Lufthansa wrote:It's actually not that complex. At the time QF had a lot of 747s. They had their mainline fleet down to 3 types. 747, 767 and 737. This proved popular with passengers and efficient in terms simplification. BA was a 20 percent shareholder and WANTED qf to order the 777 as it could do the longer runs to the Americas. At the time on a few key routes there was only one competitor... the jewel in the crown was LAX. UA flew 1 flight a day on the 744 LAX SYD, and another that hooked up(to combine pax) was MEL-LAX SFO. Also 744. prices where expensive, even not counting inflation. You couldn't get a business class ticket for less then $10 000. The only real other competition was from Air NZ but that meant via AKL. This was a cash cow for QF to LAX. It was cheaper to fly them to LHR... significantly longer and tying up more aircraft than LAX.
The network was based around a series of key cities. London Heathrow, Hong Kong, Singapore, and Los Angeles. At this point QF was an all Boeing airline.
Then a couple of things changed. Ansett failed(so domestic needed to be expanded), and Singapore ordered the A380 and stated its first route was Sydney. Airbus was desperate at any price to get inside Qantas. They saw a few opportunities. The then newly formed Jetstar needed bigger aircraft fast. Ansett had left a pool of A320 pilots unemployed that weren't doing much. Qantas needed to use the 767 on a lot more domestic routes due to slot restrictions in Sydney. SQ kept on advertising heavily of their upcoming service being amazing.
So QF knew it had to match the A388 service on the LHR route. However it was only about 5 percent more to operate to lax than the 744. Airbus knew this was there one chance to break into the company in a big way.... so with the A380 order it threw its initial batch of A330s to them rediculously cheap as part of the deal, and at a similar time did a deal on A320s for Jetstar. The A330s were perfect for Asia. Only slightly more fuel burn than the 767s they replaced on the routes. But more cargo and pax capacity. They could make it to HNL. And they allowed the 747s to be retired from transcon routes.
Airbus did a similar thing with the old Northwest Airlines and hence now delta is a big airbus operator.
So in short.... in a strategic move, Airbus swooped in at a time QF had to react to several issues and made them an offer too good to refuse.
If SQ never ordered the A380, I'm sure things would be different today.
caliboy93 wrote:I find this a mystery, it seems strange that Qantas has never ordered the 777. What do you guys think?
Scanorama wrote:Right now it seems it's down to B777-8x and the A350-900ULR.
LAX772LR wrote:Scanorama wrote:Right now it seems it's down to B777-8x and the A350-900ULR.
It's been publicly released that the A359ULR is out of the running.
Airbus is proposing an A35K with the -ULR modification for Project Sunrise.
jfk777 wrote:The interesting thing about Qantas NOT ordering the 777-200ER is that it was one of the original " Gang of Eight" which helped Boeing design the plane. The other seven gang of eight did order the 777-200ER. The eight were the US3, BA, JAL, Cathay, ANA and Qantas. Qantas could have used a smaller plane for flying to SFO and from Brisbane to LAX then a 744 in the 1990's. One fleet issue Qantas had is their 744 were Rolls powered which are the least desirable in the market, GE 744's are much more desired. It would wonderful to see Qantas order 777-9 for A380 replacements and 777-8 for the LHR & JFK nonstop flights. 787-10 would be great for A330 replacements into Asia.
FlyDeltaJetsATL wrote:I think QF never intended to order the 777 and never will. Sunrise will go to an ULR variant of the 351. Why were QF part of the group of eight given the would be ETOPS limitations on 777s on the QF network back then? Who knows why.
RyanairGuru wrote:but in the 2000s when the 747-400ERs were still only a couple of years old and the A380 and 787 were coming in a couple of yesrs there was not really any scope for the 777 in their fleet (whether the ERs should have ever been ordered is a separate question, although they were attractive from a commonality perspective)
QF93 wrote:RyanairGuru wrote:but in the 2000s when the 747-400ERs were still only a couple of years old and the A380 and 787 were coming in a couple of yesrs there was not really any scope for the 777 in their fleet (whether the ERs should have ever been ordered is a separate question, although they were attractive from a commonality perspective)
Can you remind me, were the -400ERs purchased primarily to operate MEL-LAX to give the range and unrestricted payload year-round, or was it some other reason?
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