71Zulu
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Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:06 am

Thought it would be fun to look back at the airline world 30 years ago in the USA and compare the fleets to what they have today as well as look at the ones no longer with us. Info is from the book Modern Commercial Aircraft published 1987 and I think I've corrected a couple of errors printed in the book but corrections are welcome.

Air Cal
8 x B733
23 x B732
2 x B731
6 x 146-200

American Airlines
2 x B747SP
10 x DC-10-30
46 x DC-10-10
(+25) x A300
(+15) x B763ER
13 x B762
9 (+8) B762ER
125 x B722
39 x B721
83 (+37) x MD-80

America West
6 (+3) x B752
5 (+21) x B733
25 (+12) x B732
4 x B731

Braniff
22 x B722

Continental
6 x DC-10-30
6 x DC-10-10
6 x A300
50 x B722
14 x B721
16 x DC-9-30
11 x DC-9-10
23 (+additional) x B733
15 x MD-80

Delta
35 x L-1011
13 x DC-8-71
15 x B762
(+9) x B763
19 (+41) x B752
102 x B722
33 x B732
36 x DC-9-30
(+30) x MD-80

Eastern Air Lines
24 x L-1011
32 x A300B4
2 x A300B2
22 (+5) B752
95 x B722
32 x B721
21 x DC-9-50
58 x DC-9-30

Midway Airlines
7 x B732
11 x DC-9-30
9 x DC-9-10

New York Air
9 (+additional) x B733
6 x MD-80
19 x DC-9-30

Northwest Airlines
(+10) x B744
20 (+3) x B742
6 x B742F
12 x B741
20 x DC-10-40
23 (+10) x B752
74 x B722
9 x B721
(+10) x A320
8 x MD-80
28 x DC-9-50
64 x DC-9-30
34 x DC-9-10
13 x Convair 580

Pacific Southwest Airlines
31 x MD-80
4 x DC-9-30
20 (+4) x 146-200

Pan American World Airways
7 x B742
36 x B741
12 x A300
7 x A310-200
(+12) A310-300
(+16) A320
38 x B722
12 x B732

Piedmont Airlines
34 x B722
19 (+17) B733
63 x B732
45 x F28

Presidential
8 x B732
6 (+9) x 146-200

Southwest Airlines
17 (+15) B733
46 x B732

Trans World Airlines
20 x B741/B742
35 x L-1011
10 x B762
56 x B722
26 x B721
19 x MD-80

United Airlines
(+6) x B742
13 x B741
11 x B747SP
7 x DC-10-30
44 x DC-10-10
6 x L-1011
29 x DC-8-71
19 x B762
104 x B722
50 x B721
10 (+100) x B733
74 x B732

US Air
10 x B722
21 (+27) x B733
23 x B732
70 x DC-9-30
(+20) F28-100
20 x BAC-111

Western Airlines
9 x DC-10-10
38 x B722
13 x B733
28 (+14) x B732
 
barney captain
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:09 am

That. Was. Awesome.

Thank you!

Can you clarify the (+) number? What does that refer to?
Southeast Of Disorder
 
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Spiderguy252
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:26 am

barney captain wrote:
That. Was. Awesome.

Thank you!

Can you clarify the (+) number? What does that refer to?


Forthcoming orders, I presume.
Vahroone
 
71Zulu
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:28 am

barney captain wrote:
Can you clarify the (+) number? What does that refer to?

Orders in place at that time.

Your company has grown just a tad in 30 years I would say! :D



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keesje
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:35 am

Interesting thanks. Pre regulation fleets.
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
barney captain
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:50 am

71Zulu wrote:
barney captain wrote:
Can you clarify the (+) number? What does that refer to?

Orders in place at that time.

Your company has grown just a tad in 30 years I would say! :D



Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk



Just a bit! Thanks for sharing!
Southeast Of Disorder
 
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MD80
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:24 am

Lovely!
Dedicated for the MD-80, MD-90, MD-95 ehhh...Boeing 717, and DC-9: http://www.MD-80.com
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:24 am

71Zulu wrote:
Thought it would be fun to look back at the airline world 30 years ago in the USA ....

I've consolidated your list somewhat (meh, it's what I do - if you don't like it, bite me!)

You have a total of just over 3000 a/c (3071 give or take)
Just 8% are nasty foreign imports
In contrast 2828 are US made (92%) <US flag> :hyper:

Unfortunately, nearly 2000 (70%) of those were Boring Boeing, and that situation was about to get even worse.

Of the oddballs; the French A300s just beat the Dutch Fokkers (71 vs 65) with the poor old Brits knocked into last place (45x HS146)

The old guard are represented by some super quiet DC-8s (re-engined -71s), and a handful of ultra noisy BAC-1-11s
The even older guard comprised Northwest's CV-580s and DC-9-10s - are you sure about both those types, in '87?

The storm on the horizon.... that's the two barely significant orders for a grand total of just 26 Airbus A320. :rotfl:

That's all folks. :spin:
I promised myself I'd leave before the party turned ugly. I would quit at 1000 !
Here I am stuck at 994; each time I'm tempted to post, I find myself wondering who will even read it / what is the point?
Or maybe I've just got nothing left to say.
 
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millionsofmiles
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:40 am

Definitely a walk down memory lane. I spent all of 1986 and 1987 in the Lower Lobe galley of AA's formidable DC-10-10 fleet. I went to the International Operation in 1988 and worked the DC-10-30s, both those with Main Deck Galleys (mostly Air NZ and KLM) and those with Lower Lobe Galleys (former Pan Am). In 1988, and several times throughout the years, I had the pleasure of working N142AA, which I flew as a child when she was brand spanking new with National Airlines as N83NA "Timmi."

I am very lucky to have avoided flying the Super 80 and now, as the fleet dwindles, was permitted to drop my qualification.
 
rbavfan
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:40 am

You forgot TWA DC-9's from Ozark merger in 1986 that were flying in 1987.
4 MD-82, 3 DC-9-40, 36 DC-9-31/32, & 7 DC-9-10's.
 
shankly
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:21 am

100 L1011's in service.....happy days

Where World operating any scheduled services in 1987?
L1011 - P F M
 
afcjets
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:26 pm

I would add TranStar Airlines with their fleet of purple MD80s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TranStar_ ... _Hobby.jpg

Piedmont also had 767s which they launched on 6/15/87. They had 4 by the end of the year and a total of 6 by the time of the merger with US in 8/89.
 
santi319
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:47 pm

Pics would be great! It looks like there was more competition back them amazingly... lots of legacies too!
 
midway7
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:54 pm

A lot of 727's in the skies back then! Those were the days!
 
71Zulu
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:02 pm

TranStar Airlines
(not in the book but from planespotters)
7 x DC-9-50
8 x MD-82
2 x MD-83

Trans World Airlines
(corrected)
20 x B741/B742
35 x L-1011
10 x B762
56 x B722
26 x B721
4 x MD-82
19 x MD-80
3 x DC-9-40
36 x DC-9-30
7 x DC-9-10
 
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MD80
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:30 pm

71Zulu wrote:
Trans World Airlines
(corrected)
20 x B741/B742
35 x L-1011
10 x B762
56 x B722
26 x B721
4 x MD-82
19 x MD-80

3 x DC-9-40
36 x DC-9-30
7 x DC-9-10


I had the impression, that all MD-80s of TWA were MD-82s with the first four MD-83s delivered in 1987?

Regards
Dedicated for the MD-80, MD-90, MD-95 ehhh...Boeing 717, and DC-9: http://www.MD-80.com
 
Chuska
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:38 pm

Not to mention the cities that were large hubs at the time like STL with TWA, and PIT with USAir. And the frequency of commuter flights they had on Trans World Express and USAir Express. If you have a chance to glance thru a pocket OAG, unbelievable! What I really liked was the small cities that had large jets and today they have next to nothing. Going back a little further to October, 1982, Ozark was running DC-9's into places like Mason City and Fort Dodge, Iowa and Frontier was all jet running 737's into Farmington, NM and Riverton, WY among many others.
 
71Zulu
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:48 pm

Here is Air Canada, nice fleet!

Air Canada
2 x B742
3 x B741
8 x L-1011-100
6 x L-1011-500
7 x DC-8-73F
14 x B762
36 x B722
35 x DC-9-30
 
afcjets
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 2:05 pm

Air Atlanta
Alaska
Aloha
Hawaiian
MGM Grand Air
Midwest Express
Last edited by afcjets on Sat Dec 23, 2017 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
71Zulu
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 2:07 pm

afcjets wrote:
Air Atlanta
Aloha
Hawaiian
Midwest Express

None are in the book surprisingly.

We will have to figure it out.
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 2:32 pm

71Zulu wrote:
afcjets wrote:
Air Atlanta
Aloha
Hawaiian
Midwest Express

None are in the book surprisingly.

We will have to figure it out.

Is there nobody here with a copy of "JP"? I'm sure I've got a few old copies up in the attic, covered in dust.

And here's an old thread bemoaning it's ultimate demise.
viewtopic.php?t=822271
I promised myself I'd leave before the party turned ugly. I would quit at 1000 !
Here I am stuck at 994; each time I'm tempted to post, I find myself wondering who will even read it / what is the point?
Or maybe I've just got nothing left to say.
 
Cody
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 2:47 pm

This was my favorite book growing up. It is where I first learned that United had L1011's (from Pan Am) and Midway bought Air Florida.

A few interesting things I noticed:

The Continental fleet does not reflect the PEOPLExpress/Frontier merger. Missing are the 737's. It was February 1, 1987 when NY, PE, and FL were folded under the CO umbrella. Also noteworthy is the fact that Continental only operated 27 DC-9's which I assume all came from Texas International. So an airline with a fleet of 27 airplanes bought a company the size of Continental!

The Eastern fleet does not display the 3 DC-10's that came on board in 1985. In fact, I think by 1987 they were down to 2 of them. One used from LAX-MIA-Buenos Aires-Santiago and the other used from JFK-MIA-Buenos Aires-Santiago with rare appearances at SJU, BOS, ATL, and Panama City.

Northwest Convairs did indeed exist as a left over from the Republic merger. It was so neat to see a Northwest Convair in MKE parked by a Northwest 747.

Mainline America West Dash 8's. Three years later they would operate them along side of 747s!
 
Virtual737
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:13 pm

midway7 wrote:
A lot of 727's in the skies back then! Those were the days!


Was just thinking the same.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:24 pm

Sort of surprised DL and EA are the only 757 operators, as well as the number of 721s still flying.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
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Revelation
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:37 pm

keesje wrote:
Interesting thanks. Pre regulation fleets.

Pre-regulation? Not sure what point you are trying to make. US airline de-regulation happened in 1978. This snapshot is from 30 years ago, so 1987.

SheikhDjibouti wrote:
The storm on the horizon.... that's the two barely significant orders for a grand total of just 26 Airbus A320. :rotfl:

Spot on. The best replacement for all those 727s was the A320, at least until the 738 came out and gave it some competition. Boeing really stepped on its dingus. They dorked around with concepts like 7J7 for far too long. The fox was in the hen house by the time they got their act together. Oh well, I guess there's some benefits to a nice comfortable duopoly.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has it's beaches, it's homeland and thoughts of it's own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own
 
rlwynn
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:45 pm

I can see now why I was tired of always being on a 727.
I can drive faster than you
 
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N62NA
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:48 pm

What a great idea for a topic. This was a great year (still) for being able to fly on (and spot) a wide variety of aircraft.
How come I can't upload an avatar photo to my profile?
 
Bingo1
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 4:21 pm

Ah 1987. The year I had my first airplane trip. A very young kid and an airplane trip. Of course I remember. It was from either FAR or GFK with a plane change in DEN (Stapleton) and then on to ELP all on Continental. Something tells me that the ND to DEN leg was a bit of a milk run as I remember a stop or two on the way.
As a kid flying through a hub like DEN it would appear like there were 100's of gold tails there but in reviewing those fleet numbers there obviously wasn't that many.
Planecrzy
 
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jsnww81
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 6:41 pm

I had this same book (Modern Commercial Aircraft) as a kid and I remember the fleet listings well! I used to pore over those for hours. I have a version of the book from 1981 that's just as interesting (and has Braniff in it!) ... I'll have to post it when I get home in a few days.
 
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MoKa777
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:56 pm

Why so few 757?
Never be proud. Always be grateful.
 
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American 767
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:01 am

DeltaRules wrote:
Sort of surprised DL and EA are the only 757 operators, as well as the number of 721s still flying.


NW also. NW got its first 757 in 1985 not long after DL and EA did.

Ben Soriano
 
Cunard
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:13 am

shankly wrote:
100 L1011's in service.....happy days

Where World operating any scheduled services in 1987?


World Airways 'were' operating scheduled flights in 1987.

At least as far as transatlantic flights are concerned World Airways initially started DC10-30 operations from BOS to LGW in April 1980 on a temporary 12 month award license which was transferred a year later to Northwest Orient with B742.

In exchange World Airways was awarded BWI to LGW which started in May 1981 with an extension to FRA, these flights were still around in 1987.
 
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MD80
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 2:22 am

MoKa777 wrote:
Why so few 757?


After initial orders for the Boeing 757, the commercial success of Boeing 757-sales was relatively disappointing. Early customers received their 757s and continued to receive them, while some Asian companies as well as European charter operators opted to take the Boeing 757. In some important tenders, the Boeing 757 lost - mainly because the Boeing 757 was seen as too large to be used economically.

The number of deliveries sharply increased, after American and United ordered large numbers of Boeing 757s and an attractive number of additional sales were made.

My contribution:

Aero Lloyd:

3 x Caravelle 10B
3 x Douglas DC-9-32
2 x McDonnell Douglas MD-83

Until the end of 1987, the following customers introduced the MD-80:

AirSur, Aviaco, BIA, China Eastern Airlines (CAAC), Delta Air Lines, LAC, Minerve, Paramount Airways, Spantax, Transwede

Austrian Airlines and Finnair introduced their first MD-87s and Iberia made huge headlines in December 1987 with a long awaited fleet-renewal order, including a decision to order 15 Airbus A320s, 17 McDonnell Douglas MD-87s and eight Airbus A340s.

Regards
Dedicated for the MD-80, MD-90, MD-95 ehhh...Boeing 717, and DC-9: http://www.MD-80.com
 
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MoKa777
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 2:49 pm

MD80 wrote:
MoKa777 wrote:
Why so few 757?


After initial orders for the Boeing 757, the commercial success of Boeing 757-sales was relatively disappointing. Early customers received their 757s and continued to receive them, while some Asian companies as well as European charter operators opted to take the Boeing 757. In some important tenders, the Boeing 757 lost - mainly because the Boeing 757 was seen as too large to be used economically.

The number of deliveries sharply increased, after American and United ordered large numbers of Boeing 757s and an attractive number of additional sales were made.

My contribution:

Aero Lloyd:

3 x Caravelle 10B
3 x Douglas DC-9-32
2 x McDonnell Douglas MD-83

Until the end of 1987, the following customers introduced the MD-80:

AirSur, Aviaco, BIA, China Eastern Airlines (CAAC), Delta Air Lines, LAC, Minerve, Paramount Airways, Spantax, Transwede

Austrian Airlines and Finnair introduced their first MD-87s and Iberia made huge headlines in December 1987 with a long awaited fleet-renewal order, including a decision to order 15 Airbus A320s, 17 McDonnell Douglas MD-87s and eight Airbus A340s.

Regards


Thank you for that excellent information!
Never be proud. Always be grateful.
 
Bingo1
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 4:18 pm

Pacific Western (just prior to merger in Mar 1987)
2 x 733
19 x 732
Planecrzy
 
Bingo1
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 4:48 pm

71Zulu wrote:
Here is Air Canada, nice fleet!

Air Canada
2 x B742
3 x B741
8 x L-1011-100
6 x L-1011-500
7 x DC-8-73F
14 x B762
36 x B722
35 x DC-9-30


Just slightly different then what AC list on their website for their fleet count at the time of their 50th anniversary in 87.

5 x 741
14 x 1011-100
8 x DC-8
35 x DC-9
33 x 727-220
14 x 767-200

http://moments.aircanada.com/timeline/1 ... -big-year/
Planecrzy
 
71Zulu
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 6:12 pm

AeroMexico
3 x DC-10-30
2 x DC-10-15
5 x DC-8-50
9 x MD-80
16 x DC-9-30
8 x DC-9-10

Mexicana
5 x DC-10-15
40 x B722
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:14 pm

71Zulu wrote:
Thought it would be fun to look back at the airline world 30 years ago in the USA

It's your thread, so apart from the ambiguous title, you can set your own criteria.
Since your opening post, where you listed every major US airline, we've had Air Canada, Pacific Western, Aero Lloyd (from Germany??) and now AeroMexico & Mexicana.

Not surprisingly, I'm a little confused, and clearly I'm not the only one.

Are we only considering US airlines?
Are you including Canada, because it's a big part of North America.
Are you including Mexico, because it isn't..... :lol:

Just asking, because FWIW Aurigny's fleet has changed quite a bit since '87; for a start they are no longer operating the Trislander
I promised myself I'd leave before the party turned ugly. I would quit at 1000 !
Here I am stuck at 994; each time I'm tempted to post, I find myself wondering who will even read it / what is the point?
Or maybe I've just got nothing left to say.
 
71Zulu
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:32 pm

SheikhDjibouti wrote:
It's your thread, so apart from the ambiguous title, you can set your own criteria.
Since your opening post, where you listed every major US airline, we've had Air Canada, Pacific Western, Aero Lloyd (from Germany??) and now AeroMexico & Mexicana.

Not surprisingly, I'm a little confused, and clearly I'm not the only one.

Are we only considering US airlines?
Are you including Canada, because it's a big part of North America.
Are you including Mexico, because it isn't.....

Just asking, because FWIW Aurigny's fleet has changed quite a bit since '87; for a start they are no longer operating the Trislander

I regret limiting it to the USA but can't edit the first post now, it should have been open to all airlines and I would like to add some more.




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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Flashback 1987

Sun Dec 24, 2017 9:03 pm

71Zulu wrote:
I regret limiting it to the USA but can't edit the first post now, it should have been open to all airlines and I would like to add some more.

Er, wow. That's opening up a huge box of trouble.
e.g.
Ryanair (1987) - just two types;
1 x EMB110 Bandeirante - 1
1 x HS748
Ryanair (2017) - still just two types;
481 x B738
110 x 737MAX (on order)

But it's not all about the UK. There's Yugoslavia to consider (JAT, Aviogenex, Inex-Adria, etc), and Interflug from somewhere called East Germany, with it's eclectic mix of Il-18, Il-62, & Tu-134.
Plus several other national flag carriers, such as Sabena, Swissair, Balkan Bulgarian Airlines, Olympic Airways, Whatever happened to all of them? Is there any point listing their fleets? Thank goodness that Alitalia is still going strong. :rotfl:

And that's just Europe; don't even get me started on Nigeria Airways or VIASA Venezuela.

The world is truly a different place, and many airlines are unrecognisable compared to what is listed back in '87.
I'll leave it to others here to name their favourites; I wouldn't know where to even start. :spin:
I promised myself I'd leave before the party turned ugly. I would quit at 1000 !
Here I am stuck at 994; each time I'm tempted to post, I find myself wondering who will even read it / what is the point?
Or maybe I've just got nothing left to say.
 
71Zulu
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Re: Flashback 1987

Wed Dec 27, 2017 10:17 am

Air France
17 (+1) x B742
15 x B741
13 x A300B4
4 x A300B2
6 x A310-200
8 x Concorde
29 x B722
(+25) x A320
14 x B732
2 x Transall C-160
15 x Fokker F27

British Airways
(+16) x B744
15 (+1) x B742
16 x B741
6 x L-1011-1
3 x L-100-50
8 x L-1011-200
2 x L-1011-500
7 x Concorde
24 (+2) x B752
43 x B732
21 x Bac-111-500
5 x Bac-111-400
6 x BAe 748

Alitalia
12 x B742
8 x A300B4
18 (+6) MD-80
20 x DC-9-30
 
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aeromoe
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Re: Flashback 1987

Thu Dec 28, 2017 5:53 pm

SheikhDjibouti wrote:
71Zulu wrote:
Thought it would be fun to look back at the airline world 30 years ago in the USA ....


The even older guard comprised Northwest's CV-580s and DC-9-10s - are you sure about both those types, in '87?

That's all folks. :spin:


Yes, the merger with Republic (source of the CV-580s, DC-9s, some 727-200s and RR-powered 757s) had just occurred. The RR 757s fairly quickly went to America West. The DC-9s soldiered on for a long time...including DC-9-10s and others well into the 2000s. Hell, the DC-9-50s were still around with the NW merger into Delta.
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