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Flanker7
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:26 pm

Blerg wrote:
Flanker7 wrote:
Blerg wrote:

I am sorry but the crew are there because they willingly applied to work in that position, no one forced them to. It's one of those professions that attracts people to take photos. If they don't like it or if they mind it then maybe that career is not for them? Like I said, crew across southern and eastern Europe don't mind and you can see that from numerous social media platforms. Anyway, why shouldn't passengers take pictures of crew who are messy or who are not doing their employer any justice by the way they look. From what I noticed, no one takes pictures of ugly or unpleasant looking crew out there.


Because you willingly apply doesn't mean every can just take their photo and post randomly. I crew is messy take it up with the purser and and write to the company. Saying it's part of there work and if they don't like it shows a very narrow minded view. Like I said, if you ask first and explain why you find they will coorporate. This from a person who's wife is crew for over 20 years and does not want her face all over social media.


Like I said, it's a profession where taking pictures is present quite a bit. They should make peace with that and not behave rudely like many do today - you have the Ryanair example in this thread. For many crew out there threatening passengers with police for very small things is just a way to vent and that's also not ok.[/quote

Crew being rude is not okay and you don't hear me say that. You don't seem to grasp the concept of asking permission. And your argument that it's part of their job is a load of bull. Its rude to invade their privacy, at work or not, but it don't think you understand that to well.
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pwm2txlhopper
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:29 pm

A few years ago, I was recording a landing on a United Express flight from EWR-PWM on the scenic Harbor Visual approach, holding up the camera above the seats shooting straight ahead while I knew they were getting prepared to make arrival announcements that I wanted to get in the video. I wasn’t shooting the FA standing behind me making the announcements on the PA, but she immediately approached me, tapped me on the shoulders and wanted to know why I was recording? Telling me I wasn’t allowed to do that. I explained I’d been recording flights since the days of shoulder mounted VHS without ever having a problem. Later, she starred me down the whole walk from the gate to the baggage claim area. Giving me the evil eye.

This is the only time I’ve ever had a problem with this short of thing.
Last edited by pwm2txlhopper on Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:48 pm, edited 5 times in total.
 
Flanker7
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:29 pm

B777LRF wrote:
The level of misplaced entitlement on this thread is staggering. I would like to make a few things clear:

You do not have the "right" to anything apart from a seat in the class of cabin for which you are holding a ticket.

That's it, nothing more or less. Anything above and beyond that is solely up to the carrier with which you've entered a contract.

If you wish to take pictures onboard an aircraft, suggest you seek permission from the airline before setting off. You have no right to take pictures of the crew unless they specifically give you permission. Their job is maintaining your safety; being visual decoration for your blog is not part of the job description. And they certainly aren't supposed to allow you to document their "sloppy" appearance, so that you may shame them on social media or rat on them to their employer. They're human beings FFS, and they have the same right not be blasted all over the internet as anyone else.

If you can't abide by those rules, simple as they are, just refrain from flying onboard commercial services. Better still, power off that damn electronic comforter and stick it in your pocket for the duration of your flight.


Amen to that, seems quite difficult for some to understand that.
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Noshow
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:43 pm

That assertive attitude towards the enthusiast side of the flying public sounds very strange to me. Sounds bizarre, almost like talking to prisoners. The airlines want people to be fascinated, the airlines want paying passengers and future pilots happy to travel by plane. If airline people feel like they can order this and that for no reason they are on the wrong end of some services industry.
Maybe airlines had too good times so they came away with not being customer friendly for too long? A lot is claimed to be 9-11 related but it's not. Sometimes it's just power games. Now could be the right time to start thinking about customer well being again. What is wrong with taking pictures? They should welcome people that like their aviation business as they might need them one day.

Having said that most airlines I know are tolerant and positive and fortunately I never had problems with an attitude like the one mentioned.
 
B777LRF
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 1:36 pm

Noshow wrote:
They should welcome people that like their aviation business as they might need them one day.


The blogosphere/twitterverse is largely populated by ignorants who are in the game for personal fame and profit. They can be a vindictive bunch of opinionated arseholes if they don't get their way, and don't think twice about shaming a business or its employees if things don't go exactly like they want.

Airlines are rightfully being very cautions catering to this bunch of entitlement jockeys, unless they've previously established they're not at all objective and will always put the airline in the best light possible. Once that happens, the doors swing fully open and suddenly you might find yourself catching a ride in a Falcon 7X or being offered free tickets in premium cabins. Which just goes to prove the first point in this post: They're in it for fame and profit.

But ask yourself this: How would you feel if hundreds of random strangers visited your place of work every day, taking pictures of you doing your job and reporting you to management if your trousers weren't pressed or your tie wasn't tied in a perfect Oxford knot?

An airliner cabin is not a playground, it's a workplace. Respect it, just as you'd like your workplace to be respected. And if you really, really, feel like taking pictures, be an adult about it and do the decent thing by asking permission in advance from the airline and the cabin chief. Then respect their reply even if it doesn't go your way, and refrain from publicly shaming them like a toddler throwing his toys out of the cot.
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Noshow
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:00 pm

I'm no blogger but that sounds a bit like you just hate people?

If I would be an airline I would do competitions who does the best airline picture and such. Not offend your customers. What business approach is this? Or is it because as a cargo guy you are not dealing with human passengers at all?
 
dredgy
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:05 pm

flyjay123 wrote:
bretonrlong wrote:
Agree - I wonder how they would enforce this if you refused to delete those photo's? I think I would most likely be caught off guard with someone asking me to delete photo's that I would refuse until police were involved.


This nearly identical situation happened to me, on Emirates, departing MEL for DXB. I took a general video of my groupb as I have done many times previously on EK. Inevitably in a confined space, there are crew in the background. A very paranoid crew member literally flew over to me and quietly let rip! Threatening to have me arrested in Dubai if I didn't delete. I was genuinely shaken!

The purser was informed and sincerly appologised. As well as regularly checking in on me throughout the flight, she saw me again on the ground waiting for my luggage and again apologised and assured me ' the crew member was wrong in the way she dealt with it, and I would not have been arrested but there can sometimes be 'copyright' issues!


It’s a fairly big deal in Dubai, and Emirates crew are generally no tolerance about it. I was taking a selfie in the A380 bar with a bottle of Dom, and the attendant thought I was pointing the camera at her and she was very quick to make sure I wasn’t taking her picture. Of course I then caught her colleague siphoning off booze into a water bottle and I got invited to the crew party where she was much less strict!
 
xjetflyer2001
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:06 pm

irelayer wrote:
Only time I ever got yelled at was when I was taking a picture of an empty 747 cabin (during boarding) and the flight attendant was standing there (I didn't really see her) and she told me it is company policy (UA) to not take pictures of employees.

I've always wondered about Chui and his "luck" in getting cooperative crews. He must be quite the charmer...


Ha, he must be, because I asked a crew once if I could get their photo and they said, nope!
I was thinking the same thing, how does Sam Chui get these crews to cooperate lol
 
Drucocu
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:19 pm

The way I always explain to my Cabin Manager if they don't agree with me asking people to not take pictures of me is as follows.
I'm not coming into your place of work filming you do your duties, do I? If someone was filming a supermarket cashier the discussion would be way different, way less accepted. So why all of a sudden when you're trapped in a tube it's accepted to photograph and film people working?
If you ask me nicely, of course. Come to the galley during flight and ask for a picture, sure. But not without permission. We're human beings as well in the end.
 
GSPSPOT
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:25 pm

So, taking a general cabin shot infringes on someone else's rights?!
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Polot
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:26 pm

GSPSPOT wrote:
So, taking a general cabin shot infringes on someone else's rights?!

Taking a general cabin shot that clearly shows people’s faces without their permission has always been impolite at best.
Last edited by Polot on Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Exeiowa
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:26 pm

In this litigious world I start to wonder if we all need to wear body cameras to protect ourselves, anyway....

What are we going to do about those pesky people with photographic memories? Am I permitted to draw? May I do this after I have stepped of the aircraft?
 
Blerg
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:27 pm

Flanker7 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
Flanker7 wrote:

Because you willingly apply doesn't mean every can just take their photo and post randomly. I crew is messy take it up with the purser and and write to the company. Saying it's part of there work and if they don't like it shows a very narrow minded view. Like I said, if you ask first and explain why you find they will coorporate. This from a person who's wife is crew for over 20 years and does not want her face all over social media.


Like I said, it's a profession where taking pictures is present quite a bit. They should make peace with that and not behave rudely like many do today - you have the Ryanair example in this thread. For many crew out there threatening passengers with police for very small things is just a way to vent and that's also not ok.[/quote

Crew being rude is not okay and you don't hear me say that. You don't seem to grasp the concept of asking permission. And your argument that it's part of their job is a load of bull. Its rude to invade their privacy, at work or not, but it don't think you understand that to well.


Me not caring about it is not the same as me not understanding it. It's part of the job, it's not for everyone. If someone has a problem with it then maybe they should consider a career change.
 
Flanker7
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:37 pm

Noshow wrote:
I'm no blogger but that sounds a bit like you just hate people?

If I would be an airline I would do competitions who does the best airline picture and such. Not offend your customers. What business approach is this? Or is it because as a cargo guy you are not dealing with human passengers at all?

He's not hating people but merely stating what a few others, working in the industry try to explain. This however seems to fall on deaf ears with some people who feel they can do whatever they feel like doing without considering others. I grew up in a world where asking for things was the norm. A lot of enthusiasts, especially with the 747 going out will ask my wife if she can tell or show things ,and she will go the end of the world for them. She simply doesn't want here picture taken for some blogs etc. Is that offending customers? You are actually offending her by doing it.
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Min2Plns
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:50 pm

In China, I have been in several flights were passengers were asked not to take pictures of the crew. As a sign of respect, I think we should take pictures of the crew, would you like some random stranger to come to your work and start taking pictures of you while you read these forums instead of woking...just me? oops...
 
peterinlisbon
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:58 pm

If you want to do it you just have to be discreet and comply if they tell you to stop. Generally it's not a problem. I think the crew probably don't like it too much because if they make a mistake it will be on film for the whole world to see and criticize.
 
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LTU932
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:16 pm

hz747300 wrote:
I flew KLM last October and no issue. I don't film the crew, I just take some random cabin photos and mostly out the window. I don't think they'll care about that. I actually haven't had an issue full stop in about five years.
I flew KL in December 2016, and CM in 2018 and got no issues with making pictures and vids. I was just taking pictures of the wing view over the Atlantic and near the Panama Canal on final approach. I did try to be careful on the KL flight because of the sun glare, because I had a pair of Belgians next to me, so whenever I opened the shades to look out and/or take a picture, I tried to be extra respectful to my neighbours.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
ferminbrif
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:25 pm

Who cares about that policy…??? anyone can take pictures or videos completely unnoticed … LOL 8-) :airplane:
 
Ziyulu
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:26 pm

When I flew on China Eastern in 2014, I was told not to take pictures because I was using my phone to do so.
 
B777LRF
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:58 pm

Noshow wrote:
I'm no blogger but that sounds a bit like you just hate people?

If I would be an airline I would do competitions who does the best airline picture and such. Not offend your customers. What business approach is this? Or is it because as a cargo guy you are not dealing with human passengers at all?


I don't hate people, but there's no love lost towards a bunch of people blatantly disregarding the rules and violating people's privacy in order to take an utterly unimportant picture. Whether it's for a blog, facebook, twitter or, indeed, this site makes no difference at all. People need to learn that the world does not evolve around them and their selfish sense of entitlement. Taking a picture at the "wrong" time and posting it on social media will not enrich anyone's life, but it could have devastating effects on the subject of the picture.

Again, how would you feel if a bunch of random strangers came to your place of work and started snapping away, without you knowing where and in what context the pictures would be published?

If you were an airline (?), your primary concern should be towards safety, your employees, your passengers and the bottom line - in that order. You may well find that your marketing idea would not be taken lightly be your employees. As for offending passengers, I fail to see how pointing out what the rules are can be construed as an offence. Then again, with the level of entitlement displayed here it shouldn't really come as a surprise. What really amazes me is that nobody has said "ok, fair point, I'll ask for permission the next time". But no, they seem to think the rules doesn't apply to them, and then moan on a public forum when they're put in their place. And yet some here don't seem to grasp why airlines and airline crew are not on their side.
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AndoAv8R
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 4:01 pm

I know for quite a while after 9/11 flight crews we're telling people not to take photos or video. Then the problem was trying to video takeoff/landing (depending on the FA) some of then considered it an electronic device and would tell me to turn it off. Ive mostly had issues with Continental (pre UA/CO merger) and American

Now I almost always fly Southwest, and I find that most flight crews with them have no issues and in fact want to be in them (same with the cockpit and pilots). However I will ask the flight crew beforehand if its ok and if they have any issues with me accidentally catching them in photos (if they say ok to photos but not in them i'll avoid getting them in the shot)
 
Dominion301
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 4:06 pm

cirrusdragoon wrote:
You will find this rule stated as prohibited conduct , in many airline Travel Tariffs . example Air Canada’s :

https://www.aircanada.com/content/dam/a ... pdf#page87
Page 90
h) While onboard the aircraft, the person is filming, photographing, or recording the image by any other electronic means of other passengers and/or crew without the express consent of the person(s) being filmed, photographed or recorded, or continues to film, photograph or record the image of other passengers and/or crew after being advised to cease such conduct by a member of the crew;

Private companies carrying private passengers are subject to additional policies and procedures. Some airline agreements contain “Photography Policies.” For example, American Airlines’ policy, states:

“Use of still and video cameras, film or digital, is permitted only for recording personal events. Photography or video recording of airline personnel, equipment, or procedures is strictly prohibited.”

In simpler terms, you purchase a ticket from an airline. That ticket is a contract. That contract contains certain terms and conditions that you, the purchaser, can accept or reject. If you accept, in exchange for your cash you are allowed to travel with this particular company subject to the stated terms. Any violation of the terms allows the contract to be voided. That means, they can prevent you from flying.

Applying the policy to your travel, consider the purpose of your recording and the subject of your recording.

One hypothetical scenario could be: you taking a selfie with a Singapore Airlines lobster breakfast. That’s probably okay, since this is a personal event, and although some airline equipment is contained in the photograph (your seat, IFE, tray, etc.), the purpose of the recording is personal. Take your picture. Another situation might be your amazing first-class seat on Emirates complete with ornate gold everything, full bottles of Champagne and empty bottles of said Champagne. Still okay, personal experience all the way.

A different scenario, and the kind the airline is concerned about, might be you recording an argument with a counter agent or flight attendant for the purpose of filing a dispute or legal claim. Although personal to some, this interaction is likely to fall under the “do not record per the conditions” section of your agreement. Should you continue to record, the airline agent would be within the agreed-upon bounds to deny you the benefit of travel. Even though this display might be public, you have still agreed to the terms of your particular contract and should not be shocked when those terms are enforced. An onlooker recording the same interaction would be subject to the terms only if he or she was a passenger of that particular airline.

While it may seem unfair, the airlines can and do enforce these terms. It should not come as a surprise when a public relations fiasco puts the airlines on alert to protect themselves, their employees and their passengers.

When it comes to recording airline agents, first consider the terms of the contract you have entered, and whether you want to give up your seat for potentially breaching those terms. If the answer is yes, then consider your location. Are you in the United States? If the answer is yes, are you in a public place, viewing a public event, from a public viewpoint? And, finally, does the state or city allow you to record publicly without restriction? If these answers are all yes, you can record. If they are not, then you cannot, put your phone away.

If you feel you have been treated unfairly, as always, contact an attorney to discuss your individual circumstances and rights.

Bottom Line: No, you cannot record if you agreed to not record. If you did not enter such an agreement, and you are in public, viewing the public, you can record.

While the government can’t restrict your ability to record in public, the contract you sign can.


It’s happened to me once but was 15 years ago. An overly zealous F/A told me to put my digital camera away even though I was taking a pic out the window. She said “Transport Canada regulations”, which as a former F/A myself with another airline, knew that was utter nonsense. However, in order to avoid raising a stink, I quietly obliged. Never had that happen since, even on AC.
 
shamrock137
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 4:22 pm

irelayer wrote:
I've always wondered about Chui and his "luck" in getting cooperative crews. He must be quite the charmer...


No luck about it, airlines have departments that handle VIP reservations and can flag reservations based on the info you enter while booking. Look at someone like Casey Neistat, those upgrades on Etihad aren't by coincidence. Sam has about 2 mil subscribers, with many of his videos having more then a million views each. Its essentially free advertising for the airlines. Airlines will also run special events for top tier frequent fliers. United will invite 1K and Global Services members for events like ramp tours, delivery flights and other special behind the scenes access.

Back on subject however, it is absolutely up to the airline how they choose to manage photo and video policies. As a passenger there is no "right" to be able to film onboard as some have suggested. People don't realize the damage a photo can have to a persons career when taken out of context. Many countries have less then fair labor laws, especially when it comes to cabin crew who are often on work contracts, or may not be considered a full time employee. Someone mentioned a story of an EK cabin crew member being fired for appearing out of uniform compliance. This is absolutely something that can and will happen. While its easy to say "well, just do your job correctly", sometimes its not that easy, especially when things can be manipulated or taken out of context.
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m007j
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 4:23 pm

Blerg wrote:
Flanker7 wrote:
Blerg wrote:


Like I said, it's a profession where taking pictures is present quite a bit. They should make peace with that and not behave rudely like many do today - you have the Ryanair example in this thread. For many crew out there threatening passengers with police for very small things is just a way to vent and that's also not ok.[/quote

Crew being rude is not okay and you don't hear me say that. You don't seem to grasp the concept of asking permission. And your argument that it's part of their job is a load of bull. Its rude to invade their privacy, at work or not, but it don't think you understand that to well.


Me not caring about it is not the same as me not understanding it. It's part of the job, it's not for everyone. If someone has a problem with it then maybe they should consider a career change.


Uh, no it's not. I'd love to hear a FA's take on this, to see if they sign any waivers acknowledging that there may be the possibility of your photograph being used for public or private purposes (and not necessarily for use by your employer). When I worked at a museum, plenty of tourists took my picture, but I signed one of those releases before I was allowed to work on the floor. And that was in a designated public space (the taxpayers paid for the museum and my salary), imagine the extra restrictions on this being private property (the airline owns the airplane, not you). My job was to provide educational content, not to be one of the museum attractions.
dredgy wrote:
flyjay123 wrote:
bretonrlong wrote:
Agree - I wonder how they would enforce this if you refused to delete those photo's? I think I would most likely be caught off guard with someone asking me to delete photo's that I would refuse until police were involved.


This nearly identical situation happened to me, on Emirates, departing MEL for DXB. I took a general video of my groupb as I have done many times previously on EK. Inevitably in a confined space, there are crew in the background. A very paranoid crew member literally flew over to me and quietly let rip! Threatening to have me arrested in Dubai if I didn't delete. I was genuinely shaken!

The purser was informed and sincerly appologised. As well as regularly checking in on me throughout the flight, she saw me again on the ground waiting for my luggage and again apologised and assured me ' the crew member was wrong in the way she dealt with it, and I would not have been arrested but there can sometimes be 'copyright' issues!


It’s a fairly big deal in Dubai, and Emirates crew are generally no tolerance about it. I was taking a selfie in the A380 bar with a bottle of Dom, and the attendant thought I was pointing the camera at her and she was very quick to make sure I wasn’t taking her picture. Of course I then caught her colleague siphoning off booze into a water bottle and I got invited to the crew party where she was much less strict!


I believe some of it has to do with the uniform being trademarked, as that rationale was also something I'd heard from a BA crew member (regarding the BA logo/ speedmarque). However of course once they're out of uniform, and we're on the party bus, rules go out the window.
 
FGITD
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:05 pm

A bit of entitlement from some on here, as usual...

Airlines seem to enjoy the whole "inspirational" aspect of the industry. But there's a line. Photos of the aircraft-fine. Photos of the procedures and inner workings-no go. Photos out the window-fine. Photos of other pax-no go.

Photos of the crew just strikes me as bizarre. A kid who wants to meet the pilot or dreams of being a flight attendant is one thing. A quick photo in the cockpit with a real live captain or in the galley with a flight attendant is something that can mean the world to them and literally alter the trajectory of their life/future career. A 40 year old man with a camera who wants a photo of just the flight attendant? Very creepy.


As others mentioned, Sam Chui doesn't just get lucky. Everything is very, very deliberately done when he travels. Airlines know he is there for the sole purpose of posting photos, and in general making them look good.
 
bennett123
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:13 pm

Nothing wrong with asking, (not something that I would do). But ‘no’ means ‘no’, in any situation.
 
Exeiowa
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:56 pm

I am not one for breaking rules, but a lot of them I think are stupid. Every person on that plane is getting photographed and videoed by governments as they enter and leave the airports and we have accepted that as being part of the reality. Walk down streets in many parts of the world and your every movement will be recorded and we haven't revolted. We often only believe a passengers or employees side of a story if there contemporary recorded evidence when something goes astray and then there is a complaint about what isn't caught and the complete context. We should have common decency for others, but we should not have to live in an environment where others are spying on us and we should not have to live in a world where people become paranoid over simple pictures of everyday occurrences.
 
Heinkel
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:17 pm

Taking a photo is one thing, publishing it is a different matter. And showing a picture to anyone else outside your very private inner circle means publishing. Posting on Facebook ot Whatsapp or YouTube is clearly publishing. Even if it is not commercial.

So the legal problem is not taking the pictures but publishing them.
 
dergay
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:49 pm

shamrock350 wrote:
Aer Lingus, as an example, has a note in its inflight magazine stating that passengers are welcome to take photos or video of themselves and guests travelling in their party during the flight but taking photos of crew, airline procedures and other passengers without their consent is strictly prohibited.

I think that's a fair policy. I don't think I'd ever be comfortable asking cabin crew for a photo, just like I wouldn't expect anyone to ask me for one while I was at work.

Once on a Ryanair flight the person in front of me took photos of the wing during sunrise, a member of the crew mistakenly thought he'd taken photos of her and an argument broke out, he showed her all the photos he'd taken on board were of the sunrise but instead of apologising for her mistake she demanded he delete all the Ryanair related photos from both his camera roll and the recently deleted album, claiming it was the rules. What's worse is that she watched over his shoulder until she was satisfied and threatened anyone who questioned her with police on arrival. It made for a very uncomfortable atmosphere for the remainder of the flight.


When travelling from TRF to DUB on a Ryanair flight, I was instructed by the FA not to take photographs of parked aircraft on the ramp!

Reason: Your camera interferes with the electronics on the aircraft.

QED
Flown on A300,A310,A318,A319,A320,A321,A330,B707,B720,B727,B737,B747,B757,B767,L382,L1011,C5,DC-3,DC8,
 
cpd
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:13 pm

346fetish wrote:
I also noticed it's not allowed to take photos whilst walking on the ramp to board an aircraft in Australia & NZ. Anyone know why?

Took photos twice on VA and TR, ramp agents lost it.



But the ramp workers themselves seem to be allowed to take photos from the ramp and post them up on Facebook, particularly when some important new plane flies in. I’m remembering the first Hong Kong Trader flew into Sydney.

I never have any drama with Emirates, they seem okay with taking photos, although I’m respectful of other passengers.

dergay wrote:
shamrock350 wrote:
Aer Lingus, as an example, has a note in its inflight magazine stating that passengers are welcome to take photos or video of themselves and guests travelling in their party during the flight but taking photos of crew, airline procedures and other passengers without their consent is strictly prohibited.

I think that's a fair policy. I don't think I'd ever be comfortable asking cabin crew for a photo, just like I wouldn't expect anyone to ask me for one while I was at work.

Once on a Ryanair flight the person in front of me took photos of the wing during sunrise, a member of the crew mistakenly thought he'd taken photos of her and an argument broke out, he showed her all the photos he'd taken on board were of the sunrise but instead of apologising for her mistake she demanded he delete all the Ryanair related photos from both his camera roll and the recently deleted album, claiming it was the rules. What's worse is that she watched over his shoulder until she was satisfied and threatened anyone who questioned her with police on arrival. It made for a very uncomfortable atmosphere for the remainder of the flight.


When travelling from TRF to DUB on a Ryanair flight, I was instructed by the FA not to take photographs of parked aircraft on the ramp!

Reason: Your camera interferes with the electronics on the aircraft.

QED


That’s why you want to have an old film camera - I’m sorry, this has no electronics in it! ;)

I have a card that identifies me as a photographer, it has worked numerous times where police or others have hassled me. Once they see that ID, it then becomes obvious that I’m a photographer with $40K of camera gear, not some terrorist looking to do something bad.
Last edited by cpd on Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
Posts: 1034
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:14 pm

Cheers for the details people. It seems that there are rules that seem to be reasonable and most airlines seem to apply them reasonably. I've taken pictures on board before but never had anyone but myself or people I'm traveling with in shot. Which is probably why I never got bothered and thus didn't know.
 
AirbusOnly
Posts: 410
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 4:06 am

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:28 pm

I never experienced such rules - and honestly I wouldn’t accept them neither!! Usually we are traveling in business class and paying a lot of money for the flights. No crew in the world can forbid me to take pictures from the plane outside or inside-no matter if it is on the ground or in the air! That's why I booked the window seat! And of course pictures of the cabin are included. I never had problems with Emirates, Swiss, Lufthansa, Cathay or Singapore Airlines! Why should I? It is my right and my decision and I own the pictures for purely personal use. I don't need anybody's permission for that!
So don't let any temporary crews or the poorly trained Ryan Air girls forbid you anything!
 
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airportugal310
Posts: 3658
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:51 pm

AirbusOnly wrote:
I never experienced such rules - and honestly I wouldn’t accept them neither!! Usually we are traveling in business class and paying a lot of money for the flights. No crew in the world can forbid me to take pictures from the plane outside or inside-no matter if it is on the ground or in the air! That's why I booked the window seat! And of course pictures of the cabin are included. I never had problems with Emirates, Swiss, Lufthansa, Cathay or Singapore Airlines! Why should I? It is my right and my decision and I own the pictures for purely personal use. I don't need anybody's permission for that!
So don't let any temporary crews or the poorly trained Ryan Air girls forbid you anything!


Looks like we found one of the most entitled people in the world, right here on a.net folks...
“They bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash.”
 
skipness1E
Posts: 4813
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:53 pm

Only been questioned in the cabin once in 20 years of flying, when I was in row 1 of an Aer Lingus A320 on SNN-LHR and I snapped every heavy on the taxi in. I learned self awareness that day, sit further back out of direct sight of cabin crew and don’t take *quite so many*.

As for ramp photos, it’s generally a no no but I have loads but have been yelled at way more often. Just last month on NCL-ABZ I saw “No Photography Beyond This Point” at NCL, but still snapped a few with my “idiot tourist” smile on. That really works for me, be ready and snap a few and get on board. Do not stop walking, and watch where you are going.
I also snapped a few at Dubai from the bus lf my Emirates B777. The golden rule is be casual, not intense, look like a casual happy tourist and nothing more. Smile and be relaxed, do not give staff the look of something to be worried about. Remember, ramp staff, even in the UK, are not allowed cameras on the ramp.

In other news, Instagram is chock full of behind the scenes crew room and ramp shots taken by staff on go pros and iPhones, so the phenomena is now much more understood. But some good advice on this thread.
 
casperCA
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:38 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:02 pm

B777LRF wrote:
Noshow wrote:
I'm no blogger but that sounds a bit like you just hate people?

If I would be an airline I would do competitions who does the best airline picture and such. Not offend your customers. What business approach is this? Or is it because as a cargo guy you are not dealing with human passengers at all?


I don't hate people, but there's no love lost towards a bunch of people blatantly disregarding the rules and violating people's privacy in order to take an utterly unimportant picture. Whether it's for a blog, facebook, twitter or, indeed, this site makes no difference at all. People need to learn that the world does not evolve around them and their selfish sense of entitlement. Taking a picture at the "wrong" time and posting it on social media will not enrich anyone's life, but it could have devastating effects on the subject of the picture.

Again, how would you feel if a bunch of random strangers came to your place of work and started snapping away, without you knowing where and in what context the pictures would be published?

If you were an airline (?), your primary concern should be towards safety, your employees, your passengers and the bottom line - in that order. You may well find that your marketing idea would not be taken lightly be your employees. As for offending passengers, I fail to see how pointing out what the rules are can be construed as an offence. Then again, with the level of entitlement displayed here it shouldn't really come as a surprise. What really amazes me is that nobody has said "ok, fair point, I'll ask for permission the next time". But no, they seem to think the rules doesn't apply to them, and then moan on a public forum when they're put in their place. And yet some here don't seem to grasp why airlines and airline crew are not on their side.


Photos have been part of the travel and vacation experience since the day cameras were invented. If you work at Disney or most any other tourism oriented business there should be an expectation that your just part of the background for your guests taking photos.

Have a look at most of the airline commercials and adds over the past decade (or century). A standard theme is your buying adventure, an experience, the journey. Taking photos should is just part of that that is what is being sold to the general public.
 
ACDC8
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Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:56 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:09 pm

346fetish wrote:
I also noticed it's not allowed to take photos whilst walking on the ramp to board an aircraft in Australia & NZ. Anyone know why?

For you safety, lots of hazards moving around on the ramp. Its the same reason you're not supposed to be on your phone or wear headphones/earbuds while on the ramp.
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
alan3
Posts: 422
Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:13 am

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:13 pm

It's all about mutual respect. Most airlines know that vlogging or just taking smartphone photos is a sign of the times. A good review can give them extra publicity and brownie points.

That being said, a good reviewer keeps things low-key and isn't too obtrusive. Focusing primarily on the seat comfort, pitch, the IFE, the meals and the views out the window. They may add their thoughts about the crew service in writing or by narration afterwards in editing but try their best not to film them during.

That to be seems to be a reasonable compromise - - - - between respecting the airline rules and crew safety while acknowledging that's 2020 and travel vlogging and instragramming is just a reality. Coming down too hard on a paying passenger who is being decently respectful, for doing any filming or photo taking at all could end up harming the airline more than helping.
 
ACDC8
Posts: 7874
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:56 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:17 pm

In the close to half century I've been flying, I've amassed thousands of inflight pictures, never been questioned or approached once by anyone, even on the dreaded American Airlines. Been on countless flights where people ask cabin crew to take pictures for them, never an issue.

As for Sam, the guy's been doing what he does long before vlogging ever became a thing and is highly respected in the aviation/airline community and he was an amazing contributor to this forum (don't know if he's still active or not) including some pretty unique a.net flying tours/meet-ups.
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
Clackers
Posts: 111
Joined: Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:19 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:39 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Dazed767 wrote:
Stop putting Sam on a pedestal, he's a hobbyist just like everyone else.


Well, next time ask for flight deck pic/vids or try to serve food on El Al. Bracelets would be on the menu.

He makes it look like a regular passenger vlogging, and does a decent job.


Most people hate Sam Chewy. He is too cosy with the airlines, and on the payroll of at least 5 airlines. Normal vloggers would be someone like Josh Cahill or Noel Richards.
 
alan3
Posts: 422
Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:13 am

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:15 pm

ACDC8 wrote:
As for Sam, the guy's been doing what he does long before vlogging ever became a thing and is highly respected in the aviation/airline community and he was an amazing contributor to this forum (don't know if he's still active or not) including some pretty unique a.net flying tours/meet-ups.


All depends on your taste and what you are looking for in a vlog I suppose. Maybe he was one of the pioneers but the novelty has worn off in the face of some good competition.

Personally his style isn't my taste. It's far too cozy a relationship with the airlines. Watch Sam in First Class! Watch Sam in the Etihad Apartment! Watch Sam joke with the crew! Watch Sam chat with the airline CEO! Watch Sam in the cockpit! Watch Sam get private access at the new aircraft launch!

I much prefer reviewers who approach things more from a consumer review standpoint, who are totally honest good OR BAD, who sometimes travel economy, travel on a diverse mix of airlines, and are not sponsored by the airlines. And there are quite a few really good ones out there now.
 
FGITD
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:19 pm

alan3 wrote:
ACDC8 wrote:
As for Sam, the guy's been doing what he does long before vlogging ever became a thing and is highly respected in the aviation/airline community and he was an amazing contributor to this forum (don't know if he's still active or not) including some pretty unique a.net flying tours/meet-ups.


All depends on your taste and what you are looking for in a vlog I suppose. Maybe he was one of the pioneers but the novelty has worn off in the face of some good competition.

Personally his style isn't my taste. It's far too cozy a relationship with the airlines. Watch Sam in First Class! Watch Sam in the Etihad Apartment! Watch Sam joke with the crew! Watch Sam chat with the airline CEO! Watch Sam in the cockpit! Watch Sam get private access at the new aircraft launch!

I much prefer reviewers who approach things more from a consumer review standpoint, who are totally honest good OR BAD, who sometimes travel economy, travel on a diverse mix of airlines, and are not sponsored by the airlines. And there are quite a few really good ones out there now.


I think the best way to view is it that he’s no longer an airline review vlog, but more of an experience vlog. It's more like lifestyles of the rich and famous.

I don't personally watch any vlogs, but it certainly sounds much more entertaining to watch someone get the top notch service and sit in the seats most of us will never even get a glimpse at. Instead of 10 minutes of sitting in airport terminals and sitting in an economy seat
 
travelsonic
Posts: 106
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:59 am

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:00 am

B777LRF wrote:
The level of misplaced entitlement on this thread is staggering.


How many people in this thread are actually acting like filming the crew is a right, and how many are in reality acting like being crucified if they incidentally get crew in a shot, or if they are just getting vids and the like out the window, is an idiotic thing? Somehow, I feel seeing the former is more a misunderstanding of where the angst is coming from, and that the latter is more the thing people take issue with (IMO rightly, if not at least understandably)
 
Iloveboeing
Posts: 466
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 11:02 am

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:51 am

airportugal310 wrote:
gmt wrote:
Lot of airliners like KLM have a formal policy that it is not allowed to film or take pictures in-flight. However I still see a lot of amateur vloggers (not Sam Chui) on YouTube doing, even with the cabin crew. I'm just wondering, because it causes a situation where sometimes they allow, and other time kick you off the flight only depending on the person you are.


Seems to me that if such a policy exists, it harks back to a time before every phone was a camera. It is next to impossible to police such a thing today...


Well, they can by forcing you to shut the window shades for the whole flight. When I flew between ORD and PEK and HKG, they made us shut the window shades for the entire flight. I was most annoyed, especially since I could only see the moving map on the overhead screens occasionally. I'm not into watching TV/movies; I like to look out the window and watch the moving maps.

I really don't care if people want to sleep and/or watch movies; people at the window seats are entitled to look out the window for the entire flight if they wish.
 
trex8
Posts: 5575
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2002 9:04 am

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:39 am

I was on a NW plane shortly after 9/11 and someone in a row in front of me asked the FA what the aircraft type and registration was (it was a night flight and even as a life long spotter I had trouble figuring out peering between the bridges what plane we were going to get on.) This request prompted the FO coming out and asking a bunch of questions with the FA and FO saying they couldn't give that info and essentially intimidating the guy who asked as if he were up to no good asking for the registration. Which is interesting given FAA regulations make the airlines paint it in big letters on the outside and also display a small certificate with reg., model number, date of delivery etc etc (usually placed above a boarding door) where by US law it must be clearly visible to the travelling public!
 
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zeke
Posts: 15098
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Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:37 am

Iloveboeing wrote:
I really don't care if people want to sleep and/or watch movies; people at the window seats are entitled to look out the window for the entire flight if they wish.


Care to show us where it says anywhere you are ENTITLED to do that ?
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
Flanker7
Posts: 477
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:38 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 8:43 am

AirbusOnly wrote:
I never experienced such rules - and honestly I wouldn’t accept them neither!! Usually we are traveling in business class and paying a lot of money for the flights. No crew in the world can forbid me to take pictures from the plane outside or inside-no matter if it is on the ground or in the air! That's why I booked the window seat! And of course pictures of the cabin are included. I never had problems with Emirates, Swiss, Lufthansa, Cathay or Singapore Airlines! Why should I? It is my right and my decision and I own the pictures for purely personal use. I don't need anybody's permission for that!
So don't let any temporary crews or the poorly trained Ryan Air girls forbid you anything!

Absolutely pathetic person you are, tippical spoiled child behavior. All you care about is you. If a crew ask you not to take their photo will you replay in the same fashion?
Flying blue only if possible
 
Flanker7
Posts: 477
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:38 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 8:46 am

zeke wrote:
Iloveboeing wrote:
I really don't care if people want to sleep and/or watch movies; people at the window seats are entitled to look out the window for the entire flight if they wish.


Care to show us where it says anywhere you are ENTITLED to do that ?



Seems like a few people here think there entitled to just about anything, its mind boggling. I hope I never have sit next to one during my travels.
Flying blue only if possible
 
Noshow
Posts: 1603
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:20 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 8:56 am

What a hysteric topic this has become and how unfriendly some people seem to be?
This very site is world famous for aviation pictures and people making and enjoying good aviation pictures should be treated with respect as well.
 
Flanker7
Posts: 477
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:38 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:06 am

Noshow wrote:
What a hysteric topic this has become and how unfriendly some people seem to be?
This very site is world famous for aviation pictures and people making and enjoying good aviation pictures should be treated with respect as well.

They should, respect goes both ways. I'm all for enthusiasts taking photos and wanting to know more whilst onboard. Just don't as entitlement just because you bought ticket. And like a said earlier most crews will be more then happy to help and accommodate if you ask. That's all.
Flying blue only if possible
 
ACDC8
Posts: 7874
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:56 pm

Re: Not allowed to film or take photos in flight

Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:32 am

Pretty sure that the "I'm entitled to watch my stupid iPad on a plane so close yer shade" vs. "I'm entitled to look out the window so I'm leavin' it up" bickering is officially worse than any Airbus vs Boeing topic :rotfl:
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