba and Buenos Aires. And we hope to find a new Ed Force One to continue this adventure with us in the near future. We will keep everyone updated when we know more, so keep checking only on this site for official news.

To finish on a high note however, our visit to Chile was a huge success with 58,000 fans coming to the show as totally brilliant as ever in the Stadium Nacional last night. We love you guys!

Source : Iron Maiden Website

http://ironmaiden.com/news/article/ed-force-one-damaged
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rlwynn
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:39 pm

Bummer. Poor 747.






.
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keegd76
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 4:06 pm

If they're quick they could nab one of the Air France 747's that have just been retired  
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DocLightning
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 4:07 pm

Ouch:

http://ironmaiden.com/media/images/img_2011.jpg

Looks like it's mostly damage to the cowling and not to the engine itself, I hope. Still going to take a while to fix.

[Edited 2016-03-12 08:08:18]
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bralo20
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 4:17 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 3):
Looks like it's mostly damage to the cowling and not to the engine itself, I hope. Still going to take a while to fix.

Apparently also the gear was damaged when the 747 rolled over the tug, add this to the 2 damaged engines and you have an expensive little crash.

Hope they'll find a replacement (which shouldn't be that hard since it's a "regular 747" (althought it had quite a new interior) compared to the converted 757's they flew before).

Guess the chances for a 747 with the complete decals seem slim though since it took several days to apply them... Maybe a plain white 747 with just Iron Maiden titles?
 
KFLLCFII
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 4:36 pm

More photos here:

http://twitter.com/search?q=ed+force+one

Hard to tell about the undercarriage.
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readytotaxi
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 5:28 pm

"While being towed a steering pin in a tow truck fell out, meaning it colliding with a ground tug as it tried to make a turn."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/articl...maiden-plane-gets-damaged-in-chile

"As for the aircraft the undercarriage is reportedly badly damaged, and two new engines might be needed."

Get well soon people, band say no gig delays.
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DocLightning
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 5:34 pm

Quoting Bralo20 (Reply 4):

Apparently also the gear was damaged when the 747 rolled over the tug, add this to the 2 damaged engines and you have an expensive little crash.

And I just made this face:


That's gonna hurt. This is a charter 744. Is this a W/O?
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crownvic
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 5:49 pm

The one photo of the tug cab ripped apart and torn off with the rescue worker in the orange vest, it looks like a trail of blood on the ground..Pretty serious mishap...

[Edited 2016-03-12 09:51:23]
 
Flaps
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 5:56 pm

The pin "fell out" or was it not put in in the first place?

  
 
JAGflyer
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:01 pm

Would the quickest and easiest (but costly fix) be replacement engine complete with nacelle and cowlings? Fortunately the engine itself doesn't appear to be damaged (beyond perhaps a few blades which are easily replaceable) but you can't be sure until you remove cowlings.
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Heinkel
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:09 pm

Quoting crownvic (Reply 8):
The one photo of the tug cab ripped apart and torn off with the rescue worker in the orange vest, it looks like a trail of blood on the ground..Pretty serious mishap...

Looks more like hydraulic fluid. People injured in an accident usually don't loose so much blood.
 
fbwless
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:13 pm

Quoting Heinkel (Reply 11):
Looks more like hydraulic fluid. People injured in an accident usually don't loose so much blood.

Most certainly yes, and there is some absorbant material poured around the pool of fluid which would not be done if it was blood.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:17 pm

Quoting Flaps (Reply 9):

The pin "fell out" or was it not put in in the first place?

It could have fallen out. But only if it were the wrong pin or not installed all the way. 747 pins are installed upwardly, so if they're not all the way in, they can totally drop out. Can't screwdriver these ones... Of course, if installed correctly, they do wedge in pretty tight and won't drop. Looks like an operator error at some level of other.
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Whiteguy
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:24 pm

Quoting darksnowynight (Reply 13):

Quoting Flaps (Reply 9):

The pin "fell out" or was it not put in in the first place?

It could have fallen out. But only if it were the wrong pin or not installed all the way. 747 pins are installed upwardly, so if they're not all the way in, they can totally drop out. Can't screwdriver these ones... Of course, if installed correctly, they do wedge in pretty tight and won't drop. Looks like an operator error at some level of other.

I think the pin being referred to is the pin to the tow bar and tug not the steering bypass pin....
 
bralo20
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:35 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 7):
That's gonna hurt. This is a charter 744. Is this a W/O?

Why would it be a W/O? It's a pretty young bird for a 744, only 13 years old and I think even just a month back from a D-check.

From the pictures shown it seems that "only" 2 engines are damaged (though the release mentioned a damaged "undercarriage", whatever that may be (I guess the gear?)).

Best case scenario is that only 2 engines are damaged and they can be swapped for spare ones.
Worst case scenario: 2 engines damaged and other damage to the plane which will probably take a bit more time.

It seems Iron Maiden will be sourcing a new Ed Force One (likely it will be a plain white bird since I doubt they'll take the several days it takes to apply the complete livery), maybe for the rest of the tour or maybe for the time the investigation and repairs will take. Not sure how fast they will work there but it's virtually a simple "car crash" compared to a true aircraft incident so I think the investigation may be quick (unless one or both injured expire due their injuries but let's hope not), then you have the experts, the insurance, etc... And then you can start with the repairs.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:39 pm

Quoting Whiteguy (Reply 14):

I suppose that might be possible (I'm not on the tow bar end of that equation), but it doesn't really read like that. And I've certainly seen Steering/NG Pins fall out of 747s before...

[Edited 2016-03-12 10:41:06]
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Tristarsteve
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:44 pm

Quoting Flaps (Reply 9):
The pin "fell out" or was it not put in in the first place?

The B747 steering lock out pin is special. To the untrained eye it looks like, and is the same size as, a B757 B767 B777 B787 pin. But the locking balls are half way down the pin, not at the end. It is inserted behind the NLG, UPWARDS into the steering mechanism.(all the others go down) A ground ops person that does not know can fit a B767 pin and it will stay there.
But at the first corner, it will drop out. The hydraulics are pressurised for the brakes, and the tow bar shear pins will shear instantly, disconnecting the tractor from the aircraft. If the tractor then stops, this is what happens.
Amazing really that it doesn't happen more often.
 
crownvic
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:46 pm

Quoting Heinkel (Reply 11):
Quoting fbwless (Reply 12):

Please refer to the photo of the worker in the orange vest and not the one with the pool of red hydraulic fluid as mentioned in original text.
 
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Classa64
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 7:27 pm

That's to bad, hopefully the tug operators do ok and its just superficial damage.

I always thought, with a plane this size, someone would be in the cockpit just to be on the brakes in case something like this happens. Not sure if that's required or possible.
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TUGMASTER
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 7:37 pm

Have seen 747 pins drop out before.
Crazy set up really, have always wondered why Boeing never came up with a better way of locking the steering out on a 747.
 
bralo20
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:16 pm

Seems that the 2 injured workers will recover completely.

Air Atlanta Icelandic / Iron Maiden are currently sourcing another 747 to use as an interim replacement while Ed Force One is being repaired:

Statement from Iron Maiden this evening:

Quote:

UPDATE - Saturday evening

We are happy to tell our fans in Cordoba that our Killer Krew has sorted out all logistics for us to be there with our full show for you all tomorrow. We expect no disruption to the tour in any way and are looking for a replacement 747 Ed Force One while our current beauty is healed. More news on that later. Until then, believe me, we will get to you all on this tour one way or another wherever you are.

We are also delighted to say that we have been officially informed that the two Chilean airport staff who were injured following the malfunction of the tow truck connecting bolt will make a complete recovery. Best wishes to them and their families.

Up the Irons! See you soon. And thanks Chile, what an amazing reaction and show!!

- Rod


[Edited 2016-03-12 12:17:59]
 
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:26 pm

Quoting Bralo20 (Reply 15):
Why would it be a W/O? It's a pretty young bird for a 744, only 13 years old and I think even just a month back from a D-check.

At most a 744 is worth $20 million
Aircraft Values, And Lease Pricing - Fall 2015 (by LAXintl Nov 10 2015 in Civil Aviation)

B747-400 – $4.1 – 19.5M, $100-185,000

Now, the $20 million would be a circa 2007 plane. If this is a circa 2003 plane as other posts note, we're looking at 4 more years of depreciation. Now, the $4 million plane would be 1989. So it is about $1 million in depreciation per year. So if the repair is above $16 million, we have a write off.

I would guess $4M for two used engines, $5M for nacelles (ironic how valuable the are in older airframes), $4 million for airframe damage... If I'm low by 20%, a write off.

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jetmech
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:35 pm



Quoting darksnowynight (Reply 13):
747 pins are installed upwardly, so if they're not all the way in, they can totally drop out.
Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 17):
It is inserted behind the NLG, UPWARDS into the steering mechanism
Quoting TUGMASTER (Reply 20):
Have seen 747 pins drop out before.

The first lesson that was hammered home to me when I first starting towing 747's was to always pull downwards firmly on the steering bypass pin to make sure it was engaged properly. I was also drilled home to never touch the tiller when you were in the flightdeck riding the brakes.

Regards, JetMech

[Edited 2016-03-12 12:37:44]
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s.p.a.s.
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 9:54 pm

For today's flight to Cordoba (Argentina) they are chartering an Aerovias DAP B737-200.
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b747400erf
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 10:11 pm

Riding the lightning a little too hard.
 
deutronium
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 10:28 pm

A rock band owns a 747? I shouldn't have tried so hard at school.
 
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teme82
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 10:41 pm

Quoting deutronium (Reply 26):
A rock band owns a 747

Nope they are leasing it  
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bralo20
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 10:50 pm

Quoting deutronium (Reply 26):
A rock band owns a 747? I shouldn't have tried so hard at school.

Nope, ACMI leasing or maybe even borrowing depending if it was a sponsorship deal or not. Air Atlanta Icelandic is a client of Bruce Dickinson's MRO company (Cardiff Aviation).

Quoting teme82 (Reply 27):
Nope they are leasing it

But they (or at least Bruce through his airline VVB) ownes a Boeing 737-400 which he leases out.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 11:04 pm

Quoting Heinkel (Reply 11):

Looks more like hydraulic fluid. People injured in an accident usually don't loose so much blood.

The average 70kg man has about 5 liters of blood. That's a lot more than 5 l of fluid. Blood is also opaque and coagulates quickly. IIRC, hydraulic fluid is red in part because it's so godawful to touch.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 22):

I would guess $4M for two used engines, $5M for nacelles (ironic how valuable the are in older airframes),

So there must be a ton of nacelles sitting around hanging from 744s with GE engines (they're GE, right?) at places like VCV, exucate me why would the nacelle cost so much more?

Quoting crownvic (Reply 18):

Please refer to the photo of the worker in the orange vest and not the one with the pool of red hydraulic fluid as mentioned in original text.

OH! Ok, that might be some drops of blood, but it's not a *lot* of blood. So probably someone got cut on broken glass from the cab.

Quoting jetmech (Reply 23):

The first lesson that was hammered home to me when I first starting towing 747's was to always pull downwards firmly on the steering bypass pin to make sure it was engaged properly. I was also drilled home to never touch the tiller when you were in the flightdeck riding the brakes.

Regards, JetMech

Could you maybe post some diagrams and pictures of this assembly?
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flyabr
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 11:15 pm

Welp...time to procure a 77L!!  
 
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 11:31 pm

Does Boeing / Boeing Credit have a spare 748?
 
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sat Mar 12, 2016 11:41 pm

Wow. Was no one brake riding? That would have prevented most, if not all of the damage, outside the nose gear.
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deutronium
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:06 am

Quoting flyabr (Reply 30):
Welp...time to procure a 77L!!

No, they probably need the hump.
 
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glideslope
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:17 am

Oh boy. Sorry Bruce.   
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glideslope
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:18 am

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 32):

Wow. Was no one brake riding? That would have prevented most, if not all of the damage, outside the nose gear.

It would appear not.
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jetmech
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 1:34 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 29):
Could you maybe post some diagrams and pictures of this assembly?

The following two diagrams are of the 747 classic nose gear steering system, but the 744 setup is pretty much the same.

 photo 747-1_zps7f6t6ss2.png

 photo 747-2_zpsbkbimb6n.png


The first diagram shows the system in the neutral position, with the second diagram showing what happens when a right turn command is input by the pilot to the steering tillers. The key to understanding the operation of the nose gear steering is to look at the summing lever and cable loop.

The cable loop is connected to the steering tillers in the cockpit and the steering collar on the nose gear itself. When an input is placed upon the steering tiller by the pilots, the nose gear will of course “lag” behind by a small amount.

Because the tillers and steering collar are both connected to the cable loop, the “lagging” of the nose gear will shorten one side of the cable loop slightly compared to the other. This will then act upon the summing lever to move it from the neutral position. The summing lever in turn acts upon the metering valve such that hydraulic pressure is ported to the steering cylinders to achieve the commanded right hand turn.

In control system parlance, the input at the tiller generates an “error” signal in the system. The system then acts in such a manner as to try and reduce the error signal back to zero.

The tow pin works by mechanically locking the summing lever in the neutral position as shown in the first diagram. This in turn, mechanically locks the metering valve in the neutral position also. If you study the metering valve closely, you will see that when it is the neutral position, the spools on the valve shaft and hydraulic fluid ports are configured as such as to connect together the hydraulic fluid lines to both sides of the steering actuators.

It is this hydraulic connection between both sides of the steering cylinders that allows the aircraft to be towed. If the tow vehicle turns, hydraulic fluid from one side of the steering cylinder will be pumped out and received by the other side of the steering cylinder.

When you are in the flight deck riding the brakes for a tow, you will notice that the steering tiller follows the movement of the nose gear. This makes sense if you remember that the summing lever is mechanically locked in the neutral position by the tow pin.

So what happens if the tow pin falls out? This is perhaps easiest to understand if we image the aircraft being towed in a straight line prior to attempting a turn.

The steering tillers are spring biased to the neutral position. Thus, if the tow vehicle initiates a turn with the tow pin absent, the steering collar will act upon the cable loop to shorten one side slightly relative to the other. This will act upon the summing lever and in turn, the metering valve.

The metering valve will move such that the interconnection between both sides of the steering actuators no longer exists. This will generate a hydraulic lock in the steering actuators that will resist further steering movement of the nose wheels.

What usually happens at this point is the shear pins in the towbar will fracture to prevent the tow vehicle applying any more steering loads upon the nose gear. You will note that the steering system has a bypass valve. The bypass valve allows hydraulic fluid to be ported from one side of the steering actuators to the other when extreme pressures are generated.

Thus, if the shear pins on the towbar fail to fracture, the tow vehicle will continue to apply steering forces to the nose gear. Once the hydraulic fluid pressure becomes high enough, the bypass valve will open to allow the high pressure fluid to port to the low pressure side of the steering actuators. This in turn, allows for movement of the nose gear steering. This of course, is a final safety measure that should not be relied upon.

Regards, JetMech

[Edited 2016-03-12 17:35:52]

[Edited 2016-03-12 17:36:31]
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DocLightning
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:57 am

Quoting jetmech (Reply 36):

Regards, JetMech

Wow, I think I just learned more about aircraft systems engineering there than I ever have in any other post. That's amazing how this behavior can be programmed into a cable-driven mechanical system.

Thank you. You just blew my mind. I do like having my mind blown.  

God, I love this site.  Big grin

Now, do you have any pictures of what the ramper's view is of the tow pin insertion site?

[Edited 2016-03-12 18:59:48]
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jetmech
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 3:42 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 37):
Now, do you have any pictures of what the ramper's view is of the tow pin insertion site?

Interestingly enough I couldn't find any good pictures of the tow pin as fitted to the metering valve. The picture below should help.

 photo 747-3_zpsiohoh6z1.png

http://www.billzilla.org/747nosestrut.jpg

You can just see the bottom of the tow pin. The tow pin itself is similar to this item.

http://www.aerospecialties.com/app/u...65B04011-41_B747_Bypass_Pin_02.jpg

On many occasions, the summing lever is not quite in the neutral position which prevents you from fitting the tow pin. The holes labelled in the first picture allow you to directly manipulate the summing lever with your thumbs so you can insert the tow pin.

Therein lies the danger with the system. The tow pin may well stay in place but this may just be because of the friction with a summing lever that is not quite in the neutral position. Once you start to tow, the summing lever will eventually achieve the neutral position which will then allow the tow pin to drop out.

That’s why it is so important to pull down firmly on the tow pin to make sure the locking balls have engaged properly.

Regards, JetMech
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Whiteguy
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 3:55 am

Quoting glideslope (Reply 35):

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 32):

Wow. Was no one brake riding? That would have prevented most, if not all of the damage, outside the nose gear.

It would appear not.


I'm sure there was someone riding the brakes, they probably didn't realize the disconnect had happened until it was to late. The aircraft obviously stopped somehow right after hitting the tug.....
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 4:29 am

Quoting jetmech (Reply 23):
The first lesson that was hammered home to me when I first starting towing 747's was to always pull downwards firmly on the steering bypass pin to make sure it was engaged properly

Similar here. The only add I have is that we also train our techs to wait until GS has fully disconnected the tow bar before removing the pin. But then, that's for all types anyway.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 29):
IIRC, hydraulic fluid is red in part because it's so godawful to touch.

Only the 5606 fluid in the Gear Struts is red. The rest of the Aircraft Systems will use Purple (SkyDrol, Hyjet, etc...), unless you're in the military.

I don't know if that puddle is from the tug or the 747 (no idea what tugs/pushes use), but if that much came out of the NG strut, the damage to the NG structure is substantial.
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Leezyjet
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:11 pm

Look closely at the pics showing the tug, and you will see only 1/2 the towbar is connected. It's the shear pins that have broken on the towbar, as the tug tried to take the corner, usually that is an indication of being towed too fast for the corner, or poor maintenance of the towbar.

As the tug has turned left, this has taken it into the path of the engines, but the aircraft carried straight on as it was unable to steer as the bypass pin must still have been installed.

This does beg the question of exactly WTF was the guy riding the brakes doing in the cockpit at the time, and why didn't he hit the brakes?.

 

[Edited 2016-03-13 07:16:07]
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:31 pm

Quoting Leezyjet (Reply 41):


This does beg the question of exactly WTF was the guy riding the brakes doing in the cockpit at the time, and why didn't he hit the brakes?.

 

[Edited 2016-03-13 07:16:07]

He probably didn't realize the tow bar had broken and been disconnected. It's impossible to see the tug and nose wheel from the cockpit. It looks like the brakes were applied immediately after the tug was hit.
 
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jetmech
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Sun Mar 13, 2016 3:07 pm

Quoting darksnowynight (Reply 40):
The only add I have is that we also train our techs to wait until GS has fully disconnected the tow bar before removing the pin.

Yep. That was the other thing that was hammered home. In our case the tow pin fitment and removal always took place without the tow bar attached to the nose gear. The reason I was given for this is that the nose gear could suddenly turn a small amount whilst you fitted or removed the tow pin. Supposedly, this movement although small would be sudden enough to either damage the tow bar or worse yet, flick the towbar into your legs!

Quoting Leezyjet (Reply 41):
This does beg the question of exactly WTF was the guy riding the brakes doing in the cockpit at the time, and why didn't he hit the brakes?
Quoting Whiteguy (Reply 42):

I only once had a 747 towbar break on me, and this happened when I was in the cockpit riding the brakes. It's unmistakeable that something has broken as you can hear it as well as feel a sudden, sharp jolt going through the aircraft. Luckily, we were only in the pushback part of the tow and thus, moving fairly slowly.

The thing is I didn't immediately jump on the brakes though I did immediately ask the engineer on the tow vehicle what was going on. In a certain way, I think it is risky to jump on the brakes without getting word from the people outside as to what is going on as you could make the situation worse.

Regards, JetMech
JetMech split the back of his pants. He can feel the wind in his hair :shock: .
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Mon Mar 14, 2016 5:50 pm

Quoting darksnowynight (Reply 40):

Only the 5606 fluid in the Gear Struts is red. The rest of the Aircraft Systems will use Purple (SkyDrol, Hyjet, etc...), unless you're in the military.

Is the military red?
-Doc Lightning-

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DarkSnowyNight
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:31 am

Quoting jetmech (Reply 43):
The reason I was given for this is that the nose gear could suddenly turn a small amount whilst you fitted or removed the tow pin. Supposedly, this movement although small would be sudden enough to either damage the tow bar or worse yet, flick the towbar into your legs!

Yes. If you look real closely when they unhook a tow and pull the pin, you often will see the wheel jiggle a little.

Quoting jetmech (Reply 43):

The thing is I didn't immediately jump on the brakes though I did immediately ask the engineer on the tow vehicle what was going on. In a certain way, I think it is risky to jump on the brakes without getting word from the people outside as to what is going on as you could make the situation worse.

Absolutely! Even more so if you're going in reverse.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 44):

Is the military red?

MIL H 5606 is and that's the preferred type for most military aircraft. Transpsort aircraft may well be skydrol for major systems but for most combat aircraft, you'll see just red.
"Nous ne sommes pas infectés. Il n'y a pas d'infection ici..."
 
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litz
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Tue Mar 15, 2016 6:47 pm

Any more word on damage, other than the pictures we've seen of the two engines?
 
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jetmech
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Tue Mar 15, 2016 6:56 pm

Quoting darksnowynight (Reply 45):
Yes. If you look real closely when they unhook a tow and pull the pin, you often will see the wheel jiggle a little.

You also see the nosewheels turning slightly when you manipulate the summing lever with your thumbs. I always relieved the friction on the tow pin if I felt that it was dragging when I tried to remove it. When the pin was out I'd always slowly let up pressure on the summing lever to preclude the nosewheels from turning back to neutral too quickly.

Regards, JetMech
JetMech split the back of his pants. He can feel the wind in his hair :shock: .
 
tp1040
Posts: 370
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Tue Mar 15, 2016 7:22 pm

What is the engineering reason for inserting the pin upwards? Is to make sure you have a positive insertion, rather than just dropping it in and thinking it properly seated?
 
jetwet1
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RE: Iron Maiden Ed Force One Badly Damaged In Chile

Tue Mar 15, 2016 8:23 pm

Quoting deutronium (Reply 26):
A rock band owns a 747? I shouldn't have tried so hard at school.

When you consider that Maiden has sold over 60m albums and are a prolific touring band (over 2000 stadium and arena concerts in 35 years), I think it's safe to say they could easily buy a couple of 744's if they wanted to and yes, we all should have tried harder in school.

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