cloudboy
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6000ft and no chimes

Fri Jul 05, 2019 11:40 pm

Was on a domestic US wide body flight today into New York. I was watching the flight map and noticed that we were well below 10,000 ft and the chime had not gone off - the flight attends were idly chatting, still lots of glasses and such in the cabin, no note about seatbacks and such. I decided I was going to wait until we hit 6000 ft and then hit the call button to let the flight attendants know, figuring the captain had forgot. It was just above - 6300 ft, when he made a kind of urgent announcement for the cabin crew to prepare the cabin. We seemed to spend some time vectoring around before landing, so everything got picked up and such.

Was it none of my business to worry about such things? Should I have rung the FAs? I am particularly curious what flight crew - both cockpit and cabin - think about this.
"Six becoming three doesn't create more Americans that want to fly." -Adam Pilarski
 
jetmatt777
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Fri Jul 05, 2019 11:43 pm

I would think most would find it annoying to bring it up.

If you see a panel on the wing come off, yeah might want to bring that up as there’s likely no indication to the flight deck. But most would not appreciate being instructed on procedures from a bystander.
Lighten up while you still can, don't even try to understand, just find a place to make your stand and take it easy
 
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September11
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Fri Jul 05, 2019 11:48 pm

I guess everything was going perfect and nice for the entire crew.... teamwork.
Airliners.net of the Future
 
cruiseshipcrew
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 12:01 am

I was on a United 777 from BRU-IAD that was landing in rainy weather with very low clouds. The flight crew never made any announcements or dings. I was in business class and thought that we were pretty low for the galley to not be put away yet as dishes, glasses etc were on the counter, carts were out etc. I made a comment to the F/A that I thought we were almost on the ground but I don't think they realized or understood. About a minute later we made it through the clouds and the F/A said, "Gary we are low...Gary we are very very low" and I have never seen a sprint to put dishes away so fast. A few items were not locked and once we landed I would say about two carts worth of items were shattered on the galley floor. The F/A made a comment that the crew sometimes forgets to make the announcements and of course it had to happen on a day where they couldn't see the ground.
James - Road Warrior
 
rbavfan
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 12:19 am

jetmatt777 wrote:
I would think most would find it annoying to bring it up.

If you see a panel on the wing come off, yeah might want to bring that up as there’s likely no indication to the flight deck. But most would not appreciate being instructed on procedures from a bystander.


I disagree. Noting to them that we were at 6000 ft and you had not heard the chime to prepare the cabin for landing. Thought you might want to know in case the pilot miss the callout. That is concern for all the passengers and crew after not hearing any warnings, It's not telling them what their procedures are, it's noting them the pilot might have missed it, as they are human, so the FA's don't have to rush and are not getting behind and having to rush. To say nothing when the pilot might have missed the notation would be the proper thing to do. After all have you ever forgot something that caused a delay for someone?
 
Lrockeagle
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 12:22 am

(Joking) Always be sure you let the crew know you’re ready to help if needed and you have lots of hours on FS
Lrockeagle
14 years ago

I got $20 says AA takes their 787's with GE powerplants. Just a hunch. Any takers?
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 12:26 am

Just what crews need, passengers thinking they are the crew. Maybe the pilots should poll the passengers on what cruise level is flown or whether to take the visual or fly an ILS.


GF
 
departedflights
Posts: 47
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 12:34 am

As an actual flight attendant, I can honestly say that it is quite annoying to realize that we are well below 10,000 feet and we have not yet started cleaning up and securing the cabin for arrival because the pilots have "forgotten about us."

It DOES happen and I don't think very many of us would mind at all if a passenger brought it to our attention. I think it would actually be most appreciated since we are often not looking out the window or watching the inflight map.
 
catiii
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:05 am

cloudboy wrote:
Was on a domestic US wide body flight today into New York. I was watching the flight map and noticed that we were well below 10,000 ft and the chime had not gone off - the flight attends were idly chatting, still lots of glasses and such in the cabin, no note about seatbacks and such. I decided I was going to wait until we hit 6000 ft and then hit the call button to let the flight attendants know, figuring the captain had forgot. It was just above - 6300 ft, when he made a kind of urgent announcement for the cabin crew to prepare the cabin. We seemed to spend some time vectoring around before landing, so everything got picked up and such.

Was it none of my business to worry about such things? Should I have rung the FAs? I am particularly curious what flight crew - both cockpit and cabin - think about this.


“Urgent” is a purely subjective interpretation. What you may deem as urgent may not have been urgent at all.

Maybe he knew he had vectors coming and thusly knew there was more than enough time to prepare the cabin. Maybe he already told that to the inflight crew on the phone.

Or maybe, just maybe, he was testing you to see what you would do.
 
catiii
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:10 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Just what crews need, passengers thinking they are the crew. Maybe the pilots should poll the passengers on what cruise level is flown or whether to take the visual or fly an ILS.


GF


“I was watching on the inflight map and cross referencing our approach to flight radar on the inflight WiFi and overlaying weather from weather.com, when I noticed that we took a routing in the departure that no one else was taking. Should I have let the flight attendants know that the flight deck was exercising questionable judgement? It all seemed to work out though as the flight was smooth and we arrived safely and 15 minutes early.”
 
USAIRWAYS321
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:12 am

This post might be peak A.net. Holy cow.
 
n6238p
Posts: 423
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:14 am

The only thing you did wrong was not stick your head into the cockpit at deplaning and let the pilots know how much they screwed up and how you’re gonna report them on Instagram.
To actively root against anybody is just low, and I hope karma comes back at you with a vengeance
 
N757ST
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:34 am

The pilots forgot and they’d eventually figure it out. Worst case the flight attendants will figure it out when the gear comes down. Chillaxe and enjoy your flight.
 
Busyboy2
Posts: 64
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:53 am

cloudboy wrote:
Was on a domestic US wide body flight today into New York. I was watching the flight map and noticed that we were well below 10,000 ft and the chime had not gone off - the flight attends were idly chatting, still lots of glasses and such in the cabin, no note about seatbacks and such. I decided I was going to wait until we hit 6000 ft and then hit the call button to let the flight attendants know, figuring the captain had forgot. It was just above - 6300 ft, when he made a kind of urgent announcement for the cabin crew to prepare the cabin. We seemed to spend some time vectoring around before landing, so everything got picked up and such.

Was it none of my business to worry about such things? Should I have rung the FAs? I am particularly curious what flight crew - both cockpit and cabin - think about this.


Not your problem. You worry too much.
 
N757ST
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:59 am

n6238p wrote:
The only thing you did wrong was not stick your head into the cockpit at deplaning and let the pilots know how much they screwed up and how you’re gonna report them on Instagram.


Lol... yup. Back in a previous life I had a hero private pilot that decided he needed to tell me that on approach to 15 in DCA I had overflown prohibited airspace over the pentagon. I thanked him and told him as soon as he deplaned I’d turn myself in.

Why can’t people just allow professionals to do their jobs. Whatever.
 
Chemist
Posts: 540
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 4:04 am

N757ST wrote:
The pilots forgot and they’d eventually figure it out. Worst case the flight attendants will figure it out when the gear comes down. Chillaxe and enjoy your flight.


I was on a flight once where one of the flight attenants wasn't even sitting down yet when we touched down on the runway.
 
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CrimsonNL
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:04 am

Had it just the other day when the seatbelt sign was switched on, descending through 2800ft. There wasn't much left in the cabin to do but still the flight attendants had to rush to do their checks.
Always comparing your flown types list with mine
 
VSMUT
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:37 am

I've done it as low as 3000 ft once, on some short flights always at 5000 ft. We briefed it with the cabin crew prior and took weather conditions and approach into consideration. On a short flight with busy service, they need all the time they can get. On the other hand, I've done steep approaches where 10.000 ft wasn't even close to enough time.
For some airports, the arrival takes you down below 10.000 ft far, far out. Sometimes you will be stuck below 10.000 ft for a long time during departure (Often happens in London). Do you want to halt all service 45 minutes prior to landing and after takeoff? In Geneva you can intercept the ILS 30 miles out, well above 10.000 ft.

The 10.000 ft rule is one of those things that desktop pilots are pushing into aviation as a universal standard, that really shouldn't be so. Seat belts and cabin crew signals should be given according to actual conditions and common sense. 10.000 ft is an okay rule of thumb for an overworked and/or inexperienced pilot on an average approach, but that's about it. It doesn't even make sense - it was 10.000 ft MSL everywhere I've seen it. What if the airport is at 3000 ft? What if the airport at 3000 ft is surrounded by 9000 ft mountains?

cloudboy wrote:
Was it none of my business to worry about such things? Should I have rung the FAs? I am particularly curious what flight crew - both cockpit and cabin - think about this.


It was none of your business. For all you know, the pilots did it deliberately.
 
spacecadet
Posts: 3416
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:49 am

Never tell another person how to raise their kids or do their job. Basic rules of life.

You don't know why the chime didn't go off. The pilots don't need passengers reminding them of their own procedures. They've trained for years on those procedures - have you?
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
 
twicearound
Posts: 132
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:56 pm

Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 11:36 am

I would leave the crewing of the aircraft to the crew. Unless it's a life or death emergency that the crew isn't already aware of, you're just a passenger
 
BravoOne
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 2:13 pm

n6238p wrote:
The only thing you did wrong was not stick your head into the cockpit at deplaning and let the pilots know how much they screwed up and how you’re gonna report them on Instagram.


LMAO on this so typical ANET post. We were deplaning in SFO many years ago when one of the passengers who had been giving the FA's a hard time over something I forget, passed the cockpit door and commented that the approach looked to be "to fast". Without skipping a beat the F/O looked back at the S/O and told him to "write the airspeed indicator at row 31, as it indicates on the high side". I think we all broke into a laugh at that point.
 
n6238p
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 2:39 pm

It’s really hard to hold our tongues when these comments happen but lately my go to response has been a very concerned “oh no that’s terrible!” It really throws the pax for a loop because they have no idea how to respond to that. They’re expecting an argument or some I told ya so moment and I won’t let them have it.
To actively root against anybody is just low, and I hope karma comes back at you with a vengeance
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Sat Jul 06, 2019 2:45 pm

Another reason airline pilots earn their pay—the customers!
 
acechip
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Mon Jul 08, 2019 10:29 am

Some years ago I was on aB767 flight from CVG to JFK.
While landing, I thought we were a bit high and fast since we braked all the way till the end and swerved around a bit , enough to hold on to our seats tight and for a dead-heading pilot sitting next to me make a grimacing expression. I asked him if we were a bit too “ fast” and he acknowledged wryly..citing weather conditions, ( which to me looked ok).
 
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longhauler
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:49 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Another reason airline pilots earn their pay—the customers!

This is a very important point. While we would like to think otherwise, quite often pilots are in the Public Relations business!

If a passenger has a pseudo-technical question for you when deplaning, quite often he is not looking for an answer as much as he is trying to show you how much he knows too! Even more so if he is with his spouse/SO, trying to impress them too.

I see absolutely no reason to humiliate him in front of his peers. Let him have his day. It's not like the old "mine is bigger than yours" argument! I find there is always a way to graciously acknowledge his question with an answer that agrees with his suggestion, but politely shows why it might not be, or not have been possible.

With regard to the 6000' query. Where I fly, we are allowed to have the seat belt sign off below 10,000' under certain conditions and requirements ... so in that case, I'd likely say just that, adding "good catch" to his seeing the altitude difference.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
e38
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Re: 6000ft and no chimes

Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:39 am

Quoting longhauler (Reply # 25), "I see absolutely no reason to humiliate him . . . Let him have his day. and . . . there is always a way to graciously acknowledge his question . . ."

wow, I agree.

It's been a while since I've seen such a kind, compassionate, thoughtful and respectful response on A.Net.

Thank you very much, longhauler.

e38


Many years ago--late 1988--before I worked for an airline (but I had a private pilot license) I was travelling aboard a Continental Airlines Airbus A-300 from Denver to Seattle with a window seat behind the wing. As we approached the runway, I noticed there were no flaps extended and started to become very concerned about this. This was also after the Northwest Airlines accident at DTW (flight 255) and only a few months after the Delta Air Lines accident at DFW (flight 1141). I quickly rang the flight attendant call button and expressed my concern to her. Without hesitation, she turned and went to her flight attendant station and called the flight deck on the telephone adjacent to the flight attendant jump seat. A few minutes later, just before we took the runway, she returned and thanked me for the notification. Later during the flight, she told me the Captain had called her back and wanted to speak with me after we landed in Seattle. I became very anxious, certain he was going to berate me for bringing up the issue. Nevertheless, once we landed in Seattle, I rather reluctantly went to the flight deck, and introduced myself to the Captain as the person who had questioned the lack of flaps prior to takeoff. As longhauler alluded to above, he was very gracious. He very professionally and kindly explained to me that on the Airbus A-300, it was very common to perform a flaps zero takeoff at high elevation airports (i.e., Denver). He explained that it required a longer runway (we had taken off on Runway 35R at Stapleton International Airport) but that the second segment climb performance was better because of the reduced drag. He thanked me and made it very clear to me that I had done the right thing. Thereafter he allowed me to look around the flight deck of the A-300 as long as I wanted and asked if I had any questions. It was all handled very professionally.

e38

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