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L.1011
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DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Sun Apr 24, 2016 5:37 pm

Hi everybody,

It's fairly easy to find old airliner seating configurations, but as we know a lot has changed over the years, from reduced pitch coach to lie flat business. I'm trying to get an accurate read on roughly how many passengers each DC-8 fuselage - the original 10-50, Super 62/72, and Super 61/63/71/73, would seat in a modern configuration, or which modern airliners their cabin length would be equivalent to.

Thanks in advance!
 
CRJ900
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Sun Apr 24, 2016 5:58 pm

Scandinavian charter carrier Scanair had 252/254 seats @ 28 inch pitch in their DC-8-63 in the 1980s. This was with the old-style seats. With todays slimline seats they could still fit 254 seats and people would find it bearable. I flew them first time in 1982 - great aircraft.

I think the exit limit is 259 seats for the DC-8-61/63 and that would be possible. Scanair had huge galleys due to the enormeous amount of duty free products they carried.

[Edited 2016-04-24 11:37:40]
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longhauler
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Sun Apr 24, 2016 6:22 pm

Quoting L.1011 (Thread starter):
DC-8 fuselage - the original 10-50, Super 62/72

I have never seen more than 189 passengers in these aircraft. That was dictated by the exit layout. Four full sized doors and four overwing exits. Some versions of the DC-8-50 and DC-8-62 had an additional pair of exits aft of the wing. Called "Jetescape" these were hinged at the bottom with a slide (not inflatable in the DC-8-50 and inflatable in the DC-8-62). The intent of this exit was to allow the overwing exits to be blocked when in a combi configuration.

However, while I have never seen more than 189 in the DC-8-50 even with this exit, I recall low 200s in the slightly longer DC-8-62 but I can not find a reference with regard to maximum with that exit layout.

The cabin volume of the DC-8-10 to -50 would be slightly more than a B737-900 and slightly less than a B757-200.

The exit layout of the DC-8-60/70 varied by original owner. Basically they had a pair of full sized doors at the front, two "Jetescape" exits ahead of the wing roots, four overwing exits, a pair of full sized doors aft of the wings, then another pair of full sized doors in the rear. United had an additional pair of Jetescape doors in the rear cabin which eventually were decommissioned.

As that exit combination would allow more passengers than one could physically fit, the maximum number of passengers would be limited by what the airline "risked" balancing comfort with economies, with lav and galley requirements considered.

The cabin volume of the DC-8-61/63/71/73 was slightly more than a B757-300.
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Viscount724
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:20 am

If memory correct CP Air's DC-8-63s were 12 F (40 or 42-inch pitch) and 191 Y (34-inch pitch) most of the time. In their latter years of service they sometimes operated all-Y (mainly on charter routes to Europe) with 235 Y seats, still at close to 34-inch pitch.

The CP DC-8-43s and couple of -50s were 12 F and 129 Y (34-inch pitch) most of the time. There was also a single -55F combi that mostly operated in all-passenger configuration, but it was used in combi configuration for a while with 69 Y class seats.
 
matt
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 2:04 am

Worked as an FA for Nationair Canada in the early 1990s. The charter-configured DC-8-61/62 had â configuration of Y259, while the -62 had â configuration of Y189.

Matt
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L.1011
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 3:45 am

Quoting longhauler (Reply 2):
The cabin volume of the DC-8-10 to -50 would be slightly more than a B737-900 and slightly less than a B757-200.

Okay so:

DL 739 180
UA 739 167 or 179
AS 739 181
avg 177

AA 752 (domestic) 184, 188, or 190
DL 752 (domestic) 174, 175, 180, 181, 182, 184, or 199
UA 752 (domestic) 182
avg 184
DL 752 (international) 168 or 171
AA 752 (international) 176
UA 752 (international) 169
UA 752 (p.s.) 142
avg 171 excluding p.s.

So for the short body we're talking around 180 seats domestic, maybe 165 with international business?
-62/-72 are 80 inches longer, so two more rows of coach; low 190s domestic, high 170s international?

Quoting longhauler (Reply 2):
The cabin volume of the DC-8-61/63/71/73 was slightly more than a B757-300.
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 3):

If memory correct CP Air's DC-8-63s were 12 F (40 or 42-inch pitch) and 191 Y (34-inch pitch) most of the time. In their latter years of service they sometimes operated all-Y (mainly on charter routes to Europe) with 235 Y seats, still at close to 34-inch pitch.

DL 753 224 or 234
UA 753 213

So you'd be talking 240ish for Delta, 220ish for United? Maybe a bit over 200 international?

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 1):
I think the exit limit is 259 seats for the DC-8-61/63 and that would be possible.
Quoting longhauler (Reply 2):
I have never seen more than 189 passengers in these aircraft. That was dictated by the exit layout.
Quoting matt (Reply 4):

Worked as an FA for Nationair Canada in the early 1990s. The charter-configured DC-8-61/62 had â configuration of Y259, while the -62 had â configuration of Y189.

Seems like normal configurations were a lot closer to the exit limit on these. 752 is limited to 239, right? That's quite a bit more breathing room.
 
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longhauler
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:33 pm

Quoting L.1011 (Reply 5):
Seems like normal configurations were a lot closer to the exit limit on these. 752 is limited to 239, right? That's quite a bit more breathing room.

Yes, but don't forget, the DC-8-61/63 is 30 feet longer than a B757-200.

When the DC-8-61/63 were new, the normal capacity was about 200 in an F/Y mix as stated above. AC's were 196 then 198 then 204 when the "wide body" interior was installed just before they were retired. When flown as all Y they were 227. The DC-8-43/53 held about 135 at AC with an F/Y mix and 147 when all Y.

These configurations were during the day when airlines competed with service before deregulation. Economy was in 34" seat pitch and AC's DC-8s had an extra lav installed. First Class had two lavs for 12 passengers and had a 5 seat lounge with stand-up bar.

The "charter" airlines flew them in configurations ... 189 for the 10-50 and 250+ for the 61/63 that would be more likely that we would see during today's airline environment where price is second to comfort.
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MEA-707
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:39 pm

Quoting longhauler (Reply 6):
Yes, but don't forget, the DC-8-61/63 is 30 feet longer than a B757-200

And don't forget both the cabin configurations and seats have become more efficient.
While the 707-300 was longer (and way heaver) then a 737-800, the latter cabin floorspace is about the same. This because the 707 had a more forward rear bulkhead, galleys and toilets were bigger, the cockpit was bigger, there were more closets for coats etc.
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longhauler
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:45 pm

Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 7):
And don't forget both the cabin configurations and seats have become more efficient.

This is all very true. Look at this seat chart for the DC-8-43/53 of AC in 1970.


Look at the amount of "real estate" that was covered for First Class and compare that to today. In the last 10 years of operation, AC flew them with 12 F passengers. With the lounge, the bar, two lavs, a large galley and two closets. Today, we are thankful if F has one dedicated lav!
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
Natflyer
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 10:13 pm

Loftleidir Icelandic and later Icelandair's DC-8-61/63/71 had 249 all Y configs. In the last years of operation they had a Business Class and IIRC 234 seats.

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/CAKfs2oWYAAWUHr.jpg
 
PSAjet17
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Mon Apr 25, 2016 10:59 pm

The Delta DC8-61s were configured with 26F and 172Y seats. With the conversion to -71s, a cabin modification was also made as well as new seating which changed the configuration to 18F and 194Y.

http://www.deltamuseum.org/docs/site...98203_article_dc-8-71.pdf?sfvrsn=2
 
CRJ900
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Tue Apr 26, 2016 3:24 pm



With 7 exits per side, the United DC-8-61 really looked impressive. Imagine if this DC-8 was still in production today with a two-pilot cockpit, smart-flex galleys and wafer-thin slimline seats - this baby would carry 300 pax in one-class. The CASM would probably give airline CEO's an orgasm  
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dc9northwest
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RE: DC-8 Passenger Capacities

Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:03 pm

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 11):
The CASM would probably give airline CEO's an orgasm

Nah, it has 2 engines too many. No one would like it.

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