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wilcharl
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Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Wed May 11, 2016 1:07 pm

Surprised it has not come up in topic already today. Twenty years ago today, Critter 592 took the lives of 110. Three years later I found myself working for what became of ValuJet (AirTran) cutting my teeth in the industry. Remember the passengers and crew of Flight 592 today may God bless them and their families.
 
 
xdlx
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Wed May 11, 2016 2:55 pm

I was working MIA that day, remember it well!
 
321neo
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Wed May 11, 2016 5:36 pm

Here's a documentary of the crash: ValuJet Flight 592 'Florida Everglades Plane Crash'

Were any specific new rules/regulations introduced in the aftermath of the accident?
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Wed May 11, 2016 5:43 pm

I can't believe it's already been 20 years since that terrible day. Back then I remember being a bit suspicious of Valujet quick expansion, so when I heard a Critter had crashed I was really worried for their future. That crash impacted quite deeply the U.S. industry.
 
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litz
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Wed May 11, 2016 5:51 pm

Quoting 321neo (Reply 3):
Were any specific new rules/regulations introduced in the aftermath of the accident?

Absolutely ... both in fire detection, and extinguishment, in cargo holds, and much more scrutiny of what actually ships as cargo.

A number of prominent government officials (FAA, etc) lost their jobs over this crash; it was very big news.
 
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bluestreak
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Wed May 11, 2016 8:32 pm

This thread brings chills to me. I remember that day well, and spent the evening in front of the tv in disbelief. My cousin was a flight attendant for ValuJet at the time, and she called me to notify me of the crash. She also wanted us to know she was not part of the crew of 592. A few weeks prior to the crash, we were talking about flying, and I told her I was planning to take a trip with ValuJet. She then asked me not to, and added that the airline was not safe in her opinion, and she was worried each time she took a trip. She was frantically looking for another job at that time, and ended up with Continental, now United.

I know the details of the crash, and that the plane was in good working order before the cargo hold fire. But it didn't help to take away the doubts I had about the airline. I never flew ValuJet, but I ended up being a big fan of AirTran.

Ironically, my cousin's birthday is May 11.

May the souls of ValuJet 592 rest in peace.
"Well, we barely made the airport, for the last plane out, as we taxied down the runway, I could hear the people shout"
 
flymia
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Wed May 11, 2016 10:09 pm

Miami Herald is doing many articles today on the crash. Including links to how the crash of Critter 592 was the first new story it posted online, early, before the planned operation of the site.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/article76936417.html one can see the actual old webpage that day. It is the first crash I vividly remember, I was only 6 years old at the time, but it was a big big story in Miami, at even at 6 I was an avid news watcher. Odd I know. The other thing that hits hard is looking back at the stories of those lost, especially the young, those who were young, would be full grown adults now, have families etc.. But that was all stopped short due to wreck less behavior.
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
 
thegoldenargosy
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 12:35 pm

I can't even begin to imagine how horrific it must have been to be onboard that flight. I've read that the floor collapsed in the cabin prior to the crash. Passenger Delmarie Walker was the prime suspect in the murder of an Atlanta woman.

Take a moment and remember:

Captain Candalyn Kubeck, 35, Phoenix, Arizona
First Officer Richard Hazen, 52, Mineola, Texas
Flight Attendant Lori Cushing, 37, Austin, Texas
Flight Attendant Jennifer Stearns, 21, Farmers Branch, Texas
Flight Attendant Mandy Summers, 22, Irving, Texas

Passengers
Saeeda Alihassan, Atlanta, Georgia
James Allaway, Miami, Florida
Isabel Anderson, Cookeville, Tennessee
Leslie Archibald, Opa-Locka, Florida
Rizwan Arshad, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
Giuseppe Bafunno, Blackwood, New Jersey
Marlo Balandran, Topeka, Kansas
Thomas Balandran, Topeka, Kansas
Jennifer Barreiro, Bloomington, Indiana
Herbert Bell, Elkwood, Virginia
Peggy Bell, Elkwood, Virginia
Terri Bell, The Colony, Texas
Anthony Brown, Rose Hill, North Carolina
Frances Brown, Baltimore, Maryland
Lynn Brown, Rose Hill, North Carolina
Joseph Burnett, Shawnee Mission, Kansas
Cecelia Cabrera, Miami, Florida
Ronald Carpenter, Murfreesboro, Tennessee
Lisa Carleton, Conyers, Georgia
Ninon Corneille, Lynn, Massachusetts
Edna Crye, Richmond, Indiana
Kenneth Crye, Richmond, Indiana
Karen Culver, Woodstock, Georgia
Rodney Culver, Woodstock, Georgia
Mansor Darbor, Atlanta, Georgia
Bradley Ehrlichman, Indianapolis, Indiana
Elizabeth Favero, Duluth, Georgia
Franco Favero, Duluth, Georgia
Laura Favero, Duluth, Georgia
Charles Fluitt, Miami, Florida
Elizabeth Gabriel, Mooresville, North Carolina
Deana Gabr, Conyers, Georgia
Pamela Gabr, Conyers, Georgia
Carlos Gonzalez, Alpharetta, Georgia
Angela Green, Nashville, Tennessee
Mark Griner, Marietta, Georgia
Steven Guiler, Buford, Georgia
Conway Hamilton, Miami, Florida
Laurie Hamilton, Miami, Florida
Carol Hanchey, Conyers, Georgia
John Hanchey, Conyers, Georgia
Elaine Hayman, Columbus, Ohio
Robert Hayman, Columbus, Ohio
Susan Heffernan, Murfreesboro, Tennessee
Michael Howard, Hialeah, Florida
Walter Hyatt, Nashville, Tennessee
Daniel Jarvis, Gastonia, North Carolina
Linda Jarvis, Gastonia, North Carolina
Kathleen Kessler, Atlanta, Georgia
Ison Kim, Shawnee Mission, Kansas
Rafael Lameda, Cookeville, Tennessee
Aliyagi Landry, Hollywood, Florida
Dana Lane, Alpharetta, Georgia
Roger Lane, Alpharetta, Georgia
Raymond Lathem, Alpharetta, Georgia
Andrew Leonard, Cloverdale, Indiana
Jeremy Leonard, Cloverdale, Indiana
Tabitha Leonard, Cloverdale, Indiana
James Lewis, Fayetteville, Georgia
Devlin Loughney, United Kingdom
Roger Loughney, United Kingdom
Philmore Marks, Miami, Florida
Elizabeth McLemore, Tybee Island, Georgia
Clark McNitt, Powder Springs, Georgia
Judith McNitt, Powder Springs, Georgia
Laura McNitt, Powder Springs, Georgia
Lindsey McNitt, Powder Springs, Georgia
Neil McNitt, Powder Springs, Georgia
Judith Medeiros, Rex, Georgia
Robert Medeiros, Rex, Georgia
Ella Mitchell, Miami, Florida
Andrew Nevil, Raleigh, North Carolina
Lucille Newbold, Nassau, Bahamas
Maxwell Newbold, Nassau, Bahamas
Whilhelmina Oliver, Athens, Georgia
Lisa Pearson, Kansas City, Missouri
Laurese Perkins, Miami, Florida
David Quinones, Dallas, Texas
Elida Ramirez, Dunwoody, Georgia
Donna Rennolds, Whittaker, Michigan
Kimberly Rennolds, Ypsilanti, Michigan
Howard Rietz, Mt. Juliet, Tennessee
Terri Rugg, Richmond, Indiana
Dennis Sabo, Auburn, Alabama
Ana Sanchez, Metairie, Louisiana
Karin Shier, Savannah, Georgia
Vi Shier, Fayetteville, Georgia
Ailven Shotwell, College Park, Georgia
Jarvis Shotwell, College Park, Georgia
Joyce Simonton, Macon, Georgia
Paul Smith, Montgomery, Alabama
Joelan Snowden, Eldorado, Arkansas
Hugh Stanley, Gainesville, Georgia
Louise Stanley, Gainesville, Georgia
Frederick Steinbrener, Acworth, Georgia
Jerrold Thompson, Kansas City, Missouri
Roosevelt Tillman, Lynchburg, Virginia
Lila Viloleta, Alpharetta, Georgia
Delmarie Walker, Erie, Pennsylvania
James Weimer, Cloverdale, Indiana
Janice Weimer, Cloverdale, Indiana
Teresa Wilson, Tybee Island, Georgia
Ruth Wolfe, Gainesville, Georgia
Robert Woodus, Upper Marlboro, Maryland
 
flymia
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 1:46 pm

Quoting thegoldenargosy (Reply 8):
Passenger Delmarie Walker was the prime suspect in the murder of an Atlanta woman.

Interesting, never knew about this: http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/199...ark-holmes-sister-catherine-holmes
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
 
VC10er
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 2:07 pm

I recall it very well myself. I had a friend, acquaintance really, who was an FA on ValueJet. I would only ever see him once or twice a year at a particular party my friends and I always attended in Miami. I remember having to wait months before I did see him, the whole time wondering.

I remember all crashes. But for some reason this one stood out. Like the AA crash of the A300 in NYC, just weeks after 9/11.

Thank God incidents are becoming more rare in spite of more and more aircraft and people high up in the sky.

God bless those lost.
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
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jsnww81
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 3:36 pm

I was a freshman in high school when this crash occurred. Flight attendant Jennifer Stearns had graduated from my school (in Farmers Branch, Texas) only a few years before. The student body had turned over since she'd graduated, but there were many very shaken faculty and administrators who remembered her well.

Hard to believe it's been 20 years.
 
n92r03
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 4:53 pm

The summer of '96 was tough, TWA 800 was two months later...

At the time I wondered (and still do), why wasn't a coffer dam built around the main impact area and the water drained? It would seem that with the immense challenges in finding the CVR/FDR and dealing with the harsh environment (heat, alligators, snakes, etc), that "controlling" the site would have been worth it. Heavy equipment and materials would have been readily available from Miami so that would not have been an issue. Perhaps that would even have been benefit to clean/filter the contaminated swampy water?

On a more somber note, it always hits harder when you read the names and see that couples/family members were on board the doomed flight. R.I.P.
 
SJCMSP
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 5:09 pm

ESPN did a lengthy piece on Rodney Culver last year, who at the time of the crash was a running back with the San Diego Chargers.

http://espn.go.com/espn/feature/stor...gacy-alive-former-players-memories
 
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litz
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 5:58 pm

The fire had to have been horrific .... when the NTSB attempted to simulate the fire, they almost burned down the test facility. The temperatures were literally off the scale : the facility's measurement gear was incapable of measuring the actual temperature. It was well above the melting point of aluminum, by a wide margin.

There's no way to know for sure, but it's quite possible it burned through the floor, possibly even the fuselage, damaged control cables (on the DC9, these run under the floor, I think), etc. Nasty stuff.

There were major changes in aviation as a result of this accident concerning fires, fire detection, cargo, etc.

One of the articles linked above says the changes cost the industry some $300 million, and that's in 2001 dollars.
 
727LOVER
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 6:09 pm

Wasn't there a pax that was supposed to be on the flight, but his car broke down and he got to the airport late. Once at the airport, a vending machine stole his money and he thought "I'm having a bad day!"

Was a language barrier the cause of the crash?
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
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OA412
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Thu May 12, 2016 6:24 pm

Quoting n92r03 (Reply 12):
The summer of '96 was tough, TWA 800 was two months later...

Indeed. I remember both well since they each happened shortly before trips I had planned that year. Valujet a couple weeks before and TWA exactly one week before. I can't believe it's already been 20 years.

Quoting litz (Reply 5):
A number of prominent government officials (FAA, etc) lost their jobs over this crash; it was very big news.

Interesting. I wasn't aware of that. I recall then Transportation Secretary Federico Pena defending Valujet and calling them a safe airline, but I don't remember the firings.

Quoting bluestreak (Reply 6):

Yikes!
Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
 
flymia
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Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2001 6:33 am

RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Fri May 13, 2016 1:50 pm

Quoting n92r03 (Reply 12):
At the time I wondered (and still do), why wasn't a coffer dam built around the main impact area and the water drained? It would seem that with the immense challenges in finding the CVR/FDR and dealing with the harsh environment (heat, alligators, snakes, etc), that "controlling" the site would have been worth it. Heavy equipment and materials would have been readily available from Miami so that would not have been an issue. Perhaps that would even have been benefit to clean/filter the contaminated swampy water?

I think the effort and getting the equipment there, the environmental impact, getting the equipment out. Sure a dam could be built but how do you get the equipment into the dam? Helicopter? The plane disintegrated , there was not much to find unfortunately.

Quoting litz (Reply 14):

The fire had to have been horrific ....

I think the reenactment timed with the explosion of the tire showed that the fire started while on the ground waiting for takeoff.
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
 
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litz
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RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Fri May 13, 2016 5:50 pm

Quoting flymia (Reply 17):
I think the reenactment timed with the explosion of the tire showed that the fire started while on the ground waiting for takeoff.

I remember at the time, two theories were put forth in newspaper articles about the crash (this was pre Internet news, of course) ...

1) the tire was placed on top of the box of oxy cans, and triggered them either then, or during taxi
2) the tire rolled onto the box of oxy cans during takeoff

either way, it did not take long for the fire to almost literally explode.

Per the NTSB, when they attempted to reproduce the fire, they almost burned down the test facility.
 
vjzalb
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Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:37 am

RE: Twenty Years Today ValuJet 592

Fri May 13, 2016 6:01 pm

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 15):
Was a language barrier the cause of the crash?

Not to oversimplify it, and there is numeous documentation on the root causes, but a large factor was improper DOT/IATA training for loading hazardous materials on a passanger aircraft which should not have been there in the first place. As with any incident, a number of things lined up to create the perfect storm. During HazMat IATA training this event is always highlighted as to why training and understanding the ICAO reguations for HazMat shitment is so important.

20 years later and continued throughts with their families.

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