zrs70
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Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Thu May 03, 2018 5:52 am

First F class slowly fading away, I am curious about the evolution of three cabin flights. When business class first entered the market, were there any carriers that originally maintained only two cabins (either F/Y or C/Y)?
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Flanker7
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Fri May 04, 2018 7:57 pm

Yes KLM did. C and Y
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zrs70
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Fri May 04, 2018 8:17 pm

Flanker7 wrote:
Yes KLM did. C and Y


I thought KLM was the first, or one if the first, to offer the C product while keeping F.
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United Airline
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Sun May 06, 2018 3:48 am

Nowadays premium economy class is becoming business class while business class is becoming first class. First class will definitely remain with some airlines but they are becoming suites.

KLM? VS?
 
Ionosphere
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Wed May 09, 2018 3:20 pm

Continental was one of the first airlines that merged First & Business into one cabin, BusinessFirst in 1992. TWA followed in 1995 with Trans World One.
 
Alexdk
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Wed May 09, 2018 3:42 pm

United Airline wrote:
Nowadays premium economy class is becoming business class while business class is becoming first class. First class will definitely remain with some airlines but they are becoming suites.

KLM? VS?


I think this is true for the airlines that have premium economy, business, but not first. For airlines that have first, business class is often skewed towards premium economy (like BA).
 
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FlyRow
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Wed May 09, 2018 10:38 pm

zrs70 wrote:
Flanker7 wrote:
Yes KLM did. C and Y


I thought KLM was the first, or one if the first, to offer the C product while keeping F.


KLM had a period when they operated Business, Royal Class and Economy. However soon after the NW-venture they introduced World Business Class and the F-product was removed.


**check, I found a news article stating that Royal Class will be removed in the DC10's and that the plane will only have Business and Economy. So KLM did have F/C/Y . Seating was 12F/45C/193Y and then 45C/240Y . In Dutch: https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/1991/07/08/klm-schrapt-royal-class-in-dc-10-6973226-a986733




Would Aeroflot be a good option?
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steveinbc
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Thu May 10, 2018 1:08 am

Air Canada to my knowledge has never had a first class and they actually branded their business class as "executive first" for many years.
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northstardc4m
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Thu May 10, 2018 1:58 am

steveinbc wrote:
Air Canada to my knowledge has never had a first class and they actually branded their business class as "executive first" for many years.


Air Canada did have full F/J/Y on 747s and L1011-500s:

http://www.departedflights.com/ACL151091.html

http://www.departedflights.com/AC7441092.html

http://www.departedflights.com/AC7421092.html

Got removed in the 94ish revamp that created Executive First.
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steveinbc
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Thu May 10, 2018 2:05 am

Thanks northstar. Very interesting
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usdcaguy
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Thu May 10, 2018 3:23 am

From what I can tell, NW did not really have a first class that was beyond what they eventually offered in business class. Basically, I do not see where they had anything like TW where they would have had a first class, an Ambassador class and an economy class. It's possible the first class seats became World Business Class once NW decided they needed to sell it as such to corporate customers.
 
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FlyRow
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Thu May 10, 2018 12:11 pm

usdcaguy wrote:
From what I can tell, NW did not really have a first class that was beyond what they eventually offered in business class. Basically, I do not see where they had anything like TW where they would have had a first class, an Ambassador class and an economy class. It's possible the first class seats became World Business Class once NW decided they needed to sell it as such to corporate customers.


You have to remmeber that in the early days business class was nothing more then Full-Fare-Economy, maybe with a few little perks.
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Re: Did any legacy major airline ever NOT have F/C/Y (one C was established)

Thu May 10, 2018 1:16 pm

northstardc4m wrote:
steveinbc wrote:
Air Canada to my knowledge has never had a first class and they actually branded their business class as "executive first" for many years.


Air Canada did have full F/J/Y on 747s and L1011-500s:

Also on the 767-200ER. It held only 169 people in an F/J/Y configuration.

But domestically, after the F/Y configuration was removed, the 727, A320 and (eventually) DC-9 became J/Y only.
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