Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
User avatar
lesfalls
Topic Author
Posts: 3381
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:58 pm

Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 1:25 am

With there being already so many flights to Europe operated by PIA why has no EU airline tried flying to Karachi? Also what is the demand for flights to Karachi from Europe?
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
SurfandSnow
Posts: 1591
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2009 7:09 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 3:40 am

Demand is not an issue - crew safety on the ground in Pakistan is. Karachi is one of the most dangerous cities in the world, suffering from a double whammy of rampant petty street crime as well as frequent terrorist attacks. I read an article that explained how Karachi residents not only have to carry burner phones for the inevitable mugging, but must memorize and recite the phone number to their armed assailant to ostensibly prove that it is not just their cheap secondary phone...

BA did serve ISB (Islamabad was considered to be a much safer city than Karachi) until 2008, until the Marriott hotel bombing in that city prompted the airline to immediately end its only remaining Pakistan service. I should think the continuing lack of EU airline service to Pakistan speaks to the perilous security situation in Pakistan today.
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
DIJKKIJK
Posts: 1871
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2003 11:03 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 5:58 am

The Pakistani market has been taken over by the ME3 and the likes of TK. I doubt even PIA makes any money on their EU flights. They operate them only for the purposes of prestige and presence.
Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
 
User avatar
scbriml
Posts: 19300
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:03 am

One word, or lack thereof - safety.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
User avatar
TWA772LR
Posts: 7357
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:12 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:40 am

Quoting SurfandSnow (Reply 1):
Demand is not an issue - crew safety on the ground in Pakistan is.

I remember the KHI bombings in 2014. I worked for TK in IAH back then and I remember reading about it on the employee van, I also remembered it was very stormy that day, it's not one of those things you forget. Almost everyday, KHI would be one of our busiest stations (besides IST), except during Hajj and the frequent tour group to TLV. The attacks kinda had a personal effect on me because I remember checking in a lot of KHI-bound the day before, but felt a lot better when finding that the TK flight from IST-KHI turned back to Istanbul.

2014 was a hard year for aviation, almost every other week while working at TK, we had to "refer" pax to ticketing to be rebooked because some airport was attacked. Yemen, TLV, KHI, and DAM are the most note-worthy. Even After MH17, a lot of pax asked us if their connecting flight from IST to Europe would fly over Ukraine.
When wasn't America great?


The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and are not influenced by my employer.
 
factsonly
Posts: 2997
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 3:08 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:57 am

Karachi was one the earliest stations for many European carriers. British, Dutch and French airlines operated their for many many years, as KHI was a convenient stopover on their routes to their overseas territories.

- British Airways and its forebears BOAC / Emperial Airways operated to Karachi for the 1920's. British Overseas Airways Corporation (BOAC) began de Havilland Comet 1 jet service on London-Rome-Beirut-Bahrain-Karachi-Bombay-Colombo route in August 1952.

- KLM stopped in Karachi on its first service to Asia in 1924 and operated to KHI until the 1990s. The airline owned a crew hotel called 'Midway House', as it was half way between AMS and JKT.

- Air France - Accident DC4 Bahrain 12 June 1950 - The aircraft was on a scheduled flight from Saigon to Paris and had departed at 16:05 from a stopover at Karachi for another stopover at Bahrain.

European Airlines were forced to withdraw from KHI due to intense security situation that developed with the invasion of Afghanistan.
 
airpearl
Posts: 859
Joined: Tue May 01, 2001 7:42 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:58 am

Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 2):
The Pakistani market has been taken over by the ME3 and the likes of TK. I doubt even PIA makes any money on their EU flights. They operate them only for the purposes of prestige and presence.

Probably to an extent. But I think security is the bigger issue with Pakistan. East Asian airlines like CX, SQ and MH have also pulled out of KHI in recent years, and I don't think the ME3 had been a factor there. TG is the only remaining major airline from this side of Asia flying into Pakistan, so I don't think this aversion to serving KHI is unique to EU airlines. The ME3, with hubs located relatively close to Pakistan, are no doubt beneficiaries.
 
stylo777
Posts: 2809
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 8:15 am

As far as I remember LH served KHI back in 2008 or 2009 with A300-600s, but also cancelled due to lack of security.

The ME3 are successful, because of non-layover requirement and Pakistani population living in the ME and generating a local demand.
 
IberiaA319
Posts: 635
Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 5:40 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 12:05 pm

Quoting stylo777 (Reply 7):
As far as I remember LH served KHI back in 2008 or 2009 with A300-600s, but also cancelled due to lack of security.


The Frankfurt-Karachi-Lahore-Frankfurt flights only lasted for five months after they resumed in 2007. Karachi was suspended in March 2008, but Lahore would continue via Muscat. This was the schedule as per a thread on a.net

Quote:
LH766 FRA-KHI-LHE on days 2/4/7
LH767 LHE-FRA on days 3/5/1

Flight LH766 is leaving FRA at 10u30, arriving in KHI at 19u45,
continuing to LHE at 20u45 with arrival at 22u25 at LHE.
Flight LH767 is leaving LHE at 00u05 directly for FRA, landing
there at 06u20.


As mentioned, the Frankfurt-Lahore flights were routed via Muscat in Oman for crew change. The LH flights to Lahore were later on terminated on 25 October 2008, and Islamabad was suspended by BA one month earlier.

Quote of March 2008 with the new route via Muscat:

Quote:
KARACHI: German airline Lufthansa on Saturday, announced that it was taking out Karachi from its network, just five months after flights were resumed to Frankfurt.

“All Lufthansa flights from Frankfurt to Karachi are canceled due to lack of capacity,” the airline said in a communique. “Lufthansa will endeavour to get Karachi on the Lufthansa route map again, as soon as possible.”

The airline has also changed its schedule of Lahore-Frankfurt flights, which will now fly via Muscat after a technical stop for disembarking crew.

“Due to the current situation in Lahore and operational requirements of the airline, Lufthansa has to change the layover of its crew, and therefore, has to reroute its thrice-a-week flights from Frankfurt to Karachi and onto Lahore,” it said, adding that re-routing of Lufthansa’s Pakistan flights is a precautionary measure.

The days of operation, Tuesday, Thursday and Sunday, as well as the aircraft operated, the A300-600, remain the same.

As per the new flight schedule for the Frankfurt-Lahore sector, LH658, the flight leaves Frankfurt at 10:25 and arrives at 20:40 in Lahore. The LH659 flight leaves Lahore at 21:40 and arrives at 23:30 in Muscat for a technical stop, with no possibility to disembark. The flight leaves Muscat at 01:15(+1) and arrives at 06:36 in Frankfurt. The new schedule will be implemented from March 30 until May 29.

Lufthansa passengers of Karachi flights are currently rebooked on alternative routes through Dubai and onto Karachi. “Lufthansa tries to minimize inconveniences for its passengers as far as possible. Latest updates will be communicated immediately by the airline to all concerned.”

The German carrier had resumed flights to Pakistan last October, after a gap of almost nine years, saying the comeback decision was based on an overwhelming potential for passenger growth. It had rolled back its operations in 1998.

Source: http://www.paklinks.com/gs/travel-an...hansa-cancels-service-karachi.html
 
Turkish350XWB
Posts: 489
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:23 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 12:42 pm

Quoting lesfalls (Thread starter):
EU

By "EU" do you mean airlines located within political European Union or within the continent of Europe? There is a difference...
 
ltbewr
Posts: 15351
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 12:53 pm

Between the security situation and likely the limited revenues it makes good business sense to not operate into Pakistan by all but a few airlines. Modern airlines no longer need cities there as a refueling/stopover point and I doubt but for the most extreme circumstances would they be used as diversion airports.
 
rutankrd
Posts: 3025
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2003 6:08 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 12:57 pm

Quoting Turkish350XWB (Reply 9):
By "EU" do you mean airlines located within political European Union or within the continent of Europe? There is a difference...

In this case the reference is definitely EU/UK.

The British Foreign office warn UK carriers against flying into Pakistan on what are considered real and present threats to safety and security.

Other EU countries also consider the risk too high.

The grounds include poor vetting of airport workers and both infiltration and indeed sympathies within the Pakistani ISI secret services with the Taliban in both Pakistan and Afghanistan.

Risks include kidnap hijack and indeed criminal murder !

Karachi has a small Christian minority and they are regularly targeted.

Pakistan is an unusual case of Safety above Profit !
 
behramjee
Posts: 5119
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 3:45 pm

Actually there is some truth and false to what people have commented on this thread regarding Karachi-EU market potential.

Security concerns:

1. Yes Karachi (where I used to live) is an unsafe city but so is Lagos (where I currently live), Luanda, Nairobi, Cairo etc. When the hotels in Mumbai were attacked in 2008, not a single airline suspended their own flights to/from BOM. KHI too had the infamous Sheraton hotel bombing in 2002 where the crew of SQ got injured unfortunately.

2. Petty crimes involving cell phones happen all across the world in all major cities.

3. EU crew overnight in more dangerous African cities than KHI but then again the yields and profit margins of those African destinations would be far higher than KHI I bet.

Fact:

The market from KHI to EU is actually very small but the market from LHE + ISB to EU is 3-4 times larger in terma of annual demand. Even the demand from KHI to UK is less than half of ISB and LHE to UK.

The only three cities in the 'West' that have an annual demand of more than 40,000 P2P pax to/from KHI are JFK, YYZ and LHR. In comparison, for ISB/LHE, it includes these 3 plus MAN, BHX, CDG, BCN and MXP.

The only airline from the 'West' that actually has a small chance of making KHI a viable destination is British Airways using a B787 purely because of the P2P demand + onward feed potential to North America/UK/Western Europe.

Lufthansa could not make KHI work because of their own wrong doings by first making it a triangular route operated via LHE + using a very old AB6 whose on board product was sub standard compared to the competition.

PIA does not fly to any EU destination from KHI except LHR and MAN as far as I know currently.

Competition:

The GCC carriers now all operate double daily (EY/QR) flights into KHI where as EK is 7 times daily. This is ample capacity providing KHI passengers convenient one stop options to the West/Middle East/Africa as well as Austral-Asia.

TK currently operate a double daily B738 service into KHI and it is too much. To begin with the only reason why they are patronized in KHI is due to their very cheap fares to UK/USA/YYZ/YUL. They do not attract regular J class pax because they hate flying 6 hours KHI IST KHI on a B738. When TK operated to KHI daily using an A332, the on board product was very well received as was evident by their higher J class S/F which I too flew on 01JUN15.

LHE and ISB though only have double daily flights from EY QR EK hence the level of competition is far less versus KHI + yields overall out of LHE + ISB are much higher to the West in comparison to KHI. BA would do very well returning to ISB as well as launching a new LHE service; both of which would perform better than KHI as the higher yielding P2P LON-North PAK-LON demand level is much higher. These passengers will pay a small premium to fly nonstop rather than go via GCC as is evident by PIA's dominant market share on ISB-MAN, LHE-LHR, LHE-MAN and ISB-LHR segments.

Honorary mention:

One carrier that has really milked operating daily flights into LHE and KHI since June 2014 has been Thai Airways due to their monopoly position on the Thailand-PAK market segment plus loyal patronage for beyond markets such as KUL, CAN, SYD, MEL, PVG, NRT, HKG, ICN and PEK.

The average round trip fare between PAK and BKK on TG has been US$ 750 round trip which is nearly double of BKK-DEL/BOM-BOM ! Granted it is cheaper opting to fly UL via CMB from PAK to BKK but the travelling public of PAK has for the past 2 years proven that they are willing to pay a premium to fly 5 hours nonstop on TG rather than back track via CMB. TG's yields and SF on LHE is way better than KHI.

Malindo's entry into the KUL-LHE market segment has negatively impacted TG's KUL-LHE market share a bit but they have easily recovered by focusing more on PAK-China movement which is rising rapidly year over year.

Conclusion:

From the West, the only airline that has a chance in KHI is BA

From the West, the only 2 airlines that have a chance in LHE/ISB are BA and KLM. The latter because via AMS they can gain a big advantage feeding CPH, OSL, CDG and UK in particular along with trans-atlantic. KLM actually would do quite well flying 4 times per week ISB-AMS and 3 times LHE-AMS with an A332/B789 year round.
 
User avatar
Aesma
Posts: 13401
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 4:13 pm

An airliner was shot at (with one passenger killed) in Pakistan, I don't think that's happened anywhere else.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Skywatcher
Posts: 897
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2002 11:19 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 4:29 pm

With all due respect behramjee Pakistan is virtually a failed state. Routine market analysis is of limited value in this case. I suspect that insurance costs for EU airlines are prohibitive for Pakistani operations.
In all likelihood the economic structures of PIA and the ME3 enable different choices which the "western" and "Asian" airlines don't have. The risk/reward dynamics are different.
I doubt we'll see any EU airlines serving Pakistan any time soon. It appears that Pakistan is deteriorating steadily not improving.
 
9w748capt
Posts: 1759
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:27 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 4:40 pm

Quoting rutankrd (Reply 11):
Karachi has a small Christian minority and they are regularly targeted.

Not to mention a small Hindu minority too - well those who haven't been 1) killed or 2) forcibly converted. They're treated even worse.
 
User avatar
scbriml
Posts: 19300
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 5:51 pm

Quoting behramjee (Reply 12):


Unfortunately, there's a significant difference between Pakistan and the other 'unsafe' countries you mentioned. Nobody, and I mean nobody, trusts the Pakistani security services (government or private) to provide the required security.

[quote=Skywatcher,reply=14]With all due respect behramjee Pakistan is virtually a failed state.

With large swathes literally lawless. Remind me where OBL was hiding while the rest of the World searched for him?
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
lalib
Posts: 119
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 8:48 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:21 pm

We don't expect any EU airline to start up ops especially to/from KHI. ME3 have a strong market in Pakistan. To be honest we are not very loyal when it comes to flying with PIA.

I agree with Behramjee BA can make money flying to ISB and maybe LHE and TK should send a wide body over instead of 737.

What we need is another Asian Carrier to resume like CX the last premium airline to pull out of KHI, 4x Week HKG via BKK.

There is another deterrent (apart from the security issue) I understand our landing charges are extremely high.
 
b747400erf
Posts: 3172
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2013 4:33 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 7:33 pm

Like almost everything on this planet, ruined by extremists!
 
trent768
Posts: 183
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2016 5:32 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 8:35 pm

Quote:
The days of operation, Tuesday, Thursday and Sunday, as well as the aircraft operated, the A300-600, remain the same.

What's the config of this aircraft? Are they equipped with Euro-style C or are there some dedicated AB6 for this route with a proper C?
 
IPFreely
Posts: 2630
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 8:26 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Sun Jun 05, 2016 9:27 pm

Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 2):
I doubt even PIA makes any money on their EU flights. They operate them only for the purposes of prestige and presence.

Do people really believe stuff like this?
 
Milesdependent
Posts: 628
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2001 5:27 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 4:39 am

Quoting behramjee (Reply 12):
1. Yes Karachi (where I used to live) is an unsafe city but so is Lagos (where I currently live), Luanda, Nairobi, Cairo etc. When the hotels in Mumbai were attacked in 2008, not a single airline suspended their own flights to/from BOM. KHI too had the infamous Sheraton hotel bombing in 2002 where the crew of SQ got injured unfortunately.

Minor correction to the above. There were no injuries to SQ crew from the bombing. There was an SQ crew staying at the hotel, but they were not injured. Following the attack, SQ suspended its flights to KHI.
 
DIJKKIJK
Posts: 1871
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2003 11:03 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:26 am

Quoting IPFreely (Reply 20):
Do people really believe stuff like this?

You clearly don't know how state run carriers operate if you do not.
Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
 
IberiaA319
Posts: 635
Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 5:40 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:23 am

Quoting IPFreely (Reply 20):

Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 2):
I doubt even PIA makes any money on their EU flights. They operate them only for the purposes of prestige and presence.

Do people really believe stuff like this?

This might have been true in the past, but PIA is actually closing routes that are making a loss: PIA closed the routes to Barcelona in the 2014/15 schedule, along with Hong Kong, claiming that these were loss-making.

Authorities in Pakistan, according to this article, were asking to restore the flights to Barcelona, arguing that 200,000 Pakistanis live in Spain, but currently these remain suspended.

http://nation.com.pk/lahore/25-Feb-2...-restore-pia-flights-for-barcelona

Even until 2012 a tag on PIA flight from Barcelona to Chicago was offered, but it was cancelled as well.

It seems that PIA now prefers the code share agreement with Etihad and other partners to provide international connections.

According to PIA website, the airline is still making an operating loss despite low fuel prices but as per their reports it seems that they are targeting to make a profit in the future.



[Edited 2016-06-06 00:24:59]
 
gabrielchew
Posts: 3816
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 5:43 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:37 am

Quoting IberiaA319 (Reply 23):

This might have been true in the past, but PIA is actually closing routes that are making a loss: PIA closed the routes to Barcelona in the 2014/15 schedule, along with Hong Kong, claiming that these were loss-making.

Authorities in Pakistan, according to this article, were asking to restore the flights to Barcelona, arguing that 200,000 Pakistanis live in Spain, but currently these remain suspended.

Wasn't one of the types that PK were operating to the EU banned by the EU due to maintenence concerns? The A310? So routes that coudn't be flown by the 777 were dropped?
http://my.flightmemory.com/shefgab Upcoming flights: AMS-RIX-BUD-VDA,ETH-TLV-FCO-LHR,STN-TXL-LCY,LTN-CPH-LTN,LGW-SZG,MUC-LHR
 
IberiaA319
Posts: 635
Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 5:40 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:09 am

Quoting gabrielchew (Reply 24):
Wasn't one of the types that PK were operating to the EU banned by the EU due to maintenence concerns? The A310? So routes that coudn't be flown by the 777 were dropped?

Most of PIA's fleet was banned in 2007 in the EU do to maintenance issues and the ban was withdrawn around 2012. Currently PIA is not appearing in the list of banned airlines or partially banned aircraft by the EU, here you can check the list:

http://ec.europa.eu/transport/modes/air/safety/air-ban/doc/list_en.pdf

The suspended Barcelona flights were actually flown with the 777, but later on these were downgraded to A310 by mid-2013, due to poor passenger loads as the load on inbound/outbound was around 140-150 passengers, according to internet sites.

According to the report on PIA's website, the wet-lease of further 2 A330 are planned.

[Edited 2016-06-06 03:15:34]
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 3018
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 4:20 pm

Quoting behramjee (Reply 12):
The market from KHI to EU is actually very small but the market from LHE + ISB to EU is 3-4 times larger in terma of annual demand. Even the demand from KHI to UK is less than half of ISB and LHE to UK.

Crazy that a city nearly twice as populous as LHE and ISB combined can have less demand to the EU. Even the total passenger numbers at each airport tells the same tale. KHI handles a few million less passengers than either ISB and LHE. I find that astonishing.

KHI, 24 million people, airport handled 6.4 million passengers in 2014..
LHE, 10 million people, airport handled 9.2 million passengers in 2015.
ISB, 2.2 million people, airport handled 8.3 million passengers in 2014.

Source: wikipedia

[Edited 2016-06-06 09:35:29]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
ojas
Posts: 1193
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 10:23 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 5:51 pm

Whether a station is safe to operate or not is not necessarily based on number of attacks it had but more on internal assessments by airlines and security agencies as to how safe it would be from a potential attack and the preparedness of it. After all, even BRU airport was bombed, however I do not foresee an exodus of airlines from there.

When we say security issues, it is a risk. There are variables as to how high the risks are and costs associated and after evaluation of that; whether the station is worth operating or not. The risk vs reward scenarios in Africa maybe completely different which is why you see the likes of LOS still being operated by many airlines.
Great leaders don't tell you what to do ... they show you how it's done!
 
planeguy
Posts: 360
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2001 4:42 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:51 pm

Quoting IberiaA319 (Reply 8)



Quote:
KARACHI: German airline Lufthansa on Saturday, announced that it was taking out Karachi from its network, just five months after flights were resumed to Frankfurt.

“All Lufthansa flights from Frankfurt to Karachi are canceled due to lack of capacity,” the airline said in a communique. “Lufthansa will endeavour to get Karachi on the Lufthansa route map again, as soon as possible.”


This claim sounds eerily similar to their recent announcement regarding the suspension of CCS, merely a "temporary" suspension. Unfortunately, for strikingly similar reasons, both Pakistan and Venezuela seem to have a lot in common these days.
 
A350
Posts: 1076
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:40 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:28 pm

Quoting stylo777 (Reply 7):
The ME3 are successful, because of non-layover requirement

Isn't there an airport hotel at Karachi? And with airport hotel I mean a hotel at the airport, not near to the airport.

A350
 
Viscount724
Posts: 19316
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:11 am

Current PIA destinations in Europe (assuming EU reference in opening post was to Europe as a whole, not specifically the EU):

LHR
BHX
MXP
CPH
OSL

European airlines that have served KHI in the past, often as one of several stops on multi-stop routes to other points in Asia in the days when aircraft lacked the range for nonstop service. Might have missed one.

British Airways
KLM
Air France
Lufthansa
Alitalia
SAS
Swissair
Aeroflot

Austrian had announced plans to start service to KHI in 2007 but it never happened.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/trave...ghts/2006-11-02-austria-a330_x.htm
 
wzafar
Posts: 293
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2014 10:26 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Tue Jun 07, 2016 7:52 am

Safety is priority. Make it safe and BA may come.
 
YLWbased
Posts: 905
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 6:09 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Wed Jun 08, 2016 4:09 am

CX pulled out a couple years ago over safety concern, KHI was a money making route for them, that tells you a lot.

YLWbased

[Edited 2016-06-07 21:10:14]
Hong Kong is not China. Not better or worse, just different.
 
Ammad
Posts: 333
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:10 pm

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Wed Jun 08, 2016 11:27 pm

Quoting Thenoflyzone (Reply 26):
Crazy that a city nearly twice as populous as LHE and ISB combined can have less demand to the EU. Even the total passenger numbers at each airport tells the same tale. KHI handles a few million less passengers than either ISB and LHE. I find that astonishing.

KHI, 24 million people, airport handled 6.4 million passengers in 2014..
LHE, 10 million people, airport handled 9.2 million passengers in 2015.
ISB, 2.2 million people, airport handled 8.3 million passengers in 2014.

Data of ISB and LHE is not correct, they are 4.4 and 4.6 million respectively.

http://www.caapakistan.com.pk/upload/AT/stats/2014%20-%202015-APT.pdf
 
IPFreely
Posts: 2630
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 8:26 am

RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Thu Jun 09, 2016 12:33 am

Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 22):
You clearly don't know how state run carriers operate if you do not.

And my questions is answered. Some people are truly foolish enough to believe this. Probably not many, but at least some.
 
User avatar
CanadaFair
Posts: 1120
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 5:22 pm

Re: RE: Why Does No EU Airline Fly To Karachi?

Tue Nov 15, 2016 12:15 pm

Viscount724 wrote:
Current PIA destinations in Europe (assuming EU reference in opening post was to Europe as a whole, not specifically the EU):

LHR
BHX
MXP
CPH
OSL

European airlines that have served KHI in the past, often as one of several stops on multi-stop routes to other points in Asia in the days when aircraft lacked the range for nonstop service. Might have missed one.

British Airways
KLM
Air France
Lufthansa
Alitalia
SAS
Swissair
Aeroflot

Austrian had announced plans to start service to KHI in 2007 but it never happened.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/trave... ... a330_x.htm


There was also

Swiss International
UTA
Interflug
JAT
Tarom

one of the schedules online also show Braathens S.A.F.E flying there and Imperial Airways/BOAC.

Some third tier carriers managed to serve LHE Air Italy and Swefly while ISB had UK International.

BMI and Virgin were also interested in flying to Pakistan but nothing came of it.

Currently served include

Paris
Manchester

with Barcelona resuming in December.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos