Delta will start nonstop JFK-GLA starting May 2017. Service will be daily with a 757-200 during the summer. Assumes this means it will be less than daily if it's year-round, or even seasonal (no mention made in the press release):
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/delta-...work-scotland-route-120000368.html
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
If UA can make BFS work with DUB just down the road, no reason why GLA shouldn't be given a go. It's the right aircraft but I'm a little surprised it's DL and not AA or UA
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- simairlinenet
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- intotheair
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
My dyslexia must be acting up, as I first read this as "DL to start JFK-LGA." But to be honest, DL is crazy enough to try something like that.
Either way, DL starting JFK-GLA is exciting! UA must be worried.
Either way, DL starting JFK-GLA is exciting! UA must be worried.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting intotheair (Reply 3): Either way, DL starting JFK-GLA is exciting! UA must be worried. |
Quite possibly, as this will no doubt tie into the joint venture/codeshare with VS, so will be able to tap in to demand from both sides of the Atlantic.
edit:
sorry, this indeed confirmed in the article from the OP.
[Edited 2016-06-07 06:19:45]
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
Interesting that this is getting announced so far ahead of time. That seems to be the trend these days.
Right... The airline that has aggressively cut short hops like ATL-MCN, DTW-FNT, and MSP-STC is definitely crazy enough to try JFK-LGA...
| Quoting intotheair (Reply 3): I first read this as "DL to start JFK-LGA." But to be honest, DL is crazy enough to try something like that. |
Right... The airline that has aggressively cut short hops like ATL-MCN, DTW-FNT, and MSP-STC is definitely crazy enough to try JFK-LGA...
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
Also, JFK-EDI has already been upgauged to the 763 from the 752 for the S16 season. It was initially planned as a 752 route. I think JFK-EDI got upgauged around the time when DL decided not to fly ATL-BRU and JFK-IST this summer.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting intotheair (Reply 3): UA must be worried. |
Probably not too worried. The market can support two 757s to NYC in the high season. UA has been in GLA for nearly 20 years with year-round service, and is the largest foreign carrier (by ASM) to Scotland. Competition is a good thing, and hopefully demand to Glasgow will be stimulated as most growth lately has been to Edinburgh.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
One can hope that DTW-MAN is not far behind.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting klm617 (Reply 12): One can hope that DTW-MAN is not far behind. |
Out of interest, how much of this route do you think would be transfer traffic at DTW? I can't imagine there would be much O&D. Furthermore, instead of starting this, would it not make more sense for VS to make their recently announced MAN-JFK service year round?
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting 8herveg (Reply 13): Out of interest, how much of this route do you think would be transfer traffic at DTW? I can't imagine there would be much O&D. Furthermore, instead of starting this, would it not make more sense for VS to make their recently announced MAN-JFK service year round? |
I would say probably 60% would be transfer as DTW is the second biggest skyteam hub in the USA
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- klwright69
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting lesfalls (Reply 8): I don't think BFS does so well in the winter. I have seen them offering $300-400 on EWR-BFS(round trip) for the months of October and November. |
It's not really on the topic. But I don't believe BFS operates during the winter months of January and February. I wonder what took DL so long. CO and UA have been in the market for almost 20 years.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting FSDan (Reply 5): Interesting that this is getting announced so far ahead of time. That seems to be the trend these days. |
Especially considering the EDI flight has only just started. I would have expected them to wait until the end of the summer, and see how that performs before adding more capacity to Scotland. Forward bookings must be great!
| Quoting Polot (Reply 10): I'm aware of that. I meant more in the making UA worried aspect. It's not like UA is unable to compete. They seem to be competing just fine on EDI for example (UA remains 2x daily from EWR, at least in the summer). |
In fairness, the Delta EDI route has only been running for a couple of weeks - it's a bit early to say they are competing just fine!
| Quoting Eirules (Reply 1): If UA can make BFS work with DUB just down the road, no reason why GLA shouldn't be given a go. It's the right aircraft but I'm a little surprised it's DL and not AA or UA |
United/Continental have been flying to GLA for decades! AA have a GLA-PHL flight, although the EDI-PHL flight was switched to EDI-JFK recently, so it's surprising the GLA flight hasn't been switched too.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
Doesnt PHL have far greater connection opportunities than JFK?
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
Congratulations to DL/VS/GLA! It's nice to see that the JV has resulted in quite a bit of new service to the UK.
My understanding is that DL will continue to operate the route in the off-season, adding up to year-round service.
| Quoting 8herveg (Reply 13): Furthermore, instead of starting this, would it not make more sense for VS to make their recently announced MAN-JFK service year round? |
My understanding is that DL will continue to operate the route in the off-season, adding up to year-round service.
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- 11725Flyer
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
One wonders how the whole Brexit situation may unfold in Scotland if voters do indeed vote to leave the EU.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting 11725Flyer (Reply 23): One wonders how the whole Brexit situation may unfold in Scotland if voters do indeed vote to leave the EU. |
I *think* the current referendum is completely separate from the previous Scottish Independence Vote (2014, failed 45-55), so we cannot end up in a scenario where parts of UK stay while the other parts leave. Logically, it should be all-or-nothing.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
There were some weird city pairs pre-Open Skies, including BOS-GLA on a Northwest DC-10 in 1989. I don't know how long that lasted although I can recall a DC-10 DTW-BOS that provided the craft for BOS-GLA.
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- slcdeltarumd11
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting intotheair (Reply 3): Either way, DL starting JFK-GLA is exciting! UA must be worried. |
good old a.net. yeah i am sure the LONG established carrier with way more feed on the US side is worried just because Delta is entering the market. im just playing but you get my point, delta is the ones who will have the harder time, UA is long establishedRE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
I remember flying JFK-GLA on a BA L-1011 and even deplaned using airstairs from the forward right hand door in GLA. That was a great flight, I miss the L-1011's!
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting klm617 (Reply 12): One can hope that DTW-MAN is not far behind. |
Although has AA run ORD-MAN for years, I suspect that this is less likely. VS is pretty strong in the midlands and can drive the point-of-sale from MAN. But even with that, DTW doesn't have significant local demand and the VS routes from MAN (actually all VS routes in general) are based on O&D. Therefore the question is, what markets can DTW provide that aren't already connected to JFK or ATL and do those cities bring enough demand to fill a 767? Despite the "dartboard" DL is actually very judicious about adding new routes, especially international and will start with the smallest plane and generally been trying to run TATL connecting traffic through JFK and ATL with TPAC through SEA and DTW. Hence that is where you will see them start new cities from and only when they are sure of strong O&D will they add another hub. Sure you can buy a connection to Europe through DTW, MSP, etc. but unless you are west of Denver more often than not, you'll find that the connecting flow is through JFK/ATL.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting toltommy (Reply 31): There's a finite number of int'l 757s. Is something getting cut to free up the plane for this route? |
I don't think there is any shortage of international 757 aircraft in any season right now. AGP, EDI, and CPH are all 767-300ERs in the high season now instead of 757s, and in the low season, there are plenty of 767-300ER block hours if you need to swap a 757ER off of a transcon turn at JFK to fund a transatlantic rotation.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
aren't there multiple ex Chinese 757's coming Delta's way for this very purpose, as I expect the 763 landscape to change significantly next summer...
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting toltommy (Reply 31): Quoting Sightseer (Reply 20): My understanding is that DL will continue to operate the route in the off-season, adding up to year-round service. There's a finite number of int'l 757s. Is something getting cut to free up the plane for this route? |
Currently the route is loaded as a 763 for the winter, albeit at 5x/week instead of daily.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting by738 (Reply 28): BOS -GLA on NW was not pre open skies. |
Pretty sure the service went to PIK until the mid-80s. There was a BOS-GLA seasonal nonstop and a BOS-SNN-GLA route as well. It was all gone by the mid '90s when the BOS gateway was dismantled. But it all pre-dated US-EU open skies, which replaced the very-much-not-open-skies Bermuda II agreement. To be fair, the 1995 revision to Bermuda II did allow for open skies from the US to any UK airport other than LHR and LGW, although the point is moot here since NW had stopped flying from BOS to the UK by then.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting N717TW (Reply 30): Although has AA run ORD-MAN for years, I suspect that this is less likely. VS is pretty strong in the midlands and can drive the point-of-sale from MAN. But even with that, DTW doesn't have significant local demand and the VS routes from MAN (actually all VS routes in general) are based on O&D. Therefore the question is, what markets can DTW provide that aren't already connected to JFK or ATL and do those cities bring enough demand to fill a 767? Despite the "dartboard" DL is actually very judicious about adding new routes, especially international and will start with the smallest plane and generally been trying to run TATL connecting traffic through JFK and ATL with TPAC through SEA and DTW. Hence that is where you will see them start new cities from and only when they are sure of strong O&D will they add another hub. Sure you can buy a connection to Europe through DTW, MSP, etc. but unless you are west of Denver more often than not, you'll find that the connecting flow is through JFK/ATL. |
DTW-MAN could be done with a 757 and there are many cities in the midwest region that would I'm sure be much more happy transferring at DTW than either JFK or ATL all depends on if they want to enhance the travel experience for passengers traveling in the upper Midwest region and everything west of Detroit.
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- skipness1E
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting by738 (Reply 28): BOS -GLA on NW was not pre open skies. |
Open skies with the Netherlands and the KLM JV helped kill NWA in Scotland, at the same time as STAR ALLIANCE being formed helped UNITED and later AIR CANADA get out of GLA.
The market changed, no longer did US carriers need to serve these airports on their own metal to be in these markets. British Midland helped feed UNITED and Air Canada over LHR and KLM fed NWA via AMS. American's eventual tie up with BA was years in the future and so they ploughed on for a few years more, but their European network was a fraction of it's former size until recently with the consolidation of US/AA.
Air Canada is now back seasonally but it's the leisure focussed fleet, and the days of a five weekly B767 serving the business market in the Scottish winter are long gone. Like SNN, the B757 seems to be the ideal aircraft for this market.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
Interesting that they would not upgauge EDI to, say, a 767-400 / A330-300 to cover the Scottish market and instead opted to serve two cities that are mere 50 miles apart..
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- skipness1E
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
American, United, Air Canada Rouge and now Delta all know you can't get the bulk of the market from the other side of the country. Which brings me to Emirates......#flees
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting vfw614 (Reply 39): nteresting that they would not upgauge EDI to, say, a 767-400 / A330-300 to cover the Scottish market and instead opted to serve two cities that are mere 50 miles apart.. Yes they are only 50 miles apart,however the type of market they are is totally differant USER PROFILE SEND INSTANT MSG ADD TO RESP USERS |
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
But does that really mean that if a longhaul airline does not serve GLA people would rather take a connecting flight via LHR or AMS instead of flying nonstop from EDI ?
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
well thats not strictly true. A large number from the west are being diverted by travel agents to fill ME services ex EDI along with numbers of One world aviosers using the QR service with connections thru DOH. Equally postcode surveys for the past few years confirmed many from East using EK, hence the probable interest from EK at EDI (though with QR snd EY there in a much smaller catchment than other ME battlezones, I cant see it in near futurr myself. I do find it odd that eg TOM have never found need to offer a proper long haul leisure service from EDI rather than 3 or 4 high season to SFB.
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- skipness1E
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
Also found it odd Air Transat just walked away from EDI-YYZ, it's always been like this. People fly from their local airport, so Continental used to offer GLA-EWR-xyz but lost out to BA offering EDI-LHR-xyz for example. So COA launched EDI and now it's a much bigger station, 3 daily B757s in summer versus GLA's daily EWR.
Competition had been good for Scotland, as for the ME3, well the consumer is winning.
Competition had been good for Scotland, as for the ME3, well the consumer is winning.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting vfw614 (Reply 39): Interesting that they would not upgauge EDI to, say, a 767-400 / A330-300 to cover the Scottish market and instead opted to serve two cities that are mere 50 miles apart.. |
| Quoting vfw614 (Reply 42): But does that really mean that if a longhaul airline does not serve GLA people would rather take a connecting flight via LHR or AMS instead of flying nonstop from EDI ? |
Yes, pretty much. But also bear in mind that United already fly to New York from Glasgow, so there are already non-stop options from Glasgow in this particular case.
| Quoting skipness1E (Reply 45): Also found it odd Air Transat just walked away from EDI-YYZ, it's always been like this. |
Air Transat pulled out of Scotland when Globespan ended the contract with them and started offering their own flights from EDI/GLA. They only just recently returned to Glasgow, hopefully EDI will return in the future too.
RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
Reminds a little bit of CGN and DUS here in Germany. Although most of the CGN folks do not seem to be so dogmatic when it comes to taking long-haul flights from DUS.
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- skipness1E
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RE: Delta To Start JFK-GLA Summer 2017
| Quoting nighthawk (Reply 46): Air Transat pulled out of Scotland when Globespan ended the contract with them and started offering their own flights from EDI/GLA. They only just recently returned to Glasgow, hopefully EDI will return in the future too. |
No, they stayed at GLA and fought GSM toe to toe.
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