alan3
Topic Author
Posts: 313
Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:13 am

Why doesn't HA fly to Canada or TS/WG fly to Hawaii?

Sat Aug 10, 2019 3:34 am

The Canada to Hawaii market is fairly big, especially from Western Canada, yet AC and WS are left to dominate. Surprised that Hawaiian doesn't fly maybe to YVR? I know Aloha did for a while.

Also surprised that Transat or Sunwing haven't also added service. Sunwing maybe they don't have sufficient aircraft (ETOPS 737) but Air Transat I would have thought so at least winter seasonal from YVR to balance out the aircraft on their summer seasonal services like LGW/MAN/CDG.

Just curious.
 
hoons90
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Re: Why doesn't HA fly to Canada or TS/WG fly to Hawaii?

Sat Aug 10, 2019 5:10 am

Point of sale is skewed towards the Canada side which gives AC and WS the advantage.
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Zortan
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Re: Why doesn't HA fly to Canada or TS/WG fly to Hawaii?

Sun Aug 11, 2019 3:27 pm

hoons90 wrote:
Point of sale is skewed towards the Canada side which gives AC and WS the advantage.

That doesn't explain why Transat and Sunwing don't do it then.

I feel like the market is just so saturated already that adding more carriers won't work. AC and WS already fly so many Hawaiian routes with rather high frequencies. Sure, there's definitely room for more, but does Hawaiian really want to risk HNL-YUL, which is a very long international flight with questionable demand?
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Thenoflyzone
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Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Re: Why doesn't HA fly to Canada or TS/WG fly to Hawaii?

Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:44 am

Several reasons come to mind.

1. YVR-HNL is a long flight (longer than their longest YUL/YYZ-Caribbean runs), meaning a crew layover would probably be required, further adding costs to the trip.

2. Canada-Hawaii requires ETOPS 180, something neither WG or TS are ready to invest in on their 737s. Heck, Southwest only recently started Hawaii probably for this very same reason.

3. A widebody on YVR-HNL would be overkill, hence why TS doesn’t bother with an A310 or A330 to Hawaii. Those frames are better utilized on higher yielding routes to Europe, or Carribean runs where they can charge the same fare, for a fraction of the cost of going to HNL.

4. WG and TS specialize in packaged holidays. Hawaii strikes me as more of a “do it yourself” kind of destination, where people don’t do packaged holidays and tend to book all aspects of their trip separately. This way they aren’t tied down to one hotel and can move around freely between the islands and see/do things at their own pace. This kind of traveller will have a tendency to book with a network carrier, which offers more flexibility/frequency, as opposed to a carrier like TS or WG.
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Aptivaboy
Posts: 779
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 3:32 pm

Re: Why doesn't HA fly to Canada or TS/WG fly to Hawaii?

Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:58 pm

4. WG and TS specialize in packaged holidays. Hawaii strikes me as more of a “do it yourself” kind of destination, where people don’t do packaged holidays and tend to book all aspects of their trip separately. This way they aren’t tied down to one hotel and can move around freely between the islands and see/do things at their own pace. This kind of traveller will have a tendency to book with a network carrier, which offers more flexibility/frequency, as opposed to a carrier like TS or WG.


:checkmark: Very true for those who have been to Hawaii before and know what they're doing. First times might well do with a package, but not multitimers, and you're only a first timer once!

The competition in the Hawaiian market is cutthroat, too, so one must wonder about profits. When the MAX's problems are eventually ironed out and Southwest and United can really unleash that bird on the Islands, fares will certainly come down even more, further reducing the profit margin. TS and WG might just look at Hawaii and feel that the profits wouldn't outweigh the costs to a great enough extent to make it worthwhile.

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