Hello all, hoping someone can shed some light on a curious situation going on here at YYZ.
Air France's Daily flight AF356/351 is currently using a HiFly A340-500, and is scheduled to use it for the next 3 days as well. Word I have is it is due to a pilot strike, however, other AF flights seem to be operating normally, anyone have any idea. (The spotter in me is not complaining, but the ops guy is certainly curious!)
My thinking was as follows; AF has never really been able to carve out any sort of real dominance on YYZ-CDG, AC run 2-3 daily flights compared to 1 on AF, and they have TS to compete with as well running more then daily in the summer. I figured, if it was strike related, why not just cancel and re-route passengers?
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- SpaceshipDC10
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RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
| Quoting whywhyzee (Thread starter): I figured, if it was strike related, why not just cancel and re-route passengers? |
Reroute through which airport/airline and how many empty seats are there at this time of year? Perhaps was it easier to lease in capacity than attempt to reroute passengers.
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
Looks most likely due to the AF pilots strike for sure as its a wet lease for three days only. In addition AC in peak summer flies double daily CDG flights from both YUL and YYZ where as in winter season it's always daily.
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
If it is due to the strike, why is YYZ the only (or one of the only) stations affected?
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- Viscount724
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RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
| Quoting whywhyzee (Reply 3): If it is due to the strike, why is YYZ the only (or one of the only) stations affected? |
It was probably a route where it was most difficult to rebook passengers on cancelled flights with most flights this time of year close to full.
News reports say AF cancelled 7% of longhaul flights, 9% of domestic flights and 27% of medium haul flights on Saturday.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36506035
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
I agree with most and would add lots of people from yyz transit in cdg to other cities on AF.
YYZ is important to AF.
KLM has 2 flights during the summer from YYZ wonder if AF could do thee same.
YYZ is important to AF.
KLM has 2 flights during the summer from YYZ wonder if AF could do thee same.
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
| Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 4): It was probably a route where it was most difficult to rebook passengers on cancelled flights with most flights this time of year close to full. News reports say AF cancelled 7% of longhaul flights, 9% of domestic flights and 27% of medium haul flights on Saturday. |
Cool, thanks for the insights.
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- clrd4t8koff
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RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
| Quoting YYZAMS (Reply 5): |
How does that make sense?
DL/KL/AF have a JV TATL. You say KL is 2x YYZ-AMS during summer and you wonder if AF should be 2x to CDG, which is why they're subbing in the HiFly plane. Yet you say YYZ is important to AF and you intimate AF is only canceling international flights thus far to YYZ. Conversely, BOS has 5x AF/KL/DL flights (2x AMS, 3x CDG) and none appear to be affected. So ask yourself again how important is YYZ to AF?
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
| Quoting clrd4t8koff (Reply 7): How does that make sense? |
I have to agree with what you postulate. Normally, I tend to be rather steadfast in my evaluations, I swayed a little today, but evidently I'm not the only one questioning the significance of YYZ to AF. No doubt its a large market, with 4-5 daily flights, but only one on AF, the simple answer is competition. Since we have effectively confirmed that this is a result of the pilot strike, I conclude that YYZ was chosen as one of the cancellations because it's a market where AF has less to lose. BOS doesn't have the competition YYZ does, AF/DL have the market, and likely don't want to lose what they have to connections or otherwise. It seems as if this is an example of limiting one's losses when caught between rock and hard place. Of the AF-KLM hubs, AMS seems to be the more important from that side, CDG may see more traffic, but AMS has KLM as the dominant player, though TS, Arke and AC also serve AMS from YYZ.
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
| Quoting whywhyzee (Reply 8): Of the AF-KLM hubs, AMS seems to be the more important from that side, CDG may see more traffic, but AMS has KLM as the dominant player, though TS, Arke and AC also serve AMS from AF/KL hubs at CDG and AMS: 1. In pure size the two hubs do not differ all that much (+/- 10%): Airport Passenger data last 12 months May 2015 - Apr. 2016: - AMS 60.191.433 pax - CDG 66.060.992 pax 2. In transfer traffic the two hubs differ much more substantially - Transfer Pax Year 2015: - AMS 23.032.592 pax - CDG 11,416,397 pax So though AMS is a smaller airport than CDG, AMS is over 2x larger in transfer traffic. And....just to update you on YYZ-AMS operations in S16: - KLM 12x week - Jet Airways 7x week - AC 7x week - TS 4x week - TUI 2x week [Edited 2016-06-12 00:08:33] RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
It sure was the right choice for the passengers & that is better than scrambling for middle seats on TATL flights, spread out over multiple routings for a plane load of passengers. Borrowing an A-345 for a few days seems to be the logical choice vs 100's upon 100's of passengers being inconvenienced all to one city. I'm sure YYZ is as important to AF as are many of AF's other destinations with a single daily frequency. 707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This WeekIn Canada, YUL is much more important than YYZ. YUL is the 2nd most important AF long-haul international station (JFK is first)
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This WeekI might add that it's a great looking aircraft ... Here it is at OSL :
HiFly Airbus A345 at Oslo Airport Norway http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1NMpoAigjo
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
I've seen the same HiFly A340 on a CDG - COO flight also Next trip : BOD - AJA - BOD - AMS - AUH - CDG - BOD - WAW - KRK - WAW - BOD - NCE - BOD - MRS - BOD - GVA - BOD - NCE - BOD - ZRH - ATH - JTR - JMK - HER - ATH - FRA - BOD - AMS - SIN - DPS - LOP - DPS - LBJ - DPS - SIN - AMS - BOD
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This WeekThat A345 operated some flights for DY too. Is AF having trouble with aircraft because they rushed retirements of the 747?
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
Have you read the rest of the thread?
RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
But how do yields compare? I would guess that AF yield is higher from YYZ than YUL as there is probably more premium business traffic connecting beyond CDG. RE: Air France Using HiFly A345 To YYZ This Week
Montreal is the worlds second largest french speaking city after Paris, that fact alone assures plenty of traffic. One thing people from Quebec are known for is connections to the old country, so it wouldn't surprise me if there is a decent amount of business traffic between the two. That being said, it is most certainly a predominantly leisure route, but sheer volume alone might make up for the nature of the route, there is likely premium demand by way of there being so much demand. Some of it is bound to be premium. Who is onlineUsers browsing this forum: Armadillo1, Baidu [Spider], Baruch, bevan7, BW985, Channex757, CWL757, DALCE, davidjohnson6, DH106, DocGATTACA, Marara, melpax, nordify, opticalilyushin, rbavfan, Rolls, seansasLCY, Snowman14, SoCalPilot, SQ352, tjerome, trinidadeG, utaussiefan, Wingtips56, workhorse and 272 guests
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