No Gate For QR755 In ATL Inaugural

HGL · Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:11 am

Quoting kaitak744 (Reply 27):
And are there any regular A380 operations that don't have an upper level jet bridge?

Although DXB has a dedicated A380 Concourse, EK operates more A380s than Concourse A can accommodate and so it is common to see A380s at other gates. In these instances the upper deck passengers all boarded first and use the stairs to reach the upper deck. After they are boarded it is the turn of Economy passengers, all of whom are seated on the main deck.

XFSUgimpLB41X · Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:26 am

Qatar openly said they were doing this just to rub salt in the wounds of Delta. They picked a fight.

Come on... this is freaking hilarious. What is even better was that it was an A-320 at E4 (which holy crap this time of day we are fighting for gates as it is... so freaking often I'm coming back from central america and have to fight for a gate on E or F with the incredible volume.)

Sorry guys... I was driving into work and saw the 380 oddly parked "huh... why the heck are they out there."

This is an absolutely fantastic response to Qatar's attempt at "rubbing salt in Delta's wounds."

500 people on that thing? I wonder what sort of deals they made. The demand will be exceedingly low... this is a posturing route.

gatibosgru · Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:44 am

Quoting AABB777 (Reply 26):
But, dumb decision by QR to fly the A380 on the inaugural. Didn't do them any good, and I'm sure the flight was a revenue loss.

Brilliant decision. The PR received with this story only makes DL look bitter, even if not the case.

PlanesNTrains · Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:03 am

Quoting jetlanta (Reply 80):
The airline that didn't follow the proper procedure is the one that got the honor.

So, to be clear, you said that DL has no involvement in how gates are assigned. We have read above the opposite from someone else. Do they are don't they?

Quoting CARST (Reply 100):
What is childish about it? If you can stick it to the competition, what do you do? You stick it to them. FUCK THE COMPETITION. Man, they are your enemy. They want your money, they want your employees, just fuck em. Sometimes you people here from the USA make like you are the uber capitalists, but then you sound like the biggest socialists or communists when it comes to aviation. This is business. Every company fights to win customers, money, ROI, the best employees. And you do everything, like in every other business, to stick it to your competitor. Make 'em look bad and try to shine yourself...

Professional courtesy?
Do unto others?
Being pragmatic?

Foul language aside, you'd seem like a pretty nasty businessperson. Perhaps it serves you well though.

-Dave

hb88 · Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:14 am

You could have bet on this happening.

Of course it was intentional. What a disgrace.

A bad PR call though, it's simply made the US incumbents look petty and weak. It's already clear that they can't deal with competition.

ptcflyer · Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:29 am

Was on the flight. Can not believe such a big deal was made about the gate issue. As a passenger it was a non issue.

What is missed is that an incredible service and alternative was introduced in Atlanta. The Business Class experience was incredible. The attention to detail to every aspect of the seat design, soft products, food, were evident. The Qatar staff from all over the world worked together as a team to deliver the best service while using the A380 on their longest flight yet and first to the US. They have a passion for flight that exceeds the more corporate treatment we are accustomed to with US carriers.

From the flight attendants to members of the ground staff in Doha to the attendant cleaning the restroom in the Business Class lounge all ask with sincere interest and a bit of excitement.... "Where are you going?" And From where do you come? Travel has become a lot more fun and interesting for this ATL flyer with Qatar as a choice!

KarelXWB · Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:47 am

Al Baker on the issue:

http://twitter.com/AirFlottau/status/738667978355552256

Quote:
Al Baker says U.S. side violates air service agreement with Atlanta handling problems for Qatar A380. Issues "never seen before"

compensateme · Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:50 am

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 107):
Al Baker on the issue:

He's milking the attention; QR occasionally use hard stands at BKK and it's never a big deal.

DL threw a childish tantrum and ultimately provided QR with more free publicity than it could've ever dreamed of.

CARST · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:07 am

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 104):
Professional courtesy?
Do unto others?
Being pragmatic?

Foul language aside, you'd seem like a pretty nasty businessperson. Perhaps it serves you well though.

-Dave

Really? Come on, you don't win by being nice just for sake of being a nice person. It what's not pragmatic about my post? It is exactly that. I give nothing to my competitor for free. You work together here and there and accept it as a necessary nuisance. You are also friendly to them, but in the end you want them too loose or even better get out of business. And you want to make the money, the business. I'm not nasty, I only care for one thing: my customers, I live of them, and so do my employees. And the competitors want me out of business and I want them out of business. This is capitalism. Live it and don't just talk about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Cnl_WJ4J7g

DL is doing just the right thing...

BestWestern · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:29 am

Airports usually welcome new flights with open arms. Usually a fire engine water salute, and an event at boarding. For ATL to allow DL to basically do this to QR is a disgrace. Utter disgrace.

Quoting D L X (Reply 7):
just read that DL had an A320 at the only A380 gate at ATL. That's absolutely hilarious.

It's absolutely pathetic and childish.

Quoting Mir (Reply 19):
An airline operates a 380 as a publicity stunt to an airport that is not well set up to handle the 380, and there are problems. Imagine that.

Anywhere else in the world and the airport would have a brass band.

Quoting AABB777 (Reply 26):
But, dumb decision by QR to fly the A380 on the inaugural. Didn't do them any good, and I'm sure the flight was a revenue loss.

It's an inaugural.

Quoting jetlanta (Reply 41):
1. ATL international gates are scheduled FULL at the time of the QR arrival yesterday.
2. Those schedules are submitted to the terminal operator (not Delta) over three months in advance.
3. The terminal operator assigns the gates, not Delta.
4. Delta's schedules, which were submitted months ago, requires use of all the gates they requested.
5. Nothing about Delta's schedule yesterday was any different than any other day.
6. QR had a normal gate (F7) available to them for the 777-300ER schedule they had requested.
7. A month ago, QR informed the airport that it was bringing in a A380
8. An A380 operation actually takes away TWO gates from the normal operation.
9. The QR A380 has a MUCH longer turn time than the aircraft Delta uses at the same gates.
9. As a result, multiple Delta flights would have been displaced in order to accommodate the QR A380.
10. QR brought in an A380 to make a "point".
11. Delta was under no obligation to inconvenience its own passengers to oblige QR's "point".
12. Let's not forget this:

It's an inaugural. Dozens of new jobs and a major connection to the world.

Quoting compensateme (Reply 108):
He's milking the attention; QR occasionally use hard stands at BKK and it's never a big deal.

Again it's an inaugural. Airports go out of their way to make a good impression.

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 107):
U.S. side violates air service agreement

Interesting take on this. Makes ATL look like dixey ville and DL churlish and pathetic.

mjoelnir · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:30 am

To start with, I do not find it strange that a one off flight of an A380 has to use stairs. Also a deboarding and boarding time of 45 minutes is not excessive.

That said, who owns the A380 gate in ATL? Was it build and payed for by Delta? Or is it owned by the airport?

enilria · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:43 am

Quoting deltal1011man (Reply 87):
Welcome to Business 101.

Quoting deltal1011man (Reply 87):
Well admitting is step one, step two would be to educate yourself on how things work.

Have you ever worked on the ramp at an airport? Other airlines borrow stuff all the time. Tow tractors. GPUs. Gates. Even tires. I guess you just haven't done it.

Quoting jetlanta (Reply 90):
Quoting bx737 (Reply 86):
Just out of curiosity, did the ATL airport authority explain to QR that the gate was not available for the A380. If they did then the fault is with QR, if they did not, the fault lies with ATL airport authority.

Yes they did

OK, when did they explain that? Because DL says in the article they had to "scramble at the last minute to come up with a solution". That implies it was explained upon arrival.

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 104):
Quoting jetlanta (Reply 80):
The airline that didn't follow the proper procedure is the one that got the honor.

So, to be clear, you said that DL has no involvement in how gates are assigned. We have read above the opposite from someone else. Do they are don't they?

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 97):
Gating happens 3-4 days out.

Or even later. Are we to believe that no other airline at this airport changes their gate plans inside 30 days? ROTFL

Quoting jetwet1 (Reply 99):
Very true, though in this case i'm sure word has come down from headquarters that QR gets no help.

Quoting compensateme (Reply 108):
DL threw a childish tantrum and ultimately provided QR with more free publicity than it could've ever dreamed of.

I think it is unlikely that QR (with this and the Fox kerfuffle) has manipulated the media into making the big guy, the bad guy with its media prowess.

BestWestern · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:50 am

America is becoming more isolationist in these trump days. I worry where this will end?

Quoting enilria (Reply 112):
Or even later.

There are constant gate change announcements in Dixie ville.

picarus · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:53 am

Quoting jetlanta (Reply 41):
Delta played by the rules here. The rules exist at all airports to settle these sort of issues. Delta operated its normal schedule at the airport it operates over 1,000 daily departures. QR should have verified the A380 could be accommodated before it was scheduled.

Jetlanta, let's not let facts get in the way. The QR rep even hinted that it did not provide the required notification to the airport. It's far more dramatic to accuse Delta of diabolically scheming to disrupt the inaugural QR flight into its home turf.

I find many people on this board very entertaining.

Picarus

compensateme · Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:13 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 112):
I think it is unlikely that QR (with this and the Fox kerfuffle) has manipulated the media into making the big guy, the bad guy with its media prowess.

That QR had to use a hardstand in ATL is a non-issue -- its 380 are use to occasionally doing so at BKK. Yet a narrative went around that they were forced to do so out out spite from DL; Atlanta-based CNN took interest in the story, brought it into mainstream and it spread from there. And QR is milking the free publicity that it's receiving.

DL's continued childish antics against QR in ATL are only tarnishing DL's reputation.

captainmeeerkat · Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:36 pm

Quoting deltal1011man (Reply 87):
So the A380 gate(s) should only be used for A380 flights? not even 1x a day utilization.

They should be used for, umm...the A380 service maybe. Very logical if you ask me. Not a lot of planning or shuffling needed.

Quoting deltal1011man (Reply 87):
The only reason this is a big deal is because its DL and ATL. Any other airport in the world and no one would even comment on it.

Yes you are right because any other airport would have welcomed their A380 service in the correct way (i.e using the gate designed for such a flight)

One could argue that if it were LH or BA arriving in an A380, one wouldn't need to comment on it because the circumstances would be different.

jfklganyc · Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:05 pm

Why is everyone so worked up?

These two airlines are at war.

"Salt in wounds"

"Enjoy the hard stand"

You guys act surprised. ATL isn't happy that Qatar has landed there...because their largest tenant isn't happy.

The joke will ultimately be on both airlines:

1. Delta isn't going to stop the ME3 from anything.

2. Qatar is going to burn money on this route

Enjoy the sandbox guys

Cubsrule · Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:10 pm

Quoting compensateme (Reply 115):
That QR had to use a hardstand in ATL is a non-issue -- its 380 are use to occasionally doing so at BKK. Yet a narrative went around that they were forced to do so out out spite from DL;

I assume the passengers were bused to F FIS. If so, did this "stunt" actually SAVE the passengers time? It's a long walk (3,000 feet or so, with several level changes) from the 380 gate over to F FIS. With more connecting passengers, who use E FIS, that's less of an issue for KE.

KarelXWB · Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:18 pm

The soap continues: Qatar Airways CEO Akbar Al Baker slammed Delta Air Lines for what he claims is "obstruction" of its newly launched operations into Atlanta.

http://aviationweek.com/iata-agm-201...-slams-delta-atlanta-gate-incident

Quote:
“I have never seen in the whole history of Qatar Airways that an airline would go to [such] low levels in undermining competition and underline it with a load of lies,” Al Baker said on the sidelines of the IATA annual general assembly in Dublin.

The June 1 inaugural service from Doha to Atlanta, operated with an Airbus A380, was marred by a number of ground handling problems. The aircraft was parked on a remote stand because the only A380-compatible gate was occupied by a Delta Airbus A320. Al Baker said there was “obstruction in loading handicapped people," check-in issues and “suppliers have been intimidated by Delta.”

Al Baker believes the way the first Qatar Airways landing in Atlanta was handled will “backfire” on Delta.

BestWestern · Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:28 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 119):
Al Baker said there was “obstruction in loading handicapped people," check-in issues and “suppliers have been intimidated by Delta.”

Do DL think they are the Mafia?

What DL is doing is highly uncompetitive.

ATL airport is a government facility and as such should treat all airlines fairly.

mjoelnir · Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:40 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 117):
Why is everyone so worked up?

One thing is a war of words. It is a completely different the actions of an airport build from public money.

AFAIK Delta did not build the A380 gate and neither was it paid by Delta.

I would like to see the storm here on a.net, if one of the airports in Qatar or UAE had done something similar to Delta.

BravoOne · Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:41 pm

Quoting jmdc861 (Reply 36):
As an American, Delta's "behavior" totally embarrasses and disgusts me!

Fact is, no American carrier, least of all Delta, can treat a passenger like almost any foreign flagged carrier out there. It will
be a cold day in hell before I fly an American flagged carrier internationally anywhere. Delta gives plenty of shame to the U.S.

Get a grp on yourself. Delta did nothing here to disgust anyone, These guys rubbed it in Delta's face when they brought the ugliest airliner ever made into ATL in the first place. Pay back is sometimes so sweat. Wait until one of there airplanes beaks down in ATL. Getting it fixed might be "time consuming" at best. All you Delta haters can stand down now.

enilria · Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:43 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 116):

They are at war, but according to the logic DOT uses to determine carrier overlap for mergers, they have ZERO market overlap. Kinda makes the point that DOT's idea of what competition means is pretty dated...

TheFlyingDisk · Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:14 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 119):
ATL airport is a government facility and as such should treat all airlines fairly.

But DL pays to use the airport, no? It's not as if they are blocking QR totally.

In fact, I kind of like the one-upmanship over QR - Al Baker & his crew tried to rub it in DL's face, and DL has an answer for that.

enilria · Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:20 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 53):
One thing. The "airport operator" TBI only controls 4 gates on E. As a part of the lease agreement, Delta assigns the gates on E, even to OA.

Quoting TheFlyingDisk (Reply 123):

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 119):
ATL airport is a government facility and as such should treat all airlines fairly.

But DL pays to use the airport, no? It's not as if they are blocking QR totally.

Frankly, the airport should be in charge of gate assignment, or a consortium of airlines. Letting one airline control something like this for other airlines is asking for problems.

mjoelnir · Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:48 pm

Quoting BravoOne (Reply 121):
Get a grp on yourself. Delta did nothing here to disgust anyone, These guys rubbed it in Delta's face when they brought the ugliest airliner ever made into ATL in the first place. Pay back is sometimes so sweat. Wait until one of there airplanes beaks down in ATL. Getting it fixed might be "time consuming" at best. All you Delta haters can stand down now.

The airport build from public funds did something to disgust everyone. I would call it corruption.

Cubsrule · Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:53 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 124):
Frankly, the airport should be in charge of gate assignment, or a consortium of airlines. Letting one airline control something like this for other airlines is asking for problems.

I've not yet seen any evidence--let me know if I've missed it--that the airport's schedule (which, of course, is largely Delta's schedule) could accommodate a 380. The 380 "gate" can take at least two 757s and possibly two 767s. F7--which is to be QR's 777/350 gate--cannot.

a380787 · Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:57 pm

It's blatantly obvious this is DL welcoming QR with a big fat middle finger. Any excuse about "scheduling inflexibility" is just smoke-screens. The fact that it was occupied with A320 should be ample proof that DL didn't *need* that particular gate, out of the hundreds at ATL.

Ih8b6 · Fri Jun 03, 2016 3:01 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 109):

Was this the inaugural flight? Wasn't sure from your post.

ocracoke · Fri Jun 03, 2016 3:24 pm

Quoting captainmeeerkat (Reply 68):
Name for me please all the non-US airlines who have used the same legal structure many times to survive when their business was in the toilet?

I don't know about "many times", but Avianca did use Chapter 11 in the US court system to reorganize, and Mexicana used Chapter 15 in the US court system to help with their reorganization attempt. Air Canada used the Canadian version of Chapter 11. Then of course there are the bankruptcies of Japan Airlines, Swiss Air, and Sabena, either reorganizing, or using the bankruptcy process to come out as a fresh version from the ashes of the old companies.

In the Chapter 11 process, not all the debt is wiped out. When Delta and Northwest exited the bankrupt proceedings, and merged shortly thereafter, the two companies had somewhere around $17 billion in debt. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that when American Airlines exited Chapter 11, they had something like $11 B in debt. If Chapter 11 wiped everything out, and put the burden on the taxpayers, those three companies should have had zero in debt.

AABB777 · Fri Jun 03, 2016 3:34 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 118):
The soap continues: Qatar Airways CEO Akbar Al Baker slammed Delta Air Lines for what he claims is "obstruction" of its newly launched operations into Atlanta.

AAB is one of the nastiest CEOs in the airline industry. He leads by intimidation, inspires fear, is an authoritarian figure, and bullies his employees which has created a toxic work environment at QR with significant employee turnover. I don't think the folks at DL take his comments too seriously, nor do they really care what AAB says. DL provides an excellent work environment for their employees - that includes profit sharing, growth opportunities, people development, and shows respect/appreciation for their efforts - and, DL customers are happy with an airline that leads the industry on multiple fronts/metrics.

gzm · Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:08 pm

Airport business is up to unprecedented factors and unforeseen events. Do you know how more difficult it must have been for the handler of this QR flight to use at least eight buses to accommodate those people, not to mention the first- and business-class passengers? It was not done on purpose because it doesn't mean a thing. But it speaks volumes...

jetwet1 · Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:25 pm

Shame it couldn't have been a 320NEO at the gate

QR 'Walks Away' From First A320neo (by Revelation Jun 3 2016 in Civil Aviation)

mjoelnir · Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:30 pm

Quoting ocracoke (Reply 130):
Then of course there are the bankruptcies of Japan Airlines, Swiss Air, and Sabena, either reorganizing, or using the bankruptcy process to come out as a fresh version from the ashes of the old companies

Both Sabena and Swissair were liquidated, no chapter 11 deal.

mjoelnir · Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:47 pm

Quoting alfa164 (Reply 132):
"Corruption"? Get a hold of yourself, man! "Corruption" is all those Icelandic banks and their tragic failures..

I do not need to get a hold on myself, corruption, what else is it. It is an airport build by public money not private owned by Delta. There is a gate build with public money to be used for a A380. If a private firm can control a public entity, what else is it than corruption?

If any country should hold back talking about the banking crisis, that would be the USA, nearly ruining the whole world. The fall of Lehman Brothers directly impacted all three of the Icelandic Banks that rolled.
In Iceland some bankers at least saw prison, whereas in the USA nobody dares to upset an USA owned bank, they could cut the money flow to some congressman or senator, that again one calls very simple corruption. Even for example being caught money laundering for drug deals are resolved with a fine.

peanuts · Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:13 pm

So DL "played" by the rules (ahum) and QR plays Mary and Joseph. Just briliant, brilliant!

QR for the sympathy win here.

reltney · Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:55 pm

Too funny! Great job Delta!!! Classic!

Hope it was desert hot that day too! A bit of rain should have helped.

oflanigan · Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:46 pm

So you decided to fly the Super into a place that you know doesn't have a gate to park at when you get there, but wait Delta is the rude one.

If you want to be a showman do it right. If you want to peddle like a used airline salesman, go for it. But own what you do. Delta should feel no shame in this. And apprarently neither does the airport. Welcome to the ATL.

D L X · Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:11 pm

It's a good point that QR had to have known there was no gate for it before the A380 left Doha.

David_itl · Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:16 pm

Quoting oflanigan (Reply 138):
So you decided to fly the Super into a place that you know doesn't have a gate to park at when you get there, but wait Delta is the rude one.

How about the having the 1 A380 gate being used for that. Not some cheap trick that makes Delta look like suffering from small penis syndrome and being a laughing stock round the rest of the world. 1 month notice is PLENTY of time to free that gate for use when it is due to arrive. Then you are the braindead country that has airlines owning terminals rather than the airport company owning 100% of the terminals.

winginit · Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:26 pm

Quoting David_itl (Reply 140):
Then you are the braindead country that has airlines owning terminals rather than the airport company owning 100% of the terminals.

Very much unlike QR, which has both airlines and airports alike all owned by the same overarching entity? Wait a minute...

If QR is going to say that they're going to launch a daily flight into Atlanta 'in order to rub salt into the wounds of Delta' and then try to take it a step further by deploying an A380 on the inaugural knowing that DL has first right of refusal on the one A380 gate they're arrogant fools, and they were exposed for as much.

gatibosgru · Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:01 pm

Quoting reltney (Reply 137):

Too funny! Great job Delta!!! Classic!

Hope it was desert hot that day too! A bit of rain should have helped.

What do the passengers have to do with DL's beef with QR? This way of thinking is just cruel and shows just how non empathetic people can be to defend their beliefs. Very American of you.

oflanigan · Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:31 pm

Quoting David_itl (Reply 140):

Did they (QR) meet their obligation of notice to the ATL Airport Authority? Nope. If their (QR's) agreement said 1 month and 1 days notice, for use of the gate then they didn't do their part. Your argument that notice is notice regardless of what agreements are in place is flawed.

What's "brain dead" as you so elequently state is wrong with businesses and government entities sticking to agreements? Rules are rules right? Sounded like a nicely staged civil spat that only "brain dead" people on here actually care about.

I spat in your general direction!!

Don't fly DL if it has your knickers all bunched, they are obviously uncivilized.

jetlanta · Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:06 pm

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 103):
So, to be clear, you said that DL has no involvement in how gates are assigned. We have read above the opposite from someone else. Do they are don't they?

The CNN article spells out pretty clearly how the process works. I can't account for other people's statements.

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 119):
ATL airport is a government facility and as such should treat all airlines fairly.

They did. There are policies and procedures in place to ensure it. QR simply didn't follow them.

Quoting enilria (Reply 124):
Frankly, the airport should be in charge of gate assignment, or a consortium of airlines. Letting one airline control something like this for other airlines is asking for problems.

Delta does not control the gates in question. Again, the CNN article spells it out. But apparently no once cares to understand the reality of what happened.

11725Flyer · Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:22 pm

And the latest headline:

Qatar CEO Calls Delta ‘Wicked’ for Ruined Doha-Atlanta Trip

Qatar Airways Chief Executive Officer Akbar Al Baker branded Delta Air Lines Inc. “wicked” over what he said was the U.S. carrier’s part in ruining the Middle Eastern company’s first flight from Doha to Atlanta.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...d-atlanta-trip?cmpid=yhoo.headline

jetlanta · Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:36 pm

The One Mile at a Time Blog has an authoritative review of what happened here. Unfortunately, A.net is not allowing me to link to it.

It even includes a copy of the letter sent by the Atlanta Airport to Qatar Airways on May 31, reviewing the situation and the options.

Suffice it to say that this summary says it all:

Quote:
To simplify this as much as possible, Qatar Airways started a route in order to rub salt in the wound of their competitor, and they decided to fly an A380 there for the first day of service, to further rub salt in the wound of their competitor.

However, they only decided they wanted to fly the A380 on the route a month in advance, and the airport tried to accommodate them, even though it was outside the 60 day window usually required. Without the airport’s permission, the airline announced the A380 operation publicly. They turned down the timing proposed by the airport, which would have allowed them to have a gate.

To top it all off, according to Al Baker, the airport violated the air-services agreement, old and frail people were inconvenienced as a result of the horrible actions of Atlanta Airport and Delta (even though people have to do the same thing at Hamad International Airport every day), and the conduct by the airport will be taken “very seriously” by the Qatari government.

Oh, and Delta’s CEO is the one who’s arrogant.

If anyone can make the link work, please post it.

reltney · Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:39 pm

Quoting gatibosgru (Reply 142):

Yup!, Proud of it!

toobz · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:02 pm

haha omg people. DL did NOTHING wrong. DL did not have to cough up the gate to accommodate anyone. Especially not QR. QR should have known that gate space maybe an issue when subbing an aircraft of this size. Why on earth would DL bend over backwards to accommodate a competitor??

N717TW · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:09 pm

Quoting captainmeeerkat (Reply 18):
Ch 11 is a form of subsidy in the minds of most people because it is an unfair advantage over airlines who cannot avail of such. Call it a quibble over semantics but a spade is a spade.

I really don't understand how wiping out all the equity of a company (and thereby leaving the actual owners of the airline without anything) and then ruining your credit is a subsidy and facing huge debt payments for years afterwards is a subsidy. Most of Delta's debt wasn't retired/cancelled as much of it was secured by real, hard assets; but their cost of borrowing went up. The alternative, if reorganization didn't exist in the bankruptcy code, would actually have created a stronger competitor as Delta would simply have gone out of business and a new airline would have filled the void. That new airline would have none of the debt, none of the legacy expenses, obligations, older/experienced staff, related costs, etc. Calling Chapter 11 of the bankruptcy code a subsidy is like calling jail free lodging.

upwardfacing · Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:27 pm

Whether or not Qatar Airways followed protocol, they have indeed done well on the PR front.

It's hard make such a case for Delta.

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