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na
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Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 8:52 pm

Focus Money, a German news magazine, says that Japan is short of ordering a sizable number of Airbus A330/340s. What a surpris! Bad news for Boeing in two ways: First because that this shows that obviously the 777 doesn´t mean everything to JAL and also because that makes it more likely that some A380s are within reach suddenly!
 
hkgspotter1
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 9:10 pm

If true this is fantastic, but how do we know this is true ??

May be this is Japans way of saying `Thanks a bunce' for your stupid Sub stunt'
 
WorldTraveller
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 9:39 pm

This doesn't make sense to me at all and I don't believe it.

I don't see Japanese carriers order the A380 either, Japan's ties to Boeing/US government are too close.

Best regards
the WorldTraveller
 
cedarjet
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 10:11 pm

Impossible. They'll need the A380 OR the 747X Stretch, but if anyone is going to go for the 747XS it's JAL. As for the rest of the Airbus fleet, no way. I'd be less surprised if Drukair ordered the A380.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
b757300
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 10:27 pm

This makes about as much sense as Southwest order 25 A380's.
"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
 
Guest

RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 10:33 pm


Well, the press release does exist and is from AFP. (I have it in a pdf file I can't copy/paste it here...It
says that the information is disclosed in the
previously mentioned german magazine (out Thursday).

Wait for March if there is an announcement from JAL...
Then you'll know who was right or wrong...

E.
 
b757300
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 10:35 pm

This is probably JAL trying to play Airbus against Boeing in order to get a better deal on either 777's or the 747X.
"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
 
stephen007
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 10:48 pm

any speculations whether JAL will place the A330/340s on international routes or domestic ones?
 
rabenschlag
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 11:08 pm

Dont they have to replace some DC10 or even MD11 somedays? Could the A340 / 330 replace them with respect to size and range?


Rabenschlag.
 
Airbus_A340
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 11:17 pm

This is great news if they do get some A330's/A340

They do have some MD-11's if i recall and 767's..Possibly A330/A340 as a replacement would be the best reasoning as Rabenschlag said.

Regards
Trevor aka Airbus_A340
I HOPE ITS TRUE!
People. They make an airline. www.cathaypacific.com
 
stephen007
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 11:25 pm

doesn't B777s fit rather nicely as replacement for MD-11s on international flights? why a sudden shift towards Airbus. JAL has never operated ANY airbus types before! I am particularly surprised that the airbus order was not one with A380s. And has JAL B767-200s been replaced ?
 
samspain
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 11:44 pm

I agree with B757300... I dont see any Airbuses flying under JAL's colors
 
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RayChuang
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 11:48 pm

Fat chance JL will order the A330/A340 series.

The reason is simple: several Japanese companies build substantial fuselage components for the 777. JL would be better off buying more 777-300's for their domestic routes and 777-300ER's for their international routes.

Besides, the seating arrangements of the A330/A340 series are too small for JL's needs.
 
Guest

RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Wed Feb 21, 2001 11:55 pm

World Traveller

I don't see Japanese carriers order the A380 either, Japan's ties to Boeing/US government are too close

In rebutting this particular argument, I will use one word, and one word, only (well actually it is an acronym)

QANTAS!!


B757300

This makes about as much sense as Southwest order 25 A380's

As usual, you present a well thought out, and articulate argument, with facts which support your stand. Keep it up. P.S. I have nominated that piece of work for this years Pullitzer Prize  Insane
 
l'espace180
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 12:09 am

G O O D N E W S ! !

I hope it is true !!!!!!!!
 
OO-AOG
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 12:40 am

If they intend to replace the 767s and MD11, the Airbuses would be a perfect choice. But I don't really see it happening. The A380 on the other hand would be interesting for them.
Falcon....like a limo but with wings
 
Trvlr
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 12:57 am

The recent 767/777 order was intended to replace the Md11s, so this order would probably have nothing to do with replacing anything.

Aaron G.
 
Guest

RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 1:06 am

Just as Trvlr said, JAL has just finished an order for 767s and 777s to replace MD-11s. And as Ray said: "Fat Chance" they will.
-Tom
 
Kangar
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 1:20 am

I'd imagine one or two expletives would be passed around the Boeing boardroom were this to succeed, but I'd doubt it will, simply because it seems too much of a goundswell for JAL to go through with, although stranger things have happened.............
 
Guest

RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 1:25 am

I would want to see a Japanese press release for something like this. Germany is just too much of a coincidence with Airbus and all. If it was reported in the Seattle papers that JetBlue was buying b757s, I would feel the same way.
 
Guest

RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 1:49 am

No press release from JAL's side yet.

Would be fun to see what happens... JAL has been adding a bunch of routes to SEL.  Smile
 
Guest

RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 2:22 am

There you can see what sinking a fishing boat can do.... Geez!!! But the civilians where closely supervised... LOL.
 
cba
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 2:32 am

As many have already said, this is highly unlikely. JAL just recently placed a 767/777 order to replace their MD-11's. Also, this is coming from the German press, not JAL itself. If anything, this is JAL's attempt to get a better deal on the 777's.
 
F4N
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 2:59 am

Brissie lions: While your point about Qantas is well taken, I would suggest that it hardly represents a serious rebuttal to WorldTravellers' statement. While it is true that Qantas, a longtime Boeing customer, selected Airbus in preference to the Boeing offerings, the circumstances with regard to Qantas, Boeing and Australia are far different than those of JAL, Boeing and Japan.
While Boeing indeed is a supplier of defense equipment to the Australian gov't, a supplier of civil aviation equipment and services to your domestic aviation industry and has industrial subsidiaries and partners in Australia, that similar arrangement is of far greater scope and consequence to all parties in Japan. Boeing has engineered an extensive participation agreement with
Japanese industry. That arrangement is of particular importance to the Japanese aviation and defense industries and, by default, the Japanese government.
Big ticket purchases of US aviation and defense products are ways of maintaining good relations and politics with the US, while benefitting Japan anyways.
I would also point out that Boeing and its Japanese allies are at the present time trying to conclude a co-production arrangement for 747x wings in Japan, something that Boeing's unions are vehemently opposed to and in which they have something to say. While I believe that this will eventually be arranged to the satisfaction of all, it is very difficult then to imagine the circumstances under which the Japanese gov't would agree to an Airbus widebody order from JAL.
The political and economic fallout would be considerable.
While JAL may actually be considering A330/340 series a/c, the long term economic and political liabilities of such a buy would probably outweigh any advantage these planes could offer JAL on its' network and is also why I believe 747x will fly in Japan.

Best regards,

F4N
 
b757300
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 3:02 am

It never fails, I make a joke mentioning Airbus and someone has to come back with some smart-ass comment.
"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
 
JAL
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 3:13 am

It doesn't make sense for JAL to order A340/330. I don't see JAL ordering any Airbus planes coz they have been a loyal Boeing cusotmers throughout their history.
Work Hard But Play Harder
 
cwapilot
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 4:01 am

The submarine comments are, in a word, IGNORANT. That is not to mention that the whole situation is irrelevant to this discussion. The comments do prove that, although Americans receive a lot of flack for supposedly being ignorant about the world, there is plenty of stupidity everywhere else in the world.

Southside Irish...our two teams are the White Sox and whoever plays the Cubs!
 
cedarjet
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 5:47 am

F4N, spot on. Buying Airbus would not benefit the Japanese or the Americans. If there is even the slightest grain of truth to the rumour, it's just Japan doing some bargaining. Boeing may have even asked JAL to put this about to scare their own unions into allowing Japanese production of the wings. "If you don't go along with this, Japan will order Airbus." Unions immediately fall into line.

Something no-one else has mentioned is how heartwrenchingly gorgeous the A330 and A340 would look in JAL livery. Stunning stuff. Anyone with a better grasp of Adobe Photoshop care to have a go?
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
Joni
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 6:38 am


Cwapilot,

How do you know the submarine incident is irrelevant? Deals have been made and cancelled for similar incidents in the past.

With regard to the 330/340 rumour, I naturally can't say if they are true. However, selling Airbus planes to Japan is probably not as impossible as some here would believe, since Airbus is just setting up a rather costly sales programme specifically to sell planes to Japan. I don't think they'd waste that money if they didn't have a realistic chance of success.
 
Guest

RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 6:44 am

Joni,
The submarine accident would not cause a sudden change in aircraft supplier all of a sudden. Why should it, anyway?
Also, JAL has just agreed with Boeing to be its parts network supplier. The article is on thier site. Also about AIs efforts to set up a program in Japan, don't think JAL has to be attracted to AI just over that. ANA currently operates A320 series aircraft, there are more airlines on Japan other than JAL.
-Tom
 
KLM747
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 7:46 am

Oh, I liked it when JAL was a all Boeing airline, now they are going Airbus. I hope those Airbus work well with them.  Big grin

KLM747 Big grin
 
User avatar
RayChuang
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 8:02 am

I think people are really forgetting some practical reasons why JL will NOT order the A330/A340 series.

Remember, JL and NH tends to fly pretty high-capacity planes on their international routes and heavily-used domestic routes such as HND-CTS, HND-FUK and HND-OKA. Unfortunately for Airbus, the A330-300 has nowhere near the seating capacity for "Japanese domestic" operation of the 777-300's and 747-400D's used by JL and NH. Also, will Airbus spend the extra money to strengthen the A330 airframe for the heavy-cycle Japanese operations?
 
magyar
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 8:05 am


These rumours of JAL being interested in A380
are mounting. I hope there is something behind them.

Although most likely this article is basically bullshit, but,
most of us know that airbus is working hard to have
a Japanese costumer for the A380. I would not be
surprised if they were willing to give a very sweet deal,
which might include VERY, VERY cheap A330/340
(a la qantas). So, if JAL buys the A380 (which I am not
sure about) they may end up with some A330.

Maybe there is something going on in the
shadow and some over zelous journalist got some info,
but not everything, and they filled in the gaps as they usually
do. Hence, the article.

Janos
 
Archie Bunker
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 8:18 am

Perhaps the Hitler diaries will be included in the deal...oops! wrong publication, right country though.  Big grin
 
johnnybgoode
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 8:47 am

although japanese airlines certainly have major demand for plane like the 747-400D or the 777-300, why should this exclude an airplane like the a-330??? somehow it seems that some people don´t think that the a-330 is a suitable aircraft for the japanese market. of course, it seems strange fleet-wise because both ANA and JAL are major 777 costumers, but i´m sure they know what they´re doing.
there are not only high-density routes in japan. ANA has some a-320s/321s, some JAL express thing has 737s, and i believe some JAL subisidiary has even CRJs.
i agree, that the a-330s are obviously not going to replace any bigger planes, but an aircraft of that size could certainly supplement the japanese carriers.
btw, once ANA had an order for some a-340s, but they cancelled them some day and changes them into additional orders of the a-32Xs.

regards
daniel
If only pure sweetness was offered, why's this bitter taste left in my mouth.
 
Victor Hotel
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 12:16 pm

I really dont see JAL ordering A330/340 aircraft. I do however think it is possible that maybe in a few years to come they may order the A380 for domestic operations, they are already using high capacity 747 400D's on domestic routes. They may decide to purchase this aircraft, for more capacity and possibly lower fares to compete with the bullet trains in which there is a lot of competition between. That is just my opinion though.
VH
 
DatamanA340
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 3:34 pm

For JAL over a half of fleet is 747, but also 767 dominates fair part. If the board thought 330 is good as successor of old 767s, it can go and go. And 333 can take 767's role in domestic and short-haul international, as like in KE.
Basically I don't see any firm reason, but it's looked to be better to wait for JAL's official comment. I won't make any opinion for this rumor. (However, I really cannot see the needs for 340s, because 332 has enough range and when JAL wants 330 it'll make long-haul fleet by 332/3-777-744. 346 looks to be useful, but it competes with 773. If JAL wanted 346 it didn't order more 777s.)
Don't forget JAL is highly privatized company, at least than most of European flag carriers. Although it is loyal enough for Boeing, it's capitalismic business.
 
Joni
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 10:30 pm


King767,

I didn't say the submarine accident would cause the Japanese to buy Airbus widebodies, I just commented that should it do so it wouldn't be overtly surprising. Things like that have happened in the past.



 
United Airline
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 10:40 pm

The chance is.......... very low

Maybe they are trying to get a better deal with Boeing's B 777s as well as B 747X Stretch. They are very happy with Boeing's B 777s as well as B 747-400s.

Besides, they made a statement stating that the A 380 is not what they really want.

Just my two cents


Des
 
JAL
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RE: Surprise:JAL To Order 15 A340/330

Thu Feb 22, 2001 11:20 pm

The 3 main japanese carriers just announce that they don't have immediate plans to buys plane from Airbus.

Beside, like some have already said they are very satisfied with their B777 and B747.
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