New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 176

NZ107 · Wed Apr 27, 2016 9:49 am

I feel like they've missed a trick. Acquire more 763s for cheap, upgrade the interior a bit and then operate all these low yielding routes with them. Surely if you have a big enough subfleet, it would provide gains which may cancel out the effect of the standardisation of the long haul jet fleet.

DavidByrne · Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:58 pm

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 44):

I agree it would be a very interesting and ballsy move, even if supported by a local subsidy. But at this stage it is just speculative on CAPA's part. Fingers crossed that (a) it comes to fruition and (b) it is a commercial success.

sunrisevalley · Wed Apr 27, 2016 9:07 pm

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 50):
Acquire more 763s for cheap, upgrade the interior a bit and then operate all these low yielding routes with them

They seem to be planning on doing a pretty good job with the three that they will still have come this southern spring. CTU is a non-starter for a 763 so it must have some other attraction if it becomes a "go" to justify a 77E/789.

mariner · Wed Apr 27, 2016 10:17 pm

Quoting davidbyrne (Reply 51):
I agree it would be a very interesting and ballsy move, even if supported by a local subsidy. But at this stage it is just speculative on CAPA's part.

The article is full of "could" and "possibly" and based on very little evidence, except that the Mayor of Chengdu has pitched the route to Air NZ and NZ has opened a visa office there.

That said, it;s an interesting choice, I suggested in another thread a few months ago. Chengdu has things going for it - it's a major (and fairly wealthy) city of 10 million people and it is landlocked - about 1500 km from the coast.

As the article rightly suggests, the major traffic would be Chinese going on holiday - to the beaches, I guess.

mariner

[Edited 2016-04-27 15:29:53]

sunrisevalley · Thu Apr 28, 2016 12:09 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 53):
to the beaches, I guess.

Maybe around Tutukaka..?

mariner · Thu Apr 28, 2016 1:43 am

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 54):
Maybe around Tutukaka..?

Hopefully some. The owner of the local (Toot) restaurant said there has been a "surge" in Chinese clientele this past summer.

The more I learn about it yes, AKL-CTU would be a ballsy move, but not irrational. It has a number of attractions for tourists, not least of which might be the giant panda breeding programs. I dunno if I'd go just for that, but the pandas sure move Chengdu higher up my list.

http://www.travelchinaguide.com/attr...a-breeding-and-research-center.htm

"Chengdu Research Base of Giant Panda Breeding"

mariner

sunrisevalley · Thu Apr 28, 2016 2:12 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 55):
Hopefully some. The owner of the local (Toot) restaurant said there has been a "surge" in Chinese clientele this past summer

so some of them are making their way north which is a little contrary to conventional wisdom that they high tail it to ZQN.

mariner · Thu Apr 28, 2016 2:21 am

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 56):
so some of them are making their way north which is a little contrary to conventional wisdom that they high tail it to ZQN.

I think quite a lot, especially to Bay of Islands, and it might tie in with this:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ticle.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11451178

"Chinese tourists turning off NZ package tours

Though package tours still dominate the Mandarin-speaking market with around 70 to 80 per cent share, the rise of free independent travelers (FITs) and the increasing appetite for individualised excursions are transforming the business of Chinese travel agents.

FITs refer to those who come to New Zealand not via any tours that combine transport, lodging, sightseeing all into one price package, and therefore have the freedom to work out their own itineraries."

mariner

Zkpilot · Thu Apr 28, 2016 3:50 am

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 50):

I feel like they've missed a trick. Acquire more 763s for cheap, upgrade the interior a bit and then operate all these low yielding routes with them. Surely if you have a big enough subfleet, it would provide gains which may cancel out the effect of the standardisation of the long haul jet fleet.

Yes and no. 789 has so much more payload capacity (for things like freight) and it's fuel burn is a lot lower.
The 763 is a great aircraft for those medium distance low yield routes for sure.
As Sunrise Valley pointed out though the 763 doesn't have the legs for CTU.

777ER · Thu Apr 28, 2016 6:15 am

WIAL handed in their resource consent application last week for the runway extension

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/7940...nt-applications-for-300m-extension

NZ107 · Thu Apr 28, 2016 7:51 am

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 58):

Well considering that 789s will take a few years to order and 763s are available fairly quickly, there aren't many other things to turn to if you want to go ahead with short term rapid expansion.. There are many places within reach of the 763 though, which are either currently served or could see flights (doesn't necessarily mean they warrant a service) - HNL, SGN, HKT, DPS, CGK, KUL, MNL, TPE, KIX, PER, RAR/APW/PPT-LAX..

sunrisevalley · Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:10 pm

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 60):
Well considering that 789s will take a few years to order and 763s are available fairly quickly, there aren't many other things to turn to if you want to go ahead with short term rapid expansion

My view is that if NZ have plans for CTU these have been in the works for sometime and capacity for the service has already been allowed for in the 77E/789 fleet . I cannot see more 763's ; NZ has had the opportunity over recent years to review their 763 fleet needs and have elected to reduce the fleet to three by late 2016

HLZCPH · Thu Apr 28, 2016 10:08 pm

Fog in CHC this morning causing issues. Looks like SQ297 is diverting to Ohakea? Thought they might have tried out WLG, get some practise in!

aerorobnz · Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:12 am

Quoting HLZCPH (Reply 62):
Looks like SQ297 is diverting to Ohakea

Well there is no space for additional aircraft at AKL. They have been blocking off active taxiways of late to accommodate scheduled/resident aircraft, add in WLG/CHC diverts and their current apron works blocking out layovers and closing gate 3 and we have plenty of problems in AKL.

All I can say is that if you add in a ruapehu ashcloud or even just fog at CHC and a couple of JQ regional ports like PMR/NPL, and wind at WLG simultaneously and AKL will go into lockdown. You can expect big delays if it happens, and when AKL itself gets fog, well anyone's guess on what might happen - I worry that one day even without those scenarios a person who is having a medical emergency during a hub may have to wait for medical attention due to no gates/layovers available on arrival.

777ER · Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:31 pm

HLZ has done a 180 turn on passenger numbers recently with NZ about to expand its Koru lounge

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/7938...airport-passenger-numbers-do-a-180

NZ107 · Fri Apr 29, 2016 10:07 pm

Quoting 777ER (Reply 64):

So busy that the airport terminal basically closed down on the Saturday I was there earlier in the year because there were no flights in or out for another couple of hours during late morning.

sunrisevalley · Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:05 pm

Quoting HLZCPH (Reply 62):
Fog in CHC this morning causing issues.

What CAT system does CHC have, if any.

zkncj · Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:34 pm

Quoting 777ER (Reply 64):
HLZ has done a 180 turn on passenger numbers recently with NZ about to expand its Koru lounge

The Lounge upgrade isn't just an HLZ thing, NZ is currently working around expanding/upgrading all the regional lounges (although the JQ ports got some priority).

Funny that they mention the lose of the AKL-HLZ service, which was mainly an service of the B1990Ds to get from AKL to there HLZ base.

ZKSUJ · Sat Apr 30, 2016 3:47 am

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 66):
What CAT system does CHC have, if any.

CAT 1 there. Only AKL has the real low vis stuff

ZKSUJ · Sat Apr 30, 2016 3:49 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 63):
Well there is no space for additional aircraft at AKL. They have been blocking off active taxiways of late to accommodate scheduled/resident aircraft

Saw that yestersay, a 77W and 789 just chilling on Bravo all day.

Devilfish · Sat Apr 30, 2016 4:00 am

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 42):

so MNL has it own potential problems in local traffic control which don't sound good

It's not "potential problems" anymore but a veritable crisis.

.

Quoting ZKSUJ (Reply 43):
Sounds like something AKL is aspiring to be

They picked the right model.

.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 50):
Acquire more 763s for cheap, upgrade the interior a bit and then operate all these low yielding routes with them.

Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 58):
The 763 is a great aircraft for those medium distance low yield routes for sure.

Considering the A321LR may not have the nonstop range for MNL-AKL, perhaps PR should look for a couple or so that still has plenty of time left after its 'D' checks, if and when they're ready to upgauge the route? PR could reuse the seats being removed from their single-class A330s and put those in the 763s.

.

aotearoa · Sat Apr 30, 2016 7:03 am

So, after a few years of hard work, Air New Zealand land an A320 at Queenstown at night. Congratulations to all involved! A huge project in any sense of the word. Trial flights in progress without pax for crew training over the next ten days or so.

zkncj · Sat Apr 30, 2016 8:50 am

http://www.newshub.co.nz/entertainme...d-airport-2016043018#ixzz47IVUnOef

2x 774 parked up in AKL today, been an while since that hapend

ZKSUJ · Sat Apr 30, 2016 11:05 am

Quoting zkncj (Reply 72):
2x 774 parked up in AKL today, been an while since that hapend

744 you mean. SIN Cargo was there too so that was 3...

NZ107 · Sat Apr 30, 2016 11:08 am

Quoting zkncj (Reply 72):
2x 774 parked up in AKL today, been an while since that hapend

I don't think that's ever happened anywhere in the world

But the two 744s were a great sight!

Air India One and Ed Force One

sunrisevalley · Sat Apr 30, 2016 10:08 pm

Quoting aotearoa (Reply 71):
So, after a few years of hard work, Air New Zealand land an A320 at Queenstown at night. Congratulations to all involved! A huge project in any sense of the word

Are there a number of different patterns that can be flown into and out or is the choice limited ? What is the main challenge of doing it at night?

ZKSUJ · Sat Apr 30, 2016 10:45 pm

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 75):
What is the main challenge of doing it at night?

Mountains I believe...

Plus no lights

77west · Sat Apr 30, 2016 11:04 pm

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 75):
Are there a number of different patterns that can be flown into and out or is the choice limited ? What is the main challenge of doing it at night?

ZQN is New Zealand's equivalent of Innsbruck, probably more dicey actually. See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3aMX_zGcqc

777ER · Sun May 01, 2016 1:55 am

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 75):

The mountains and lack of support for landing aircraft at night time were the main hurdles.

777ER · Sun May 01, 2016 5:58 am

The first Queenstown night flights, which will offer passengers more choice, while boosting the Central Otago economy, are set to touch down later this month.

The introduction of evening flights are set maximise the airport's current operating hours and reduce peak-time pressure from substantial growth in passenger and traffic volumes.

An Air New Zealand test flight arrived on Saturday night in preparation for a scheduled service that will start on May 23.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/7948...flight-lands-at-queenstown-airport

sunrisevalley · Sun May 01, 2016 1:43 pm

Quoting ZKSUJ (Reply 76):
Mountains I believe... Plus no lights

Quoting 777ER (Reply 78):
The mountains and lack of support for landing aircraft at night time were the main hurdles.

I didn't phrase the question very well. What is different at night than during the day when flying a RNP approach ( or departure).? Certainly identifying landmarks but RNP is all about the auto pilot flying coordinates so landmarks are not relevant. So my question stands.

rendezvous · Sun May 01, 2016 7:57 pm

Apparently NZ5 arrived in Auckland this morning (02/05) with a local standby. Does anyone have more information?

kiwiandrew · Sun May 01, 2016 8:05 pm

Quoting rendezvous (Reply 81):
Apparently NZ5 arrived in Auckland this morning (02/05) with a local standby.

sorry, what's a local standby ?

rendezvous · Sun May 01, 2016 8:28 pm

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 82):
sorry, what's a local standby ?

Fire trucks ready to go. I wasn't out there, so I've only heard little bits third hand. It sounds like it may have been some engine issue. I had a look at the track on Flight Radar 24, it didn't appear abnormal.

77west · Mon May 02, 2016 1:49 am

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 80):
I didn't phrase the question very well. What is different at night than during the day when flying a RNP approach ( or departure).? Certainly identifying landmarks but RNP is all about the auto pilot flying coordinates so landmarks are not relevant. So my question stands.

I think the issue here is that even on an RNP approach, they still transition to visual for the final approach and landing.

On departure, they still manually fly the first bit.

Without runway lights, and due to terrain, the CAA used to deem it unsafe to operate at night.

Note, I believe the operator still has to be certified to do this, it is not automatically open to anyone. (that goes for certain RNP approaches as well)

ZKSUJ · Mon May 02, 2016 3:21 am

Are the 3 French things parked at the end of Bravo there because they require an area courdoned off especially? Or is it due AKL's lack of space? I notice alot of parking on taxiways in the last week

aerorobnz · Mon May 02, 2016 3:38 am

Quoting ZKSUJ (Reply 85):
Or is it due AKL's lack of space?

due lack of available facilities.

- 3 French VIPs
- 1 Iron Maiden 744
- 1 Indian VIP 744
- Lack of refuellign capable layovers
- Gate 15 out for today due Apron works
- L19 not suitable for parking today
- L78 or 79 out of action due Apron works
- 5 763s for the next 2 weks until NCK gone.
- Plenty of offschedule running early/late

EK are bus op turnaround on EK406/407 today. using L83A

ZKSUJ · Mon May 02, 2016 5:01 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 86):

Wow, that would explain the NZ heavies on the taxiways in recent days too

77west · Mon May 02, 2016 6:10 am

Quoting ZKSUJ (Reply 87):
Wow, that would explain the NZ heavies on the taxiways in recent days too

The situation in AKL is now beyond a joke. Even if they built some more hardstands it would be better than parking the things on taxiways.
They could concrete in the grass area in front of 76 and 77 and fit in another 6 or so heavy stands.

EDIT: Yelow areas show where you may be seeing things parked. They are official "gates" but double as taxiways when not needed.

[Edited 2016-05-01 23:27:01]

pa747sp · Mon May 02, 2016 7:03 am

Quoting Sylus (Reply 33):
Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 32):
I see that the Australian Federal Government has announced a 500 metre extension for HBA airport runway to allow for international flights. NZ's next destination?

The current runway at HBA is around 2,200 metres I believe, so this extension is probably more geared towards potential Asian flights. The current 2,200 metres is plenty for a NZ flight.

AN briefly operated HBA CHC with a 727.

777ER · Mon May 02, 2016 7:33 am

An all-you-can-fly airline between New Zealand's main centres could help ease Auckland's housing crisis, a travel agent says.

Airly would operate Beechcraft King Air 350 turbo aircraft with 8 leather seats, all both window and aisle, plus snacks and drinks on board.

So far about 150 people have expressed interest in becoming members.

House of Travel commercial director Brent Thomas said an all you can fly service would be a huge hit for New Zealand business travellers as long as the terms and conditions were well suited to the last minute nature of business travel.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/indu...k-in-new-zealand-travel-agent-says

77west · Mon May 02, 2016 7:33 am

Quoting 777ER (Reply 90):
House of Travel commercial director Brent Thomas said an all you can fly service would be a huge hit for New Zealand business travellers as long as the terms and conditions were well suited to the last minute nature of business travel.

I was just reading that. Not sure it would be sustainable...

777ER · Mon May 02, 2016 7:41 am

Quoting 77west (Reply 91):

I certainly don't believe it will work. Our population is certainly not big enough and many high flyers won't want to loose their Airpoints earning especially the benefits of private travel with family

nzrich · Mon May 02, 2016 8:13 am

Quoting pa747sp (Reply 89):
AN briefly operated HBA CHC with a 727.

So did NZ with a 737

DavidByrne · Mon May 02, 2016 10:28 am

Quoting 77west (Reply 77):

Quoting nzrich (Reply 93):

As did TAA with a 727!

mariner · Tue May 03, 2016 12:33 am

Kiwi Regional down-sizing its plans again:

http://www.newshub.co.nz/nznews/kiwi...tches-chch-flight-plans-2016050311

"Kiwi Regional Airlines ditches Chch flight plans

Kiwi Regional Airlines is ditching plans to fly into Christchurch from later this month, in a bid to hunker down during winter months and expand in summer.

Mr Wilson says the decision is not a sign of any trouble for the carrier, just a seasonal adjustment to the schedule."

mariner

haggis73 · Tue May 03, 2016 7:52 am

Quoting rendezvous (Reply 81):
Apparently NZ5 arrived in Auckland this morning (02/05) with a local standby. Does anyone have more information?

Low tire pressure indication

Quoting 77west (Reply 88):
They could concrete in the grass area in front of 76 and 77 and fit in another 6 or so heavy stands.

Their current plan is to build 4 more hard stands (hydrant refueling capable) (before this summer) west of stands 76 / 77 which will link up with taxiway Lima. Stand 78 will disappear and become a taxiway through to Lima also.

2 widebody positioning flights left AKL today:

NZ6003 AKL - QPG ZK-OKQ - Is it losing it's black colour scheme? http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ZKOKQ

NZ6001 AKL - FTW ZK-OKE - http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ZKOKE

77west · Tue May 03, 2016 8:18 am

Quoting haggis73 (Reply 96):
NZ6003 AKL - QPG ZK-OKQ - Is it losing it's black colour scheme? http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ZKOKQ

NZ6001 AKL - FTW ZK-OKE - http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ZKOKE

Weird. Fort Worth Meacham?

zkojq · Tue May 03, 2016 9:15 am

I wish F-RARF had been parked in a more accessible area.

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 86):
- 5 763s for the next 2 weks until NCK gone.

I thought NCK was retired on Sunday?

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 86):
due lack of available facilities.

Yikes!

Quoting 77west (Reply 88):
The situation in AKL is now beyond a joke.

aerorobnz · Tue May 03, 2016 9:53 am

Quoting ZKOJQ (Reply 98):
I thought NCK was retired on Sunday?

It is a ground spare for 6 more days.

Quoting haggis73 (Reply 96):
NZ6001 AKL - FTW ZK-OKE

Repaint.

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