x1234
Topic Author
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Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:45 pm

I was wondering just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL business to Africa!? As the leading US airline to Africa I heard rumors that its very profitable. They now serve the most routes including Dakar (DSS), Accra (ACC), Lagos (LOS) and Johannesburg (JNB). I read on here that Johannesburg is a gold-mine for Delta. Any chance of expansion into Cape Town (CPT) or is United's new service too much competition!? Delta's main competition to Africa is limited with service mainly to the Arabic North Africa (Casablanca (CMN), Cairo (CAI)), Kenya Airways to Nairobi (NBO, SkyTeam partner) and SAA to Dakar (DSS), Accra (ACC) and Johannesburg.
 
hohd
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:53 pm

ET (Ethiopian) flies to JFK and other cities in N. America.
 
x1234
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:03 pm

Oh yes I forgot about Ethiopian, they serve Abidjan (ABJ) from JFK, Lome (LFW) from EWR continuing onto Addis Abba and also service to ORD, YYZ & IAD (West-bound fuel stops @ DUB due to ADD high elevation).
 
evanb
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:25 pm

x1234 wrote:
I was wondering just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL business to Africa!? As the leading US airline to Africa I heard rumors that its very profitable. They now serve the most routes including Dakar (DSS), Accra (ACC), Lagos (LOS) and Johannesburg (JNB). I read on here that Johannesburg is a gold-mine for Delta. Any chance of expansion into Cape Town (CPT) or is United's new service too much competition!? Delta's main competition to Africa is limited with service mainly to the Arabic North Africa (Casablanca (CMN), Cairo (CAI)), Kenya Airways to Nairobi (NBO, SkyTeam partner) and SAA to Dakar (DSS), Accra (ACC) and Johannesburg.


The margins are amongst the highest in the Delta long haul network, although I'd also note the high cost base for these routes compared to the rest of the network. So while profitability may be high, the risk from the high cost base is also significant which will always limit expansion.

They had much more ambitious plans several years ago. They flights to CAI (until 2011, although not sub Saharan Africa), ROB (until 2014), ABV (until 2012) and CPT (until 2009) in addition to plans to fly to LAD and NBO. They're now left with the big three: JNB, ACC and LOS, and the off one out: DDS (only twice a week).
 
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chepos
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:29 pm

I love these threads, mostly people guessing and going on anecdotal evidence. Even some supposedly in the know, throwing information based on a info from a friend, married to the uncle of a DGS worker in ATL. That being said, anybody with the actual data is not going to he providing this type of info on an internet forum. Regarding CPT, I am sure you remember that DL has already been there, done that, don’t see them rushing back just because UA is launching a seasonal flight.


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modesto2
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:32 pm

I remember several years ago when South Africa hosted the World Cup, and apparently ATLJNB was basically printing money. DL added a 2nd flight to JNB during that event. Special events aside, that route has a lot of business traffic which keeps the front cabin full.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:59 pm

chepos wrote:
I love these threads, mostly people guessing and going on anecdotal evidence. Even some supposedly in the know, throwing information based on a info from a friend, married to the uncle of a DGS worker in ATL. That being said, anybody with the actual data is not going to he providing this type of info on an internet forum. Regarding CPT, I am sure you remember that DL has already been there, done that, don’t see them rushing back just because UA is launching a seasonal flight.


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DL's CPT service, when it operated (2007-2009 or thereabout) was actually a JFK/ATL-DKR-CPT service and used a combination of 767-300ER/767-400ER aircraft. Two significant stage lengths, some extended ground time at CPT and limited traffic between DKR and the USA making it an easy route to axe for DL.

I've heard the DL service between JFK and ACC is the most profitable of DL's Africa network.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:15 pm

chepos wrote:
I love these threads, mostly people guessing and going on anecdotal evidence. Even some supposedly in the know, throwing information based on a info from a friend, married to the uncle of a DGS worker in ATL.


We can keep hoping people will learn to ask better questions, and, better yet, do their own research.

We can infer that routes are doing well if:

- they extend seasonal routes
- they increase to daily service
And/or they upgauge aircraft.

But it's just inference: U.S. carriers don't cite profitability by route.
 
dstblj52
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Sat Jan 04, 2020 9:02 pm

Ed bastian is on record as saying ATL JNB is one of the most profitable route in the system. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RsBK2-NxvU&t=905s
 
IPFreely
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Sat Jan 04, 2020 9:12 pm

evanb wrote:
The margins are amongst the highest in the Delta long haul network, although I'd also note the high cost base for these routes compared to the rest of the network. So while profitability may be high, the risk from the high cost base is also significant which will always limit expansion.


What are the margins and how do they compare to the highest margin domestic routes?
 
IPFreely
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:30 pm

IPFreely wrote:
evanb wrote:
The margins are amongst the highest in the Delta long haul network, although I'd also note the high cost base for these routes compared to the rest of the network. So while profitability may be high, the risk from the high cost base is also significant which will always limit expansion.


What are the margins and how do they compare to the highest margin domestic routes?


Still curious about this.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:33 pm

IPFreely wrote:
IPFreely wrote:
evanb wrote:
The margins are amongst the highest in the Delta long haul network, although I'd also note the high cost base for these routes compared to the rest of the network. So while profitability may be high, the risk from the high cost base is also significant which will always limit expansion.


What are the margins and how do they compare to the highest margin domestic routes?


Still curious about this.


This is highly proprietary and confidential information—those that know aren’t talking, those that talk, don’t know.
 
IPFreely
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Re: Just HOW profitable is Delta's TATL Africa business!?

Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:25 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
IPFreely wrote:
IPFreely wrote:

What are the margins and how do they compare to the highest margin domestic routes?


Still curious about this.


This is highly proprietary and confidential information—those that know aren’t talking, those that talk, don’t know.


Usually high margin business attracts competition in droves (in any business, not just airlines). The fact that UA and AA have not built much of any operation in Africa indicates the margins may not be that high. I have to think they have good market information even though Delta's specific numbers are confidential and no doubt closely held. evanb's post implies some "inside" knowledge of both revenue and costs on Africa routes. Perhaps he's just guessing.

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