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DerekkTp
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Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:59 am

The most important detail for me is keeping the hygiene at the highest level. I think right now most travelers are preferring hygiene over luxury. I came across the news that Turkish Airlines where serving boxed meals to minimize movement in the cabin and hygiene kits with masks, disinfectant, and antiseptic tissue depending on the length of the trip. I do appreciate Airlines for being very responsive to the current circumstance. I fully support the measures which airlines are taking, both to maximize hygiene and safety.

Have you heard about any other interesting measures being applied?
 
Insertnamehere
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Sun Jun 14, 2020 6:09 pm

I got off a Spirit flight just the other day but and during boarding the FA were constantly making announcements saying that the aircraft has been disinfected with "hospital grade disinfectants".
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Sun Jun 14, 2020 7:21 pm

I think I prefer to wait until this is all over. I trust people to not travel when they have symptoms. No need for all this cleaning and face mask mania. These measures don't give me any confidence, they are just annoying.
 
VSMUT
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Sun Jun 14, 2020 8:19 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
No need for all this cleaning and face mask mania. These measures don't give me any confidence, they are just annoying.


:checkmark:

It feels like the security theater, more for show than for effect. It doesn't help that they are so inconsistent throughout the process. All the way from the check-in desk to standing in line in the jetbridge to enter the aircraft a strict separation of 2 meters is enforced, but when seated it is suddenly safe to sit shoulder to shoulder with other people. God forbid you get within 2 meters of a person in the bus-bridges in AMS concourse B, but then they stuff everyone into a crowded bus. It is evident to anyone that the rules suddenly don't apply when they start eating into the profits.
 
FriscoHeavy
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Sun Jun 14, 2020 11:27 pm

Nothing. I’m not irrational. I’d be more willing to travel if things just went back to normal, just as it was 3 months ago.

All these false sense of security measures airlines are implementing are turning me away from flying. They in no way make feel safer, because I’m not any safer. It’s just like the security theater - it’s all for show and people are irrational.

If you feel so threatened, then don’t travel, but don’t pretend like all these things airlines and hotels are doing are saving your life.
Whatever
 
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NWAESC
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Sun Jun 14, 2020 11:28 pm

I like the new emphasis on cleanliness of A/C cabins, and I hope it continues.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
Kent350787
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:44 am

MartijnNL wrote:
I think I prefer to wait until this is all over. I trust people to not travel when they have symptoms. No need for all this cleaning and face mask mania. These measures don't give me any confidence, they are just annoying.


Same. I'm not in a high risk group, and the risk of contracting COVID in my country is perhaps slightly higher than being killed while slicing bread (to steal form a postwer on another forum.

International travel - temperature checking and exclusion are the main one I'd see as reasonable, most others just annoying.
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VSMUT
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:59 am

Speaking of methods that would be useful, one very useful one would be to allow sick passengers and companions to cancel or rebook without cost. The current system actively encourages sick people to travel. But we all know airlines aren't going to do that...
 
CRJ5000
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:18 am

The measures that I'd like to see are simple...
Planes flying to places I want to go to, when I want to go there.
In addition to that, I need some kind of certainty that borders are open and remain open, and that I won't need to quarantine upon arrival anywhere.

I don't care about the rest, but will comply with whatever airline or governmental restrictions are in place.

I've traveled a number of times in the previous couple months domestically, but really want book a few international trips to make up for the ones that I've had to cancel for Coronavirus. I'm expecting to have to wait a couple more months at a minimum.
 
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PITingres
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:09 pm

Masks do in fact make a difference, and I'd want mask wearing to be 100% enforced on an airplane.

I think many people don't understand that the mask isn't for them, it's for everyone else. My mask protects you, and vice versa. It's seriously irritating to listen to uninformed loudmouths proclaim that it's their "right" to not wear a mask in public close quarters; they think they are proclaiming their right to be sick, but in actuality they are claiming the right to infect other people -- and there is no such right.

If there were some reliable way to ensure that a particular person was not carrying the virus, I'd forgive that person the mask, but at present there is no such thing.
Fly, you fools! Fly!
 
klm617
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:41 pm

I'm ready to go already just waiting for thing to open up. I am more likely to take a flight where I don't have to change aircraft. I think that in itself minimizes my risk by 50%
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
airhansa
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:42 pm

I concur that an extension to free refunds and deferrals for the following year (or longer) would be of great help, especially considering the number of travel restrictions and the high chance of a "second wave". But I don't agree that not serving meals and/or reducing in-flight services are the right thing.

The cleaning issue will vary with airline and culture - certain cultures are simply more able to keep their aircraft clean than other cultures. http://www.worldairlineawards.com/world ... ness-2019/ Skytrax has a good award list of airline cleanliness and none of the legacy US airlines appear on the list.
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:12 pm

VSMUT wrote:
Speaking of methods that would be useful, one very useful one would be to allow sick passengers and companions to cancel or rebook without cost. The current system actively encourages sick people to travel. But we all know airlines aren't going to do that...

:checkmark:

Indeed. That would be very useful.
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:48 pm

PITingres wrote:
Masks do in fact make a difference, and I'd want mask wearing to be 100% enforced on an airplane.

Every time I see someone wearing a mask, I think to myself what is this person doing here? Is this person ill or contagious? Why is this person travelling and not at home? Masks give me an unsafe feeling. I prefer nobody to wear a mask. And I don't want airlines to enforce this measure. Let ill people stay home and let healthy people travel like they used to do.

PITingres wrote:
I think many people don't understand that the mask isn't for them, it's for everyone else. My mask protects you, and vice versa.

I think most people now understand that the mask is for other people. But why would I wear a mask now if I haven't done it so far? Why would I be contagious now if I hadn't been contagious in the past three months? I know I am not different now compared to three months ago. Washing your hands an extra time is more than enough. Why would healthy people carry a mask?

PITingres wrote:
If there were some reliable way to ensure that a particular person was not carrying the virus, I'd forgive that person the mask, but at present there is no such thing.

What about men with beards? Face mask are of no use for them. I read a story about a bearded man who took of his face mask after take off on a KLM flight. I am perfectly fine with that. I wish more people would take off their masks. I just hope this unnecessary measure will be lifted as soon as possible. I might not fly again before we get back to normal again.
 
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PITingres
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:25 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
PITingres wrote:
I think many people don't understand that the mask isn't for them, it's for everyone else. My mask protects you, and vice versa.

I think most people now understand that the mask is for other people. But why would I wear a mask now if I haven't done it so far? Why would I be contagious now if I hadn't been contagious in the past three months? I know I am not different now compared to three months ago. Washing your hands an extra time is more than enough. Why would healthy people carry a mask?


And you know this magically, how? You might have been exposed a few days before flying without knowing it and might already be contagious. You do realize that this virus spreads while pre-symptomatic?

If you are living in a known, tested, virus-free bubble, then bully for you. You might however keep in mind that I don't know that; when I see someone in public, say on an airplane, with no mask, I have no way of knowing whether that person really has been living in a known, tested, virus-free bubble; or if they are just an ignorant pig whose personal comfort is more important than keeping people safe.

If you came from that known, tested, virus-free bubble, wearing a mask would be a courtesy. If you didn't, wearing a mask is or should be a requirement.

And by the way, from the behavior I've seen in public recently, I don't actually think that most people understand how the mask works. At least, not over here in the US. But that's probably more of a non-av topic.
Fly, you fools! Fly!
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:43 pm

Experts in my country, the Netherlands, have stated many times that face masks don't provide extra security. Regular measures, like staying at home when having symptoms, don't shake hands, cough in your elbow, wash hands, are more than enough.

Most people using face masks are actually enlarging the risk of contamination. They are touching their masks all the time. I know co-workers who use a single use mask multiple times to save a little money. And because they don't believe they are contagious. And I would do precisely the same. I wouldn't wear it because I believe it will protect other people from me. I would only wear it because the airline says I have to. And I would lower it each time airline personnel isn't watching me.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Tue Jun 16, 2020 12:57 am

#StayHomeStaySafeSaveLives

Even as 200,000+ mile annual frequent flyer involved in the industry I have no interest in being onboard an airplane, let alone among crowds at airports that hardly social distance.

Until such time there is a proper medical solution or infection threat has been virtually eliminated globally, don't have much confidence in travel.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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PITingres
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Wed Jun 17, 2020 5:45 am

MartijnNL wrote:
Experts in my country, the Netherlands, have stated many times that face masks don't provide extra security. ..


Nonsense. You are either mis-representing your "experts", or quoting non-experts. The experience of the rest of the world is against your statement. But again, this is non-av territory.

I'll say though that it's one thing to disagree on aviation topics. It's another thing entirely to promulgate lies that lead to excess deaths. You need to educate yourself as to how this virus spreads, and I hope it's not too late for you and your loved ones.
Fly, you fools! Fly!
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Wed Jun 17, 2020 7:24 am

PITingres wrote:
MartijnNL wrote:
Experts in my country, the Netherlands, have stated many times that face masks don't provide extra security.

Nonsense. You are either mis-representing your "experts", or quoting non-experts. The experience of the rest of the world is against your statement.

Absolutely not. Our prime minister also said it many times during his press conferences. This isn't fake news. We are not talking about the use of masks for healthcare workers by the way. It's about the unnecessary use of masks in our daily lives.

PITingres wrote:
I'll say though that it's one thing to disagree on aviation topics. It's another thing entirely to promulgate lies that lead to excess deaths. You need to educate yourself as to how this virus spreads, and I hope it's not too late for you and your loved ones.

These aren't lies that lead to excess deaths. Most people that use masks are touching them all the time. Thus increasing the chance of spreading the virus instead of decreasing.

We all know how this virus spreads. We also know only a small percentage of patients won't survive. World population is still growing at well over 200,000 people each day. You shouldn't worry so much. Me and all my loved ones are doing fine.

None of us have ever worn masks and we don't plan on doing so in the future. If we can't travel for a while then, so be it. We have survived ten weeks at home earlier this year. We can do it again.
 
FriscoHeavy
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Wed Jun 17, 2020 12:40 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
PITingres wrote:
MartijnNL wrote:
Experts in my country, the Netherlands, have stated many times that face masks don't provide extra security.

Nonsense. You are either mis-representing your "experts", or quoting non-experts. The experience of the rest of the world is against your statement.

Absolutely not. Our prime minister also said it many times during his press conferences. This isn't fake news. We are not talking about the use of masks for healthcare workers by the way. It's about the unnecessary use of masks in our daily lives.

PITingres wrote:
I'll say though that it's one thing to disagree on aviation topics. It's another thing entirely to promulgate lies that lead to excess deaths. You need to educate yourself as to how this virus spreads, and I hope it's not too late for you and your loved ones.

These aren't lies that lead to excess deaths. Most people that use masks are touching them all the time. Thus increasing the chance of spreading the virus instead of decreasing.

We all know how this virus spreads. We also know only a small percentage of patients won't survive. World population is still growing at well over 200,000 people each day. You shouldn't worry so much. Me and all my loved ones are doing fine.

None of us have ever worn masks and we don't plan on doing so in the future. If we can't travel for a while then, so be it. We have survived ten weeks at home earlier this year. We can do it again.



Thank you for such logical responses, MartijnNL.

Myself, nor my family, nor anyone we associate with wear a mask. If asked to do so while flying, I'll politely tell them I have a 'health issue' that prevents me from wearing one. People have overblown the risk so badly, it's sad.

And people want to know if aliens exist? Good God, people would just kill themselves. The world has become such pansies, there is no way people could handle that or any true adversity.

The Spanish Flu infected 500 million people – about a third of the world's population at the time. The death toll may have been anything from 17 million to 50 million, and possibly as high as 100 million, making it one of the deadliest pandemics in human history. The population at that time was about 1.8 BILLION.

Contrast that with this silly (but yes, relatively contagious virus):
-Total Diagnoses: 8,290,232
-Total Deaths: Deaths: 446,707* (That number is greatly exaggerated as we have countless stories of people who died for completely unrelated reasons, but because they tested positive, CV-19 was noted as cause of death).

-World Population: 7.8 BILLION

So, put in true perspective. 0.005% of people (world population) have lost their lives due to Coronavirus, of which, a vast majority were elderly, sick and had compromised immune systems.

During the Spanish Flu, the most conservative case shows that 0.94% or the world population died and it was as many as 5.55%.

The human species has absolutely lost their God Damn marbles over this thing and ruined our entire way of life.

My family and me are not scared of our shadows. We all have an expiration date to meet our Creator. Live life, be a good person and when it's your time, it's your time. Wearing a mask or gloves around isn't going to change that. When you actually look at the numbers, you look like a real idiot (and that's being nice).

We live our lives, socialize and ENJOY life. If you very old and/or have a compromised system, don't leave your house.

Think rationally for a minute folks, because so many of you aren't. *Think back to the poster who thinks airlines should be held CRIMINALLY RESPONSIBLE if someone contracts/dies of Coronavirus. How insane is that thinking. It's beyond pitiful.
Whatever
 
PI4EVR
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Wed Jun 17, 2020 7:50 pm

I live in FL (who our Governor refers to as "God's Waiting Room") and while active and healthy, I fall into the "old" group by age. My considerations are different than others, but I am only responsible for myself and take what I feel are appropriate safeguards for myself. FL has had a large increase in positive tests results in the last week so its hard to ignore warnings and instructions on recommended action everyone needs to take. The majority of the positive spikes are in people 45 and under so its no longer just an "ole folks home" issue.
I had plans for several trips this year, but feel it is in my best interest to delay all travel and use of public transport until there is a vaccine. I'll use my car or simply not go. What may be viewed for you as a non-issue, may have serious health concerns for others, and must be considered. Its all fine and good to simply say "don't leave your house" but everyday life is not that simple and particularly if you live alone at any age. Today I had to go to a bank for a lobby transaction and tomorrow I go to my dentist for a routing cleaning. Protocols are in place in both locations to help protect everyone and yes masks were/are required. I understand today the US3 are updating their mask policies to make it mandatory they're worn at all times in the airport, at gate, boarding and in-flight except when food/beverage is served. There has been an inconsistent application of mask usage and apparently the need to clamp down has now resulted.
I hope everyone understands the virus is highly contagious, but it is also everyone's responsibility to take whatever precautions(or not) they feel appropriate for themselves and their family. You may encounter the need to adhere to those protocols you don't agree with so your option may simply be to not to go to the bank, dentist or fly. Otherwise, enjoy your travel, take a cruise, go out to dinner, ride a bike or go for a walk.
I wish everyone well.
 
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PITingres
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:34 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
PITingres wrote:
MartijnNL wrote:
Experts in my country, the Netherlands, have stated many times that face masks don't provide extra security.

Nonsense. You are either mis-representing your "experts", or quoting non-experts. The experience of the rest of the world is against your statement.

Absolutely not. Our prime minister also said it many times during his press conferences. This isn't fake news. We are not talking about the use of masks for healthcare workers by the way. It's about the unnecessary use of masks in our daily lives.


That is simply wrong.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanc ... 40-6736(20)31142-9/fulltext

is just one of the recent studies that concludes that wearing a mask is relevant to prevention. I'm not going to argue with you, as it appears you've made up your mind, never mind any pesky facts.
Fly, you fools! Fly!
 
Waterbomber2
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Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:48 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
PITingres wrote:
MartijnNL wrote:
Experts in my country, the Netherlands, have stated many times that face masks don't provide extra security.

Nonsense. You are either mis-representing your "experts", or quoting non-experts. The experience of the rest of the world is against your statement.

Absolutely not. Our prime minister also said it many times during his press conferences. This isn't fake news. We are not talking about the use of masks for healthcare workers by the way. It's about the unnecessary use of masks in our daily lives.

PITingres wrote:
I'll say though that it's one thing to disagree on aviation topics. It's another thing entirely to promulgate lies that lead to excess deaths. You need to educate yourself as to how this virus spreads, and I hope it's not too late for you and your loved ones.

These aren't lies that lead to excess deaths. Most people that use masks are touching them all the time. Thus increasing the chance of spreading the virus instead of decreasing.

We all know how this virus spreads. We also know only a small percentage of patients won't survive. World population is still growing at well over 200,000 people each day. You shouldn't worry so much. Me and all my loved ones are doing fine.

None of us have ever worn masks and we don't plan on doing so in the future. If we can't travel for a while then, so be it. We have survived ten weeks at home earlier this year. We can do it again.


First of all, your government is lying to you about the masks. Does that surprise you?
In Belgium, Health Minister De Block is being accused of lying with some considering suing the government.
She can kiss politicis goodbye after this temporary term.

As the below poster highlights, by not wearing masks, you may be fine or maybe not but you may very well be running around superspreading Covid-19 thinking that your cough is just allergies. In that process, a few people may die.

Just because you want to be inconsiderate and live life on the edge, doesn't mean that other people should accept the same.


Masks protect you from bacteria and pollen too, there is literally no downside.
I don't understand at all why people wouldn't want to wear a mask.
Please enlighten us on the idiotic psychology behind that.

Most people don't want to wear masks because they fear peer pressure.
People laugh at me when I wear a half-face mask in the streets. In my mind, I see giggling ignorant chimpansees.
I think that people who don't want to wear a mask are either ignorant or insecure.


PITingres wrote:
Masks do in fact make a difference, and I'd want mask wearing to be 100% enforced on an airplane.

I think many people don't understand that the mask isn't for them, it's for everyone else. My mask protects you, and vice versa. It's seriously irritating to listen to uninformed loudmouths proclaim that it's their "right" to not wear a mask in public close quarters; they think they are proclaiming their right to be sick, but in actuality they are claiming the right to infect other people -- and there is no such right.

If there were some reliable way to ensure that a particular person was not carrying the virus, I'd forgive that person the mask, but at present there is no such thing.



The mask is for everyone. For yourself and for others.
Governments botched the communication, so idiots are talking nonsense.


Masks are not enough to contain this pandemic, especially when seated shoulder to shoulder for hours.

So to fly comfortably, these are the measures that I expect:

-No cabin service during the flight on lfight of less than 3 hours. I don't want to see cabin crew walking up and down the aisle. I don't want to see people removing their mask to eat or drink, except for a quick sip.
On flights longer than 3 hours, only basic service, no meal choices, but only hot foods to prevent infections. Only one person per block of seats allowed to eat at any given time, so that others can keep their masks on. Communicate about it before the service, people will understand.
-Lavatory use limited to strict urgencies. People can hold it for hours on the bus or train, why not on the plane? Seat covers and desinfectant sprays available in the lavatories.
-Stop the senseless liquid checks, to enable people to carry their own desinfectant spray bottles.
-Empty middle seat except for parties travelling together.
-Require FFP2 masks without valves, checking for proper wearing during boarding and during seat belt checks onboard. If pax are not wearing one, provide them upon boarding (against a fee if you want).
-Contactless hand desinfectant sprays available upon boarding.
-Higher fares to compensate for the distancing, not to shore up the airlines' finances.

With all these measures in place, maybe I will fly.
Even so, I will be wearing my full face mask with P3 filters and a valveless FFP2 mask underneath.


By the way, I'm not concerned of dying from Covid-19, but I've got old folks whom I'm concerned about and I also don't want Covid-19 to take me out for weeks or months, it's going to hit my finances by reducing income and the medical bills.


People who are saying that they don't want to wear masks probably don't have any incomes and can afford to stay home or in a hospital bed for a while without any major impact on their finances.


I've heard from people who had it, relatively young people.
They described it as " three times worse than the worst flu that you've ever had". You can't get anything done.
 
airhansa
Posts: 347
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:18 pm

Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:49 am

Waterbomber2 wrote:
MartijnNL wrote:
PITingres wrote:
Nonsense. You are either mis-representing your "experts", or quoting non-experts. The experience of the rest of the world is against your statement.

Absolutely not. Our prime minister also said it many times during his press conferences. This isn't fake news. We are not talking about the use of masks for healthcare workers by the way. It's about the unnecessary use of masks in our daily lives.

PITingres wrote:
I'll say though that it's one thing to disagree on aviation topics. It's another thing entirely to promulgate lies that lead to excess deaths. You need to educate yourself as to how this virus spreads, and I hope it's not too late for you and your loved ones.

These aren't lies that lead to excess deaths. Most people that use masks are touching them all the time. Thus increasing the chance of spreading the virus instead of decreasing.

We all know how this virus spreads. We also know only a small percentage of patients won't survive. World population is still growing at well over 200,000 people each day. You shouldn't worry so much. Me and all my loved ones are doing fine.

None of us have ever worn masks and we don't plan on doing so in the future. If we can't travel for a while then, so be it. We have survived ten weeks at home earlier this year. We can do it again.


First of all, your government is lying to you about the masks. Does that surprise you?
In Belgium, Health Minister De Block is being accused of lying with some considering suing the government.
She can kiss politicis goodbye after this temporary term.

As the below poster highlights, by not wearing masks, you may be fine or maybe not but you may very well be running around superspreading Covid-19 thinking that your cough is just allergies. In that process, a few people may die.

Just because you want to be inconsiderate and live life on the edge, doesn't mean that other people should accept the same.


Masks protect you from bacteria and pollen too, there is literally no downside.
I don't understand at all why people wouldn't want to wear a mask.
Please enlighten us on the idiotic psychology behind that.

Most people don't want to wear masks because they fear peer pressure.
People laugh at me when I wear a half-face mask in the streets. In my mind, I see giggling ignorant chimpansees.
I think that people who don't want to wear a mask are either ignorant or insecure.


PITingres wrote:
Masks do in fact make a difference, and I'd want mask wearing to be 100% enforced on an airplane.

I think many people don't understand that the mask isn't for them, it's for everyone else. My mask protects you, and vice versa. It's seriously irritating to listen to uninformed loudmouths proclaim that it's their "right" to not wear a mask in public close quarters; they think they are proclaiming their right to be sick, but in actuality they are claiming the right to infect other people -- and there is no such right.

If there were some reliable way to ensure that a particular person was not carrying the virus, I'd forgive that person the mask, but at present there is no such thing.



The mask is for everyone. For yourself and for others.
Governments botched the communication, so idiots are talking nonsense.


Masks are not enough to contain this pandemic, especially when seated shoulder to shoulder for hours.

So to fly comfortably, these are the measures that I expect:

-No cabin service during the flight on lfight of less than 3 hours. I don't want to see cabin crew walking up and down the aisle. I don't want to see people removing their mask to eat or drink, except for a quick sip.
On flights longer than 3 hours, only basic service, no meal choices, but only hot foods to prevent infections. Only one person per block of seats allowed to eat at any given time, so that others can keep their masks on. Communicate about it before the service, people will understand.
-Lavatory use limited to strict urgencies. People can hold it for hours on the bus or train, why not on the plane? Seat covers and desinfectant sprays available in the lavatories.
-Stop the senseless liquid checks, to enable people to carry their own desinfectant spray bottles.
-Empty middle seat except for parties travelling together.
-Require FFP2 masks without valves, checking for proper wearing during boarding and during seat belt checks onboard. If pax are not wearing one, provide them upon boarding (against a fee if you want).
-Contactless hand desinfectant sprays available upon boarding.
-Higher fares to compensate for the distancing, not to shore up the airlines' finances.

With all these measures in place, maybe I will fly.
Even so, I will be wearing my full face mask with P3 filters and a valveless FFP2 mask underneath.


By the way, I'm not concerned of dying from Covid-19, but I've got old folks whom I'm concerned about and I also don't want Covid-19 to take me out for weeks or months, it's going to hit my finances by reducing income and the medical bills.


People who are saying that they don't want to wear masks probably don't have any incomes and can afford to stay home or in a hospital bed for a while without any major impact on their finances.


I've heard from people who had it, relatively young people.
They described it as " three times worse than the worst flu that you've ever had". You can't get anything done.


Another ridiculous claim is that non-symptomatic transmission is the reason why people should wear a face mask. The virus is far smaller than what is filtered out by the majority of face masks. Not sure why on earth people will still trust health agencies and public services anymore.
 
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PITingres
Posts: 1301
Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2007 1:59 am

Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:53 am

airhansa wrote:
Another ridiculous claim is that non-symptomatic transmission is the reason why people should wear a face mask. The virus is far smaller than what is filtered out by the majority of face masks. Not sure why on earth people will still trust health agencies and public services anymore.


Of course you aren't filtering individual viruses, and one virus is unlikely to cause an infection. You're filtering small droplets that are emitted when you breathe and speak, and can hold thousands of viruses.
Fly, you fools! Fly!
 
airhansa
Posts: 347
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:18 pm

Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:08 am

PITingres wrote:
airhansa wrote:
Another ridiculous claim is that non-symptomatic transmission is the reason why people should wear a face mask. The virus is far smaller than what is filtered out by the majority of face masks. Not sure why on earth people will still trust health agencies and public services anymore.


Of course you aren't filtering individual viruses, and one virus is unlikely to cause an infection. You're filtering small droplets that are emitted when you breathe and speak, and can hold thousands of viruses.


As opposed to a symptomatic transmission where a face mask isn't required?
 
MartijnNL
Posts: 964
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:44 am

Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Thu Jun 18, 2020 6:48 pm

PITingres wrote:
That is simply wrong. (...) is just one of the recent studies that concludes that wearing a mask is relevant to prevention. I'm not going to argue with you, as it appears you've made up your mind, never mind any pesky facts.

Maybe you should read part of my previous statement again.

Most people using face masks are actually enlarging the risk of contamination. They are touching their masks all the time. I know co-workers who use a single use mask multiple times to save a little money.

It's nice to have studies that conclude that wearing a mask is relevant to prevention. But that only works when people adhere to the instructions on how to use one. In real life that doesn't happen unfortunately, as I witness on a daily basis.

My prime minister and the experts that surround him have warned numerous times that face masks might come with a false sense of security. I totally support that statement.
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1179
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:53 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
PITingres wrote:
That is simply wrong. (...) is just one of the recent studies that concludes that wearing a mask is relevant to prevention. I'm not going to argue with you, as it appears you've made up your mind, never mind any pesky facts.

Maybe you should read part of my previous statement again.

Most people using face masks are actually enlarging the risk of contamination. They are touching their masks all the time. I know co-workers who use a single use mask multiple times to save a little money.

It's nice to have studies that conclude that wearing a mask is relevant to prevention. But that only works when people adhere to the instructions on how to use one. In real life that doesn't happen unfortunately, as I witness on a daily basis.

My prime minister and the experts that surround him have warned numerous times that face masks might come with a false sense of security. I totally support that statement.



Masks are REQUIRED on public transportation in your country, so I don't know what you're talking about.

In het OV geldt sinds 1 juni 2020 de verplichting om een mondkapje te dragen.


https://www.rijksoverheid.nl/onderwerpe ... mondkapjes


By the way, your argument that they touch the mask and get infected is senseless.
Ok so suppose that they touch the mask and contaminate their fingers.
Unless they touch their eyes with those fingers or put their fingers in their behind, there is no infection.
Masks also prevent people from touching their mouth and nose area, so they serve a double purpose.
Also, the virus will have a relatively short half life on the mask's surface.
They are constantly exposed to exhaled water vapor.

If you don't want to wear a mask, do as you please, stop spreading disinformation with your pseudo-science.

Being alone and hopeless in a world in pandemic is becoming the last memory of increasing numbers of victims. For them, this is the end of the world.
You and your partners in denial, do me a favor and get in touch with reality: https://twitter.com/anylaurie16/status/ ... 8272143367
 
eurotrader85
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:45 pm

Re: Which measures would help you travel with confidence again?

Fri Jun 19, 2020 7:13 am

PITingres wrote:
airhansa wrote:
Another ridiculous claim is that non-symptomatic transmission is the reason why people should wear a face mask. The virus is far smaller than what is filtered out by the majority of face masks. Not sure why on earth people will still trust health agencies and public services anymore.


Of course you aren't filtering individual viruses, and one virus is unlikely to cause an infection. You're filtering small droplets that are emitted when you breathe and speak, and can hold thousands of viruses.


:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:

Waterbomber2 wrote:

As the below poster highlights, by not wearing masks, you may be fine or maybe not but you may very well be running around superspreading Covid-19 thinking that your cough is just allergies. In that process, a few people may die.

Just because you want to be inconsiderate and live life on the edge, doesn't mean that other people should accept the same.


Masks protect you from bacteria and pollen too, there is literally no downside.
I don't understand at all why people wouldn't want to wear a mask.
Please enlighten us on the idiotic psychology behind that.

Most people don't want to wear masks because they fear peer pressure.
People laugh at me when I wear a half-face mask in the streets. In my mind, I see giggling ignorant chimpansees.
I think that people who don't want to wear a mask are either ignorant or insecure.


I think you are bang on in your assessment here. Its about local peer pressure. In the West this is new so naturally people are sceptical of people covering faces like they are about to start a riot or rob a bank, but being in the Far East it’s interesting to hear some of the absolutely idiotic theories that are being flouted in the western hemisphere, that masks do or don’t work etc. Asia is used to these pandemics now, so they know what to do straight away to protect themselves and those around, hence everyone wears masks on transport in public etc (I found this odd to get used to at first but after a couple of days it's fine), along with other sensible measures of course. Honestly, people in the Far East find it strange that mask uptake is so low in the West where there is still even debate (or as you’ve alluded to governments lying to save public face on lack of PPE acquisition etc)?!? Obviously some poorer people in poorer countries in Asia can’t afford them, but its not if they should wear, they would of course and try to make do as best as possible without, its simply they can’t afford. If you don’t wear a mask here in the Far East you are the vilified character in public, and they must be doing something right as the stats show and the Western Hemisphere management of this is just a continued s**t show that’s not ending.


I do fly at the moment (wearing a mask) and it is OK, you get from A to B and life goes on. The world does have to continue, not everyone can stay inside forever, despite the difficult situation at the moment. Obviously there are plenty of people who have made their mind up and refuse to see the benefits, whatever, not going to engage a debate. All I would say to the naysayers and sceptics is even if you protected yourself and fellow human beings by just a small percentage until a vaccine is available, is wearing a mask in public not a small price to pay?

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