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lightmac
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Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 7:56 pm

With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:46 pm

Asiana (together with ANA from Japan) covered North-East-Asia well for the Star Alliance. With Korean merging with Asiana, Star will loose an important partner and spot that ANA can not fully make up for.
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:55 pm

With Seoul being so hugely dominant in S.Korea, does Star Alliance *need* a specifically Korean partner instead of their own airlines flying to Seoul and relying on ANA + Air China to provide Japan/China coverage ?
Last edited by davidjohnson6 on Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
wedgetail737
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:56 pm

I wonder who will replace Asiana as an overseas competitor out of S. Korea.
 
x1234
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:59 pm

The best thing maybe is UA starts EWR-ICN or EWR-TPE (the 2 markets left from EWR reachable with the 777/787). They have a code-share with EVA on JFK-TPE. Remember UA has a JV with ANA for beyond NRT/HND connections. They are in order of most popular to least popular MNL, BKK, SIN, SGN, HAN, KUL, CGK, DPS.
 
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Antaras
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:00 pm

Believe in ANA and Air CN, boost in EVA, acquire a new member in Southeast Asia (Bamboo...?)
If you disagree with my statement, assume that it was just a joke :duck:
 
MIflyer12
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:04 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
I wonder who will replace Asiana as an overseas competitor out of S. Korea.


List all of the airlines other than KE that fly from ICN. Just that easy. It's a long list.
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:11 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
I wonder who will replace Asiana as an overseas competitor out of S. Korea.


List all of the airlines other than KE that fly from ICN. Just that easy. It's a long list.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incheon_I ... #Passenger
Eastar Jet, Jeju Air and T'way Air look to be the leading candidates for number 2 Korean airline...
 
usflyer msp
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:11 pm

Not needed. NH and CA can cover the gap just fine. OZ and UA barely cooperated anyway.
 
VSMUT
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:26 pm

There is plenty of Star Alliance coverage in the region. ANA, Air China, EVA, Singapore Airlines, Shenzhen and all the airlines flying in from afar are plenty to cover the market.
 
lightmac
Topic Author
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:16 am

Well, majority of Koreans lives outside the Seoul metro area, so spokes on a Star alliance carrier to Incheon are one key part that carriers like Singapore or Shenzhen can NOT provide.
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 12:58 pm

lightmac wrote:
Well, majority of Koreans lives outside the Seoul metro area, so spokes on a Star alliance carrier to Incheon are one key part that carriers like Singapore or Shenzhen can NOT provide.


There's no reason why they can't fly to secondary Korean airports. As a matter of fact, Shenzhen Airlines already flies to Jeju. There's no reason why secondary Korea would have to be funneled through Seoul, it can be funneled through foreign hubs as well. The largest Korean airport that would be left without Star Alliance coverage would be Gimhae, however it's easy for ANA or whatever Star Alliance airline from the region to start a flight there.

Not every alliance needs a hub in every country. There is no SkyTeam hub in Japan either, with Japan Airlines in OneWorld and ANA in Star Alliance. The majority of SkyTeam traffic in the region is funneled through Seoul on Korean Air, which is the SkyTeam airline for northeast Asia. If SkyTeam can funnel Japanese traffic through Korea, there's no reason why Star Alliance wouldn't be able to funnel Korean traffic through Japan.
 
hoons90
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:36 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
lightmac wrote:
Well, majority of Koreans lives outside the Seoul metro area, so spokes on a Star alliance carrier to Incheon are one key part that carriers like Singapore or Shenzhen can NOT provide.


There's no reason why they can't fly to secondary Korean airports. As a matter of fact, Shenzhen Airlines already flies to Jeju. There's no reason why secondary Korea would have to be funneled through Seoul, it can be funneled through foreign hubs as well. The largest Korean airport that would be left without Star Alliance coverage would be Gimhae, however it's easy for ANA or whatever Star Alliance airline from the region to start a flight there.



Assuming these airlines return to Gimhae after the pandemic, Gimhae would still have Star Alliance coverage through Thai, Singapore Airlines and Air China. At the moment, all international arrivals must go through Incheon Airport due to the pandemic.
Flown: 2L 7C 9E 9L AA AB AC AF AY AZ BA BR BX B6 CA CO CP CX DL EK EY JL KE KL LA LH LX MQ NW OZ PD RW SQ TG TP TR TS US WG WN WS XE XJ
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:17 pm

If, despite the news around vaccines, the South Korea Govt feels the need to require that all international flights go through Incheon for the next 12 or 24 months because of the pandemic, then Star Alliance members will likely have a much bigger problem on their hands (i.e. bankruptcy) than worrying about coverage of South Korea outside Seoul
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:59 pm

hoons90 wrote:
At the moment, all international arrivals must go through Incheon Airport due to the pandemic.


That seems weird to me since there are quite a lot of international flights from other Korean airports. I already mentioned Shenzhen Airlines to Jeju, Air China also flies there. Also both ANA and Air China have flights to Gimpo as well as Incheon. That's as far as Star Alliance goes, but there are a lot of other airlines as well. For example Air Asia X from Kuala Lumpur to Gimhae and Jeju. These flights don't stop in Incheon. This spring Finnair will be launching Helsinki to Gimhae, also without stopping in Incheon.
 
hoons90
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:51 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
hoons90 wrote:
At the moment, all international arrivals must go through Incheon Airport due to the pandemic.


That seems weird to me since there are quite a lot of international flights from other Korean airports. I already mentioned Shenzhen Airlines to Jeju, Air China also flies there. Also both ANA and Air China have flights to Gimpo as well as Incheon. That's as far as Star Alliance goes, but there are a lot of other airlines as well. For example Air Asia X from Kuala Lumpur to Gimhae and Jeju. These flights don't stop in Incheon. This spring Finnair will be launching Helsinki to Gimhae, also without stopping in Incheon.


International flights can still depart directly from secondary airports, but all inbound passengers to Korea must be screened at ICN since the pandemic. That's why Spring Airlines is operating its PVG-CJU service via ICN.

Similar situation in Japan too, until recently only NRT, HND and KIX were accepting international arrivals. I believe NGO and FUK were opened up again just recently.

PUS should reopen for inbound international flights next month though.
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debonair
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:40 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
I wonder who will replace Asiana as an overseas competitor out of S. Korea.

Next year we will see AIR PREMIA with their B787 and hopefully T'way...

https://www.total-croatia-news.com/trav ... oul-zagreb

 
IPFreely
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:41 pm

Everyone is making an assumption that Korean will stay with Skyteam for the long term. I suspect that assumption will turn out to be wrong.
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:46 pm

IPFreely - do you think Korean will just leave like China Southern, or do you think they will switch to a different airline ? What are the reasons for your thoughts ?
 
IPFreely
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:18 am

davidjohnson6 wrote:
IPFreely - do you think Korean will just leave like China Southern, or do you think they will switch to a different airline ? What are the reasons for your thoughts ?


I don't believe they will just leave like China Southern, I believe they will leave for a better deal - more passengers, more destinations, and more partner flying. The combined Korean+Asiana is much more attractive to an alliance than either Korean or Asiana was on their own. And Korean has gone on record of wanting partners who can not just sell tickets but who can also operate flights and take some of the capital burden.

Which alliance has the most passengers? 1. Star (762 million in 2019), 2. SkyTeam (630 million), 3. OneWorld (535 million)
Which alliance has the most destinations? 1. Star, ~1,300, 2. OneWorld, ~1,200, 3. SkyTeam, ~1,100
Which alliance has the most widebody planes suitable to share the burden of operating long haul flights? 1. Star, 2 OneWorld, 3 SkyTeam
 
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LAXintl
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:10 am

Patrick Quayle VP International & Alliances at United was asked about the potential loss of OZ at the companies leadership conference last week.

Basically, his response was that alliance shifts as a result of industry distress is not too surprising, but that United is very comfortable with its position in North Asia and Star enjoyed other strong partners in the region such as ANA and Air China.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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AirAfreak
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Wed Nov 25, 2020 6:13 pm

Star Alliance offers sufficient access to Northeast Asia. Of course, an airline alliance/partnership cannot be everything to everyone regarding convenience. However, a world without Asiana (OZ) is possible; displayed by the following ways to reach South Korea (and other various points within Northeast Asia) from across the globe:

- Air China/Shenzhen (from 7 airports within Greater China)
- ANA All Nippon Airways (from several gateways within Japan)
- EVA Evergreen Airways (3 destinations to South Korea from Taiwan)
- LOT/Lufthansa (nonstop via Continental Europe)
- Ethiopian ((from Africa nonstop (and a direct flight via Thailand))
- Air India (via Delhi)
- Turkish Airlines (via Istanbul)
- UNITED/AIR CANADA (via North America)
- THAI/Singapore Airlines (via Southeast Asia)

South Korea and Northeast Asia are accessible by a multitude of connecting opportunities thanks to the Star Alliance Network of Airline Hubs around the world. For example, UNITED can take you from Pape’ete or Montego Bay to South Korea (via San Francisco or Houston). Fly Air Canada to Seoul from Cambridge Bay or Medicine Hat (via Vancouver). Goa (via Delhi) to Seoul with Air India... Stuttgart via Frankfurt to Korea with Lufthansa... Krabi to Incheon via Suvarnabhumi with THAI... Basically, there is nothing to worry about from a passenger standpoint.

The real question in my mind is how will Asiana staff adapt to the strict culture of Korean Air in terms of working environment. My mother endured 27 years of service working at Korean Air. And my mother became disgusted with the onboard service at her own airline after her very first Asiana flight as a passenger flying from New York to Seoul a long time ago. She then forever reminded me how Korean Air flight attendants were “stuck up” and cold after she experienced her very first flying experience onboard the newly-established airline from South Korea at the time, Asiana.
Korean Air | Excellence in Flight.
 
FromCDGtoSYD
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Re: With Korean swallowing Asiana, what will the Star Alliance do in Northeast-Asia?

Sun Dec 06, 2020 10:37 am

Most if not all major airlines already fly to ICN, multiple times a day even. Half of SK's population lives in the Seoul metro area so the catchment is huge. For the rest going to Seoul is still relatively easy.

PUS is the furthest away and benefits from its own metro area S7, SQ, TG, JL, AY and CA all fly or will fly there. As you can see there's already enough *A coverage for the region, if anything I can see NH add flights to make up for the loss of OZ and maybe CX.

So in short, Star might have lost a partner but they'll be just fine. KE will most likely star in ST as it will be THE de facto major carrier in the region. If they can increase their flights to regions such as Australia and Europe to 2x daily to allow for more flexible schedules then they'll have a very solid value proposition. The last thing they want to do is leave an alliance they helped build. With BR, CA and NH in the 3 bordering countries joining *A would be the worst decision they could take.

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