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ER757
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Wed Aug 07, 2019 1:40 pm

Skybus
Mark Air
USeless Air
 
TYCOON
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:31 am

I have flown 189 different airlines in my lifetime (a number of which have either disappeared or been merged into a larger airline group) and there is no doubt in my mind which are the top 3 worst airlines:
1) Vueling
2) Vueling
3) Vueling
Regular year on year summer breakdowns of service leading to complete meltdown of their network, very poor customer service and of course lost luggage. I avoid them at all costs!
 
Chasensfo
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:06 pm

People Express was pretty bad, both versions but the 2nd one namely. 2 aircraft, one goes down for mx the other gets nailed by some GSE just a few weeks into flying, all flights cancelled, airline shuts down. Good run. California Pacific had a similar short and sad time in the sun.

Leisure Air of the mid 1990s, which was operationally based at SFO with DC-10-10s flying to Hawaii from SFO/LAX on behalf of Sun Trips and a DC-10-30 flying from SFO/LAX to AMS, STN, and a few other places, and A320s/757-200s doing trans-con flights like SFO-BOS as well as connecting quite a few cities to Mexico including DEN, ATL and I think CVG. One of my former co-workers was the ops manager for part of their short existence. The DC-10s would break all the time, it was common for the London flight to break en-route and sit at STN for days screwing up the whole schedule as it was the lone DC-10-30. Police were called to the gates at old SFO International Terminal D(T2 today) routinely, and some literal riots broke out here and there when vacations were out right cancelled. My friend recalls that the DC-10-10s, although not used on sectors much over 5 hours, had nice legroom decent seating while the DC-10-30 was packed in like sardines. While the airline was one of the first Airbus operators in the US(1994 or 1995 I think), the 2 DC-10-10s were ex-United and appeared in several different hybrid Frankenstein liveries in their short time with Leisure Air. I am told this is because they were down for heavy work so often that the company tooled around with the livery to cover patches haha.

I heard a lot of horror stories about the scheduled flights that Rich International started around that same time 1994-96 I think. The L-1011s were used on sparsely operated scheduled flights from HNL/OGG to SFO/LAX/SMF/ANC and other cities with scheduled charters popping up to more airports like SJC. I've heard stories about people showing up to the airport for the 1 weekly flight in some cases with a sign up saying "Flight is cancelled, call this number". Not a good thing to come across pre-internet! The airline also shut down with no warning leaving pax wandering the airport enraged with no one giving any direction at SFO and pax swarmed the other airline counters causing police involvement haha.

In the end of it's life, Mark Air decided to fly to as many random points across the lower 48 as possible, and they did so with a very small fleet of 737s. If I recall correctly, a 737-200 did a DCA-CVG-MDW-MSP-DEN-PHX-DEN-MSP-MDW-CVG-DCA route with 20-30 minute turns all day long! That is no room for error, imagine how often they were late for de-icing, mechanical and traffic delays, ect. They also had a few 737-300s and 737-400s all running very tight schedules, such as SAN-OAK-RNO-DEN-MCI and back with 30 minute turns. No surprise that after many successful years, the airline failed within 4 years or so of starting these flights outside Alaska and Seattle.

From my operation experience, the more an airline outsources and the lower quality the vendors, the less likely the airline is to handle IROPS in any acceptable manner. Sun Country signing bottom-feeding vendors and ditching the concept of Station Managers tells me they will make the list soon, after decades as one of my favorite carriers.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:04 pm

"Insert basically any airline here because there is someone out there who hates every particular airline for different reasons"

However, after talking with someone who has ties with the company, I can honestly say one of the only airlines out there I would refuse to even step on-board their aircraft on the ground let alone go up in the air in one is Lion Air.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
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hawaiian717
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:26 pm

Chasensfo wrote:
My friend recalls that the DC-10-10s, although not used on sectors much over 5 hours, had nice legroom decent seating while the DC-10-30 was packed in like sardines.


Look Leisure Air as a kid once between LAX and OGG. Had the misfortune of ending up on the DC-10-30 one direction and the legroom was noticeably bad, my parents commented on this to the flight attendant and were told this was the plane that usually went to London. Boarding a full DC-10 out of the end gate of the old Terminal 8 at LAX was also interesting.
 
asr0dzjq
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:40 pm

One of my friends says American Airlines = Airborne Abomination

AtomicGarden wrote:
LH506 wrote:
Spantax a European Airline in the 70‘s/80‘s had a terrible reputation. I think they used DC9s

What a terrible name for an airline, in particular a Spanish one (it sounds too close to 'espantoso/a', like frightening, or hideous),

Not only that, "Spantax" sounds like "Spandex"
R.I.P.

Pan Am (B 19-10-1927, D 4-12-1991)
TWA (B 1-10-1930, D 1-12-2001)
Douglas (B 22-7-1921, D 23-5-2006)
 
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southwest1675
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:34 pm

Not necessarily a bad thing, but I miss the old school Southwest. True P2P service, top notch on-time performance, extremely happy employees, the lounge seats, and yes, WN did give pillows and blankets on some flights back then. Nothing wrong with Southwest today, but I feel like they’ve lost the unique touch to them. Now I just feel like I’m on one of the big 3 without an assigned seat when I fly WN today. Still a frequent WN flier though.
Herb Kelleher 1931-2019
 
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BawliBooch
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sat Dec 07, 2019 9:28 am

LH658 wrote:
PIA and Air India. Back in the day they were known, now not so much.


Air India is actually quite decent once you are onboard. Decent crew, good food and so on. Everything else, from online booking, mileage redemption, checkin, to boarding to baggage sucks!

One aircraft each in their 77W and 787 fleets at any time is a "kutta" (dog) aircraft with dirty interiors, broken seats, IFE held together with duct tape. VT-ALU right now as an example. Your bad luck if your aircraft that day is the "dog" of the fleet.
Mr.Kapoor's favorite poodle!
 
flyer56
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:23 am

Grand prize for the absolute worst of the 100+ airlines I've ever flown.... hands down CAAC. Runner-up goes to People Express and Honorable Mention to Arrow Air.
 
seat1a
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sun Dec 08, 2019 5:27 am

From the Past - As a kid I always heard in the late 1960s/early 1970s that Northwest Orient was always late.

To the Present - Alaska Airlines. They misdirected my luggage twice (PVR-SEA, PSP-SEA) on the only flights of the day. And I was a First Class passenger. Left them two years ago for Delta and have been much happier all around.
 
mchei
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sun Dec 08, 2019 5:44 pm

TunisAir.
My two flights on them were memorable: dirty and smelly aircrafts, flights delayed, no information at the airports, a landing I still remember as the toughest I ever had even at good weather conditions.
They might have changed in the meantime.
F70-F100-E145-E170-E190-319-320-321-735–736-737-738-752-763–742-744-333-343-ATR72-Metroliner-Saab2000-Lockheed Electra-C172-C182-C182RG-MD11
 
Max Q
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Mon Dec 09, 2019 3:08 am

Priceless, love this stuff

Keep the terrible coming !
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
Friarboy
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Tue Dec 10, 2019 10:27 pm

Eastwind

Flew them PIT-BOS-PIT back when they existed, week before Easter 1999. Arrived at BOS at 5:30 AM for a 7:00 flight. No desk agent, line 30 people deep. We did eventually get service and left somewhat on time. Nice new 737 NG.

Return trip, Saturday night before Easter, no plane, no desk agent, no phone CSA, nothing. Seriously, nobody could tell me anything. Stayed with a friend overnight and flew US back to Boston on Easter. I believe they did refund the US ticket.

They were out of business 5 months later.
Your signature's one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever read. At no point in your rambling, incoherent signature, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this site's now dumber for having read it
 
Max Q
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Thu Dec 12, 2019 8:03 am

Back in the ‘90’s I rode the jumpseat to work on Sunjet

A DC9 operator based at PIE, they were bare bones, no soap in the restrooms even


I noticed the APU had been placarded inop, it was summer in FL and hot

I said to the Captain ‘that’s a pain not having an APU then’

His reply, it’s not just inop, it’s been removed and sold for cash, there’s ballast back there now’


They were out of business a few weeks later after they had an engine failure on their only remaining aircraft they couldn’t afford to replace it
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
n92r03
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sat Dec 14, 2019 1:00 am

America West
 
jetwet1
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:04 pm

Laker Skytrain......only flew them once, for some reason (knowing my father it was to save $20) my father booked them instead of BA or PA, I remember my mother bitching at my father the whole flight.
 
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vatveng
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Dec 20, 2019 2:47 am

Friarboy wrote:
Eastwind

Flew them PIT-BOS-PIT back when they existed, week before Easter 1999. Arrived at BOS at 5:30 AM for a 7:00 flight. No desk agent, line 30 people deep. We did eventually get service and left somewhat on time. Nice new 737 NG.

Return trip, Saturday night before Easter, no plane, no desk agent, no phone CSA, nothing. Seriously, nobody could tell me anything. Stayed with a friend overnight and flew US back to Boston on Easter. I believe they did refund the US ticket.

They were out of business 5 months later.


Came here to post the same airline. I lived in Greensboro when they moved their HQ from TTN to GSO. They were truly awful. They were never on time, but they weren't always late. The only airline I have ever heard of who left early just because "eh, most passengers are here, let's go". The lady who checked you in out front was the same lady who helped load the bags and then came upstairs to the gate to take your (handwritten) boarding pass. Oh, and for a while you couldn't carry your laptop computer on board. It had to be packed in the original manufacturer's box and checked. I think they finally dumped that silly rule, but by that point they were already imploding. A handful of beat-up 737-200, and one shiny new NG (that I believe wound up at WN). As soon as they bought that NG they decided to open a half-dozen routes with that one plane. Stretched too thin is an understatement, and one of their new routes that they hyped for months leading up to it was pulled the day after it launched.

I have my gripes with some airlines today, but none of them will ever be as terrible as Eastwind was :eyepopping:
 
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ElroyJetson
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Fri Dec 20, 2019 9:39 pm

Has to be Hooters Airline. But hey....the wings are good!
707 717 727 72S 737 733 737-700 747 757 753 767-300 764 A319 A320 DC-9-10 DC-9-30 DC-9-50, MD-82 MD-88 MD-90 DC-10-10 DC-10-40 F-100
 
Philippine747
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sat Dec 21, 2019 3:46 am

SCFlyer wrote:
GA and PR had shocking reputations back in the 1990s.
Both may have improved since, but the legacy of those years still leave a sour taste in some travellers minds.


There used to be a joke back then... PAL stood for Plane Always Late :P

Meanwhile to the main topic...

My family told me about their experience on GrandAir. GrandAir was one of the few post-deregulation carriers that sprung up in the 1990s, flying 732s and A300s out of MNL. It was owned by the Panlilio family, owners of the now abandoned Philippine Village Hotel beside MNL's Terminal 2. From the beginning, they wanted to compete with PAL, but PR wasn't playing ball. They successfully blocked their use of the Domestic Terminal (T4 today), so they were forced into an odd arrangement. Passengers would go to the Philippine Village Hotel, check in there, then be shuttled to the waiting aircraft. Likewise, that would also be the baggage claim area for arriving flights.

While their domestic service was way above their competition, serving hot meals compared to 5J's and PR's light snacks, they weren't exactly known for the best maintenance practices based on other anecdotes... My uncle and mother's first and only flight with the airline was enough to scare them away and seemed to confirm these stories. They were aboard a 732 from CGY-MNL (or the other way around) and the window had duct tape on it. Not the most confidence-inspiring method...

Airline went belly up by 1998, with creditors seizing their aircraft.
A319 A320 A321 A332 A333 A343 AT75 AT76 B732 B733 B738 B744 B752(M) B763 B772 B77W DHC7 DH8C DH8D D328 MA60

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BuildingMyBento
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sat Dec 21, 2019 4:17 am

My Adam Air (Indonesia) flight in 2008 - three weeks before they went belly up - had many details inside of the fuselage duct taped or missing. Surprisingly, the flight was on time. That was around a time of an overall horrific reputation for Indonesian airlines.

Not too much has changed, save for less airlines being around.
 
infinit
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Mon Dec 23, 2019 3:15 am

9w748capt wrote:
AA


What's with all the hate for AA?

I'm from Singapore and took a couple of domestic flights in the US 2 years ago on AA and I had nothing to complain about.

They were probably new aircraft I was on so I reckon it doesn't represent their entire fleet but the seat pitch was decent, IFE was great with Hulu, the staff friendly and like all domestic US flights, you pay for meals but they were good.
 
mrgrtt123
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Mon Dec 23, 2019 4:37 am

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/ ... index.html

This is the result from CNN, do you guys believe in it?

I totally agree with Philippine 747, actually, it's not just PAL that has a problem with delay flights but so as Cebu Pacific.
 
LX138
Posts: 314
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Tue Dec 24, 2019 5:51 pm

Very surprised nobody has brought up the following. For anyone that has memories of the European charter carrier days - even during the late 90's, things were a lot worse than any of the airlines that have been mentioned so far.

Trans Aer (Ireland): Comedy act with incredibly old fleet of mostly leased aircraft. Regular cancellations (often at last minute if passenger numbers were too low to justify flying the flight), surly staff with minimum training, crippling delays, caused by tech issues/crew over hours/overstretched resourcing - which at minimum lasted several hours long, but usually ran over several DAYS. Stories of 24 and 48 hour delays regularly happened - passengers usually given no updates and expected to wait until aircraft were available - this often led to riots in foreign airports/constant stories in the press. Week long delays for some flights did happen from time to time with passengers expected to find own transport sometimes to another nearby country(!) to get a flight home. All staff/everything that could be was outsourced. Run with the minimum legal requirements they could get away with. Anybody else remember them?

Sabre (the airline): Cronic delays, awful reputation for reliability. Horrific customer service. 727's (that were even old back then).

Air Scandic: 24 hour delays, unmanned phone lines, TV/press memories of screaming/forgotten passengers at Spanish airports with no way to get home, old A300 aircraft.
StarWorld Team - The ultimate airline alliance
 
kaiga56766
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:15 am

Las Vegas Airlines in the 90s my friend say don't take the large expensive carriers to LAX. What was supposed to be an Hour flight turned into a 6hr nightmare. I almost missed the cutoff for check in for my flight back home to Australia.
 
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eta unknown
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Wed Jan 22, 2020 3:24 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
FlyingElvii wrote:
VSMUT wrote:
Sabena, Olympic and Alitalia. Epic examples of why airlines needed to be privatized.

Sabina was good, but fell apart when the colonies did.


That wasn't the reason for it, most of their destinations had nothing to do with Belgium anyway. But in Africa, the name Sabena actually meant something. In a way, it still does even though they're not called Sabena anymore but any travel agent will know what you mean when you name Sabena.

The reason they went bankrupt were their far too high costs. For example, they had hundreds of privileged people on their payroll who got paid large sums of money just for having their name connected to the Sabena brand. They didn't actually work for the airline, only in name they did. Also their staff was, compared to today, highly overpaid. This was all possible because the market was protected. Fares were high, but that was how it was in those days. What lead to their demise was the liberation of the market. Without protection, they weren't able to sustain their high fares but they were also not able to bring their costs down. In such a situation, bankruptcy was the only possible outcome. It was the only way to get rid of the highly overpaid staff, to get rid of the hundreds of people who kept demanding money from the airline for doing absolutely nothing.

By the way, watch how you spell the name of the airline. It's Sabena, not Sabina.


Patrick brings up an interesting point about Sabena. Yes, they were truly awful. I always remember nasty crew arguing with each other (one in French, one in Flemish) and the sign "Live vest under your seat" on the tray top. Much history has been conveniently re-written, putting the blame for their demise on Swissair who saddled them with debt. However, the SN staff themselves were equally complacent: grossly overpaid and constantly striking for even more money until it got to the point where the Belgian Govt. said enough is enough. Interesting fun fact: their NYC office was often charged by US authorities for illegal bonus travel agent commission payments- it was the only way the local sales staff could get agents to book them- filling a JFK-BRU 747 every day in winter was a hell.
 
vedatil4
Posts: 108
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:45 am

In the late 90s there used to be a company called "Aerolineas Internacionales" operating at TIJ airport. They flew really old 727s that left a trail of soot as they took off. I remember the staircase to the plane looking as though a friend had welded the thing together. I'm pretty sure it was waaaay risky to fly with them. Most of their planes still sit abandoned at Cuernavaca airport.
 
TripleHeavenFly
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Tue Mar 17, 2020 5:33 pm

Back in the late 90's I flew between the US and the UK a number of times. Flew with two major US carriers and they were on a par with Ryanair (which was probably in its infancy back then) - the crew spent the whole flight telling the passengers how great that they were and spent so much time pontificating that they forgot to actually offer any service. Then flew with VA and the flight was so different: edible food, young cabin crew who were slim enough to walk down the aisle facing forwards (rather than shuffling sideways down the aisle...), half-decent entertainment system and a pleasant cabin.
 
dstc47
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:29 pm

Perhaps my eyesight is fading but no one seems to have mentioned
Flyglobespan
yet. Delay after delay.
 
Calledonian
Posts: 8
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Wed Mar 18, 2020 11:10 pm

People often mention Vuelling as being a bad airline, but I've flown them a fair amount and only ever had very positive experiences with them, and their A320neo's are actually really quite nice.

On the other side, I always hated Flybe with a passion. Whilst it's sad to see them gone, I won't miss their terrible baggage policy, indefferent crews & awful cramped Dash 8's.

Another is Primera Air, whilst I often took advantage of their cheap transatlantic fares out of BHX, I never had a pleasant flight.
 
DarQuiet
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:43 pm

I'm curious to know why Trevor Noah (host of Comedy Central's The Daily Show) frequently roasts Spirit Airlines?

Not that I have experienced flying with them to wonder what's wrong...
 
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ElroyJetson
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Sun Mar 22, 2020 3:37 pm

Air India back in the 80's and 90's. Horrible cabin service, disorganized, and the inside of there 747 reeked of stinky burnt curry.
707 717 727 72S 737 733 737-700 747 757 753 767-300 764 A319 A320 DC-9-10 DC-9-30 DC-9-50, MD-82 MD-88 MD-90 DC-10-10 DC-10-40 F-100
 
PANAMsterdam
Posts: 128
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Mon Mar 23, 2020 11:50 am

I heard from a friend that TWA was pretty bad near the end. Can anyone comment on that?
Air France is French AF
 
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chepos
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:36 pm

PANAMsterdam wrote:
I heard from a friend that TWA was pretty bad near the end. Can anyone comment on that?

I flew TWA once, in 2000, SJU-MCO-SJU. I found them to be your typical US carrier experience. Would not say it was a terrible experience.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
FLALEFTY
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:56 pm

DarQuiet wrote:
I'm curious to know why Trevor Noah (host of Comedy Central's The Daily Show) frequently roasts Spirit Airlines?

Not that I have experienced flying with them to wonder what's wrong...


Spirit used to be notoriously bad, but recently they have cleaned their act up. The same goes for Allegiant. As for Trevor Noah, with the kind of bread he makes, I would guess he is more of a Netjets or Wheels Up client.

Here in Florida there have been some regional airlines that required a strong stomach to fly.

One was Florida Express, which molted into one of the several failed reincarnations of Braniff. They flew ready-for-the-scrapper BAC1-11's that looked like they had been used to haul livestock. Flights were often late, or just canceled with no reasons given.

The other regional airline still graces our Floridian skies, Silver Airways. To their credit they have been in the process of replacing ancient & slow SF340's with new ATR-42 & -72-600's, but given their shaky finances, progress has been slow. Again, late flights and cancellations are common.
 
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Antaras
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Re: Truly terrible Airlines of the past and present

Wed Mar 25, 2020 4:40 am

VietJet Air. I'm sick with its Y240-configured A321neos
Moreover, it should be your luckiest day if your VJ flight take off on-time.
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