Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
User avatar
flybynight
Topic Author
Posts: 1536
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2003 1:58 pm

Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Mon Apr 11, 2016 5:41 pm

While having a business lunch in Moses Lake, WA last week I couldn't help but notice a couple of military transporters doing some touch and go's.

I know several airlines as well as Boeing used Moses Lake for various training exercises. I believe JAL might even have trained pilots there.

Outside of the military is this still common?
Heia Norge!
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5056
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Mon Apr 11, 2016 5:43 pm

Quoting flybynight (Thread starter):

While having a business lunch in Moses Lake, WA last week I couldn't help but notice a couple of military transporters doing some touch and go's.

I know several airlines as well as Boeing used Moses Lake for various training exercises. I believe JAL might even have trained pilots there.

Outside of the military is this still common?

It is common, isn't it a good environment to test crosswinds?
 
User avatar
flybynight
Topic Author
Posts: 1536
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Mon Apr 11, 2016 5:49 pm

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 1):
It is common, isn't it a good environment to test crosswinds?

Yes can be windy. Just east of the Cascade mountains (well about 70 miles east of the Cascades) and an open prairie- like environment.
Heia Norge!
 
hivue
Posts: 2098
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:26 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Mon Apr 11, 2016 6:32 pm

Quoting flybynight (Thread starter):
Outside of the military is this still common?

Well, here's two relatively recent examples:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZRKm6PG918
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYbM-3E11Qo&nohtml5=False

Actually, I think Boeing uses it extensively. I would hazard a guess that the 737MAX has visited several times already.
"You're sitting. In a chair. In the SKY!!" ~ Louis C.K.
 
Freshside3
Posts: 1591
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:11 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Mon Apr 11, 2016 6:36 pm

Mitsubishi had also talked about using it for the MRJ project, as well.
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5334
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Tue Apr 12, 2016 2:17 am

Unfortunately, no airline service anymore.
 
Wingtips56
Posts: 1301
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Tue Apr 12, 2016 2:33 am

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 5):

Unfortunately, no airline service anymore.

SeaPort (K5) was going to, but pulled the plug before it happened. That's a whole 'nuther thread.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
User avatar
ramprat74
Posts: 1366
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2003 6:01 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Tue Apr 12, 2016 2:38 am

Business lunch in Moses Lake, WA? You must of been at SGL?

JAL trained their 747 cockpit crews at Moses Lake for 40 years. They even had a hangar.

 
User avatar
flybynight
Topic Author
Posts: 1536
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:14 pm

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 5):
Unfortunately, no airline service anymore.

Yes, Horizon used to fly I believe. I am not expecting them to come back. A local business connection told me that Alaska/Horizon tried to press local business for guarantees on business travel to keep a flight to Moses Lake. With roughly 23,000 people, that is likely not going to happen.

But for training, it makes sense to keep Moses Lake going.

I don't think JAL still has the training facility?
Heia Norge!
 
durangomac
Posts: 466
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:18 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Tue Apr 12, 2016 9:12 pm

SkyWest also made a go at it but it just didn't make money. If I remember correctly OO entered the market after QX retired their smaller Dash-8's and went all Q400's. OO then brought in EMB-120's but still couldn't make it work and pulled out 1-2 years later.
 
User avatar
flybynight
Topic Author
Posts: 1536
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:31 pm

Most people prefer to drive to SEA or GEG from Moses Lake. But in the winter having to cross the Cascades can be dicey due road closures due to avalanches on I-90 or accidents due to snow. Never a reliable road in the winter.
Heia Norge!
 
atct
Posts: 2472
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2001 6:42 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:08 pm

Quoting flybynight (Reply 8):
I don't think JAL still has the training facility?

They closed it, I want to say in 2010ish?

Having 2 long runways in an X is a great design for test work for Boeing and their contractors. Check out flightaware and you'll see a decent amount of BOE aircraft transiting to and fro. I took a supervisor's job at the tower there back in 2011 and almost moved until I got a better position in Anchorage.
Trikes are for kids!
 
User avatar
7BOEING7
Posts: 3039
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:28 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:16 am

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 1):
It is common, isn't it a good environment to test crosswinds?

Not really, they do get occasional crosswinds but not to the extent necessary for certification work. Boeing unfortunately has to travel a little farther for winds most of the time, i.e. Iceland.

Quoting hivue (Reply 3):
Actually, I think Boeing uses it extensively. I would hazard a guess that the 737MAX has visited several times already.

Boeing uses it for certification to a certain extent but mostly for production acceptance work where they'll fly two automatic approaches (one to a touch & go the other to a go-around) and then leave. YKM, GEG and PAE are also used.

Quoting atct (Reply 11):
They closed it, I want to say in 2010ish?

The local golf courses have (in fact the economy in general) suffered since their departure. Although they did a lot of initial training there a large majority of the work was dealing with recurrency training until better simulators/cost of flying brought an end to the operation.

At one point in the early 90's they had 1 741 or 742, 2 744's and 1 DC-10 operating there for a couple of years.

Quoting atct (Reply 11):

Having 2 long runways in an X is a great design for test work for Boeing and their contractors. Check out flightaware and you'll see a decent amount of BOE aircraft transiting to and fro.

Most of Boeing's work is to RWY32R which has the ILS and 14L. The cross runway 4/22 is hardly used at all by Boeing but the C-17's from McChord use it a lot. In 30+ years I don't think I ever landed on 4/22 but taxied on it a lot.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5056
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:20 am

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 12):
Not really, they do get occasional crosswinds but not to the extent necessary for certification work. Boeing unfortunately has to travel a little farther for winds most of the time, i.e. Iceland

I think United has been up in CDB before testing something.
 
Viscount724
Posts: 19316
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:37 am

Quoting flybynight (Reply 8):
I don't think JAL still has the training facility?

It was closed around 2009 to cut costs when JAL was in serious financial difficulty.
 
dc10lover
Posts: 1594
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:11 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:57 am

As i read it, Japan Airlines only used Moses Lake for the 747 training. That is no longer current. I still think Moses Lake would have been a great place to build and test Airbus jets. But Mobile, AL is where they are building Airbus Jets. Also people in Moses Lake drive to Pasco, Washington & fly out.
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of. Same with OAK & SJC when it comes to SFO.
 
User avatar
flybynight
Topic Author
Posts: 1536
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Moses Lake Still Used By Boeing And Airliners?

Wed Apr 13, 2016 4:14 pm

Quoting dc10lover (Reply 15):
As i read it, Japan Airlines only used Moses Lake for the 747 training. That is no longer current. I still think Moses Lake would have been a great place to build and test Airbus jets. But Mobile, AL is where they are building Airbus Jets. Also people in Moses Lake drive to Pasco, Washington & fly out.

That would have been interesting; having Boeing and Airbus both in Washington State!
Heia Norge!

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos