Bingo1
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Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:32 am

About 6 years ago there was the following discussion on non hub airports that were overbuilt.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=574995&p=8623063#p8623063

With the changes in air transport since then which airports (hub and non hub) would seem to be overbuilt. In looking at the previous discussion it would seem that many airports that were struggling back then are still struggling today but some have made a tremendous comeback.

One portion of a somewhat local airport that is overbuilt is the transborder section at YYC. I love bugging my friends in Calgary about their airport having "little man syndrome".
Planecrzy
 
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BN727227Ultra
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:59 am

BLV?
 
birdup
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 5:22 am

ANC? Used to be an important passenger hub in the 80s due to Russian and Chinese airspace being off-limits, but nowadays as far as I know it’s mainly O&D for the state of Alaska, and a cargo hub.
 
Jshank83
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 5:25 am

BN727227Ultra wrote:
BLV?


They are wanting to expand the terminal now. So take that as you want.


STL is still overbuilt. They have come back a good amount on the last 6 years but still plenty of capacity left from the old TWA/AA days.
 
mga707
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 6:54 am

IND. Beautiful, spacious terminal, but so far at least way bigger than Indianapolis really needed.
 
Tokyo777
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 7:22 am

YVR?
Beautiful terminal, hardly ever any lines, lots of open gates...and yet they're expanding (at least the INTL concourse).
I'm not complaining; I love using YVR!
 
bluejuice
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 7:43 am

IBR
Ibaraki is the Gary-Chicago of Japan. It was built as Tokyo's third airport for low cost carriers they never came in any significant numbers.
Not biased against vacuum flush.
 
FlyPeoria
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:06 am

DAY (James M. Cox - Dayton Int'l Airport) saw some 180 departures a day as recently as 1991, the last full year as a hub for USAir (and Piedmont from 1982 to 1989). Emery Air Freight's night hub ensured the airport was busy day and night, generating an amazingly large volume of flights for a metro area of less than 1 million.

Today, DAY sees 50-some weekday departures, and mainline service by just one Major Airline - Delta. At least Allegiant Air offers some flights. The loss of the Emery hub in 2006 had to be a bitter pill to swallow.

High fares at nearby CVG benefitted DAY well into the 2000s. When that changed, DAY withered further than its hub days. I don't see much hope for DAY unless David Neelman's "Moxy Airlines" (or whatever it is called eventually) taps it as a focus city, or Spirit Airlines shows interest in doing the same.

It is a shame Prime Air didn't tap DAY for its cargo hub over CVG...
 
smi0006
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:58 am

KUL? Was previously always considered overbuilt, but the air Asia LCC boom has surely absorbed a bit of capacity - probably just not at the terminals as they wished.
 
Bingo1
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 11:23 am

I've never been to Toledo but I'm under the impression the it is has much more airport capacity than the passengers they handle. Maybe someone who knows the area can shed some light on that.

I've also been hearing that CAK and MBS in their current format are overbuilt. Once again I don't know these communities
Planecrzy
 
Aceskywalker
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 1:29 pm

PIT is one that comes to mind. Used to be a hub but the traffic that goes through it is pretty small for the size of the facilities.

ONT in Southern California an argument can be made for in terms of PAX (cargo is very much healthy). But it’s improving after being divested by LAWA.
 
SteelChair
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:01 pm

All of the over built hubs of the 80s and 90s in the US that got dehubbed/rationalized through the mergers. CVG, PIT, MEM, CLE
 
Bingo1
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:14 pm

SteelChair wrote:
All of the over built hubs of the 80s and 90s in the US that got dehubbed/rationalized through the mergers. CVG, PIT, MEM, CLE


Except BNA. They seem to be recovering nicely.
Planecrzy
 
Waterbomber2
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 12, 2020 11:52 pm

bluejuice wrote:
IBR
Ibaraki is the Gary-Chicago of Japan. It was built as Tokyo's third airport for low cost carriers they never came in any significant numbers.


I have to correct you there.
Hyakuri base is a decades old military base and the commercial terminal is already operating at capacity during peak periods.
It only has 4 parking stands if I remember well.

You can find overbuilt airports all across Russia.
 
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BWIAirport
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 2:23 am

BWI is quite well-utilized until the unfortunately optimistic Concourse E. WN, NK and F9 still use some of the arrival-only or swing gates for their international arrivals, but the concourse was built to handle up to 4 or 5 widebodies at a time. For now, the most we ever see at one time are two, 5 times a week during the summer.
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Vctony
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 2:42 am

DTW and FNT are overbuilt and underutilized. The DL terminal at DTW can accommodate significantly more operations / passengers than it currently does and FNT is way overbuilt.
 
Canuck600
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:50 am

Think YVR & YYC will grow into there expansions, besides better to do it now as building costs will only go up. That's probably the case for most airports, 10 years from now those airports that appear to be overbuilt will be wishing they had built even bigger.
 
Bingo1
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:29 am

Canuck600 wrote:
Think YVR & YYC will grow into there expansions, besides better to do it now as building costs will only go up. That's probably the case for most airports, 10 years from now those airports that appear to be overbuilt will be wishing they had built even bigger.


I love your optimism but I'm not convinced the transborder part of YYC will be anywhere near properly utilized within 10 years. Maybe in 20 years but not 10
Planecrzy
 
Canuck600
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:44 am

Well still cheaper to have built it now then 10-15 years from now. It might need some technological upgrades over time but still cheaper then building from ground up.
 
classicjets
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 1:49 pm

San Bernardino
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:45 pm

Waterbomber2 wrote:
bluejuice wrote:
IBR
Ibaraki is the Gary-Chicago of Japan. It was built as Tokyo's third airport for low cost carriers they never came in any significant numbers.


I have to correct you there.
Hyakuri base is a decades old military base and the commercial terminal is already operating at capacity during peak periods.
It only has 4 parking stands if I remember well.

You can find overbuilt airports all across Russia.


IBR doesn't really operate at capacity even on Sundays (with 12 flights).

But yes, while the passenger terminal is somewhat underutilized, the airfield itself has a large military operation, and thus, it's not all gloom and doom for IBR.

mga707 wrote:
IND. Beautiful, spacious terminal, but so far at least way bigger than Indianapolis really needed.


The terminal is definitely overbuilt. At least FedEx is using the capacity at the airport to run a more than decent cargo operation out of IND, though.

Side note - it's really hard to define "overbuilt". I mean, there are always people that think if an airport is not operating at 100% with slot restrictions, 30+ minutes to wait for a gate, or 30+ minutes on the ground just to takeoff, then the airport is "underutilized" or "overbuilt".
 
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FlyingJhawk
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:05 pm

I've been to BUF a few times but it too seems have far more capacity than traffic.
 
MohawkWeekend
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:27 am

Toledo and Youngstown Ohio. Has any other airport that had 3 carriers (other than YNG) lost all of their service ? Toledo had a bunch too but a few are coming back
300 319 320 321 707 717 720 727 72S 737 73S 734 735 73G 738 739 747 757 762 ARJ B11 C212 CRJ CR2 CR7 CR9 CV5 D8S DC9 D9S D94 D95 D10 DH8 DTO EMB EM2 E135 E145 E190 FH7 F28 F100 FTRIMTR HRN L10 L15 M80 M90 SF3 SWM
 
maps4ltd
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:58 am

I second DAY
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PSAatSAN4Ever
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:27 pm

BFL.

A total of 8-9 daily flights (x3 PHX, x2 DFW for now, x2 DEN, x1 SFO) for a city approaching one million people.

Third longest runway in California.

A beautiful and functional terminal with 3 boarding gates, marked as 2,3, and 5. Don't know what happened to #4, but it's not on the list.

An entire lower gate area for the former ground-boarding EM2's to LAX. It is now shuttered off, escalators and all, as there are no more ground level flights.

Such room and potential, but an economy based on mega-farms and LAX being 110 miles away will forever keep BFL rinky-dink.
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:27 pm

BFL.

A total of 8-9 daily flights (x3 PHX, x2 DFW for now, x2 DEN, x1 SFO) for a city approaching one million people.

Third longest runway in California.

A beautiful and functional terminal with 3 boarding gates, marked as 2,3, and 5. Don't know what happened to #4, but it's not on the list.

An entire lower gate area for the former ground-boarding EM2's to LAX. It is now shuttered off, escalators and all, as there are no more ground level flights.

Such room and potential, but an economy based on mega-farms and LAX being 110 miles away will forever keep BFL rinky-dink.
 
alan3
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:41 pm

Speaking of overbuilt....how about Spain's "ghost airports"

CQM....over a billion Euros cost...built in 2009 and 0 flights

Another Spanish airport CDT cost almost 200 million Euros, had no flights for almost 5 years and now finally has a tiny handful of flights
 
danvs
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:55 am

GIG (Rio de Janeiro - Galeao Int'l) operates well below capacity. Terminal 1 was even shut down in 2016.
 
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conaly
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Tue Jan 21, 2020 3:50 am

LEJ was definitely overbuild fo what is was supposed to be. Two parallel, independent runways, for very small amount passenger traffic (since 1992 somewhere between 2 and less than 3 million pax/year). But in Germany it was almost impossible to say anything against the airport, as it was one of the most prestigious projects for the rebuilding of former East Germany. A lot of money was invested for an totally oversized airport, while other airports (like Stuttgart) have been operating at its capacity limits and further expansions have been reduced or (like the second runway in STR) rejected.

On the other hand, after the rebuild of the whole airport and as one of the very few airport in Germany without night time flight restrictions, a lot of cargo airlines set up hubs and bases in LEJ, so at least that worked out pretty well. Still, there has never been a need for two 3600m runways, of which both are capable of handling the A380.
Airports 2019: ADB, ALG, AMD, ATL, BOG, BOS, CDG, CTS, DEL, DTW, DUS, EWR, FRA, FUK, HAM, HFT, HIJ, HND, HVG, IST, ITM, JFK, MUC, NGO, NUE, OKA, PHL, SIN, STN, TOS, YYZ, ZRH
Airports 2020: HKG, NUE, ZRH
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danvs
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:01 am

YMX (Montreal - Mirabel): the definition of "white elephant".
 
TheEuphorian
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:20 am

NRT is soon becoming Asia's version of YMX, with the rise of HND again.
UTP's upcoming new terminal 3 is probably going to also be under utilized, as it's only a 2h drive from BKK.
 
Philippine747
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sat Jan 25, 2020 2:23 am

SFS. Former US Navy airfield, built to US standards and was a key part of the Vietnam War. Abandoned in 1991 after the withdrawal of American troops and the eruption of Mount Pinatubo. Now in the hands of the Philippine government, they rebuilt the airport and modernized it to serve as an alternative gateway to MNL and to spur development in the region. IIRC, FedEx also invested in the rehab, making the airport their AsiaOne hub throughout the late 90s/early 2000s. They were the airport's largest operator.

There was a lot of hope for the airport, with PR's first 747-400 delivery in 1993 arriving in SFS with President Ramos aboard (was attending the APEC summit in Seattle) to symbolize the new gateway status. Some airlines flew charters there (FAT of Taiwan IIRC). Scheduled flights there never really took off and FX withdrew in 2007, moving their Asia hub to CAN. After the loss of the largest operator, there was a problem with looters stealing cables for the runway lights, and it fell into some disrepair for a few years. Currently, it is mostly used for flight training and the occasional USAF flight or charter during the Balikatan exercises.
A319 A320 A321 A332 A333 A343 AT75 AT76 B732 B733 B738 B744 B752(M) B763 B772 B77W DHC7 DH8C DH8D D328 MA60

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jupiter2
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sat Jan 25, 2020 6:28 am

TheEuphorian wrote:
NRT is soon becoming Asia's version of YMX, with the rise of HND again.
UTP's upcoming new terminal 3 is probably going to also be under utilized, as it's only a 2h drive from BKK.


What is this fantasy about NRT become another YMX ? It has nearly 40 million pax, over 2 million tons of cargo, is extending the 16L/34R and building a 3rd runway. Passenger numbers and movements steadily rise each year. It was never meant to replace HND which has more than twice the pax, but to compliment it. NRT is doing just fine.
 
leftcoast8
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 26, 2020 3:03 am

jupiter2 wrote:
What is this fantasy about NRT become another YMX ? It has nearly 40 million pax, over 2 million tons of cargo, is extending the 16L/34R and building a 3rd runway. Passenger numbers and movements steadily rise each year. It was never meant to replace HND which has more than twice the pax, but to compliment it. NRT is doing just fine.


Most of JAL's network in the Americas is still out of NRT. Most flights to tier 2 Chinese cities, Hong Kong, SE Asia, Hawaii and Guam (whether a Japanese or overseas carrier) are out of NRT. The exception is Singapore where most of the capacity is from HND. Other than that, KL/Jakarta/Manila? Mostly out of NRT. Did you know HND doesn't get any flights to Guam and only two daily flights to Honolulu? Also, HND can't take cargo or A380s (EK, TG, MH, SQ, OZ, formerly KE/LH/AF)
 
debonair
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 26, 2020 9:16 am

There are some "ghost" airports around, like Mattala Rajapaksa Hambantota Airport - holding the title "The World's Emptiest International Airport" due to its low number of flights despite the large size of the airport.

Also HAM is totally overbuild - the new satellite "low-cost" terminal will not be opened as Ryanair decided to close is base at HAM...
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:01 am

debonair wrote:
Also HAM is totally overbuild - the new satellite "low-cost" terminal will not be opened as Ryanair decided to close is base at HAM...


Not true, it will be opened.

Ryanair did indeed close it's Hamburg base, but that doesn't mean they stopped flying to the airport entirely. It's being served from other bases. In the end, the amount of Ryanair flights at Hamburg hardly decreases. Note that some flights might be operated under the Lauda brand, which is in fact the same as Ryanair.

Also EasyJet and Wizzair fly to Hamburg and will make use of the low-cost terminal.
 
debonair
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Re: Over Built and/or Under Utilized Airports

Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:16 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
debonair wrote:
Also HAM is totally overbuild - the new satellite "low-cost" terminal will not be opened as Ryanair decided to close is base at HAM...


Not true, it will be opened.


Not true! Officially the opening is postponed by one year, BUT this was before FR announced the closure of its home-base at the airport. So there are serious doubts that it will open anytime soon, as the Terminal was planned especially for the Ryanair nightstops...

Actually, the new building, which is already largely completed, should start operating in the coming year. "However, we will postpone the commissioning and completion of the shuttle gates by one year and will not finish until spring / summer 2021," says airport boss Michael Eggenschwiler of the "Abendblatt". The reason: the conditions on the market developed differently than originally thought. "Germania went bankrupt, Condor threatened to go out, Ryanair and other airlines are struggling with the 737 Max problems," said Eggenschwiler of the "Abendblatt".


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