Heavierthanair wrote:

AngMoh wrote:

I live in Asia and overall I think the US unions are nuts and try to make themselves irrelevant. That said, my only experience is with the UAW and they are among the worst of the worst. Good example, we (coming from Asia but working for a GM subsidiary) were not allowed to take photographs at the Detroit motor show as that could only be done by a UAW approved photographer. That was even if the photos were for personal use only. We also had at one time very high grass around our US office as at the only UAW approved grass cutter was on medical leave for 5 months and the other gardeners were not allowed by the UAW to cut the grass and the contract forbade them to hire a contractor while the lawn mower man was on medical leave. Absolutely nuts (from an Asian perspective).

US union regulations are a joke, not only for Asia. In commissioning equipment (for a European manufacturer) I had to use "certified" unionized electricians to connect the control systems that was supplied with the equipment. Since they were unable to read wiring diagrams I had to tell the person step by step what to do - take the red wire and connect it to terminal 1, then take the blue wire and connect it to terminal 2 and so on. Took forever to get the job done, raising costs for the customer as well as for us. When commissioning the same type of equipment in Europe or Asia the wiring was typically completed by the time I got there. So much for efficiency.

Slightly off topic, I apologize

So true. Convention centers in major U.S. cities often require AV equipment be done through union covered personnel. Carrying a slide deck on a flash drive or using your own speakers, projector, etc is prohibited unless you pay for a Union warm body to preside over your usage of *your* own equipment.

Or go to any construction project in New England that hasn’t been “closed out”. You will be met with a union mandated elevator operator seated on bucket (cushy job for a senior member) who simply pushes your floor and otherwise enjoys high paid downtime.

You should have seen toilets on some flights ex Dhaka and Indonesia we used to fly. Hilarous for us, less funny for flight attendants trying to keep the cabin (with 465pax, 747-400) in at least half-decent condition. Flooded floor was 'ok', as was toilet paper everywhere. Less ok was seeing pile of fresh crap on closed toiled lid (...) or diarrhoea on mirror/wall. How ground staff was later able to refresh everything on turnaround in less than three hours was always a miracle to me. I would have thought seats, floor carpets, lavatories and the rest could not be reused after seeing that crap.

I would question the passenger that can't contain themselves within the confines of a bathroom and toilet. I get that emergencies happen, even on land, but they can usually be confined within underwear and a few inches of the toilet. If It were me, I would want to clean up after myself as much as possible before I exited the lav. I certainly wouldn't expect an FA or any cabin crew to do it, not to mention the line outside the lav would be watching. I used to work in a grocery store as a stock clerk (amongst other things eventually), and one night while I was on, someone in the lady's room...meaning a GIRL...or a WOMAN...SMEARED POOP over everything...I'm talking handprints... all over the walls, floor, mirrors, faucets, she literally took matters into her own hands. The manager on duty looked at me, I looked back like "I hope you don't expect me to clean this up". so he gloved up, put the boots on, took the hose and cleaned the lady's room. There is a point where one can say "That's NOT my job".

whisperjet727 wrote:

Why do we never see this conversation started. If you use the airplane’s convenience. Please do not leave it looking like a tsunami just passed by. Maybe that would solve the issue

Sure. Excellent idea. Except when some passengers do leave a dirty lav, of course. Should all other passengers be expected to suffer, because... what? "collective responsibility?"

jfklganyc wrote:

LCDFlight wrote:

CobaltScar wrote:

You , as the captain, sometimes clean the lav??? I'll have to see that to believe it. Do you also blue turn?

What do people mean by cleaning the lav by the way? Pick up papers off the ground and put them in the trash , maybe. Making sure the trash chute is closed for safety reasons, sure. Making sure it does not run out of toilet paper or paper towels sure too.

But mop or wipe down the commode? No way. I don't think any domestic U.S. airlines does more than what i've typed above. Ground crews do that, and that includes your gate agents at small stations.

You seem not to have believed it. But I believe it. It is a Captain's job and perhaps a Purser's sense of responsibility to keep the aircraft safe and functional "in a pinch." That might include becoming an electrician, a cleaner, a police officer.

I’m a leader and three things make a leader important:

1. In a bad situation, a leader has to step up and lead

2. Never ask somebody else to do what you wouldn’t do

3. Set a tone and set an example

So you’re damn straight I will demand a mop and cleaning fluid if I see something unacceptable in my aircraft…that outsourced minimum-wage employees refused to address

Oh brother. This is rich. In over 36 years in this industry I’ve never ONCE seen a pilot clean the lav - no matter how filthy. Not even care enough to look to see if they’re clean on the ground. The only way they know they’re filthy on the ground is if the FA’s ask them to have ops call the cleaners back. That’s just not in the scope of anything they’re concerned about. A pilot cleaning the lav. LOLOLOL

jfklganyc wrote:

LCDFlight wrote:

CobaltScar wrote:

You , as the captain, sometimes clean the lav??? I'll have to see that to believe it. Do you also blue turn?

What do people mean by cleaning the lav by the way? Pick up papers off the ground and put them in the trash , maybe. Making sure the trash chute is closed for safety reasons, sure. Making sure it does not run out of toilet paper or paper towels sure too.

But mop or wipe down the commode? No way. I don't think any domestic U.S. airlines does more than what i've typed above. Ground crews do that, and that includes your gate agents at small stations.

You seem not to have believed it. But I believe it. It is a Captain's job and perhaps a Purser's sense of responsibility to keep the aircraft safe and functional "in a pinch." That might include becoming an electrician, a cleaner, a police officer.

I’m a leader and three things make a leader important:

1. In a bad situation, a leader has to step up and lead

2. Never ask somebody else to do what you wouldn’t do

3. Set a tone and set an example

So you’re damn straight I will demand a mop and cleaning fluid if I see something unacceptable in my aircraft…that outsourced minimum-wage employees refused to address

That is an awesome attitude! You made my day and put a warm smile on my face!

a320fan wrote:

I never understand how public facilities get to the state they end up in. It’s really not hard to use the bathroom without making a mess anywhere. I would always presume lav maintenance inflight would be a cabin crew responsibility, if it’s specified for crew in certain carriers that it’s not their job then good for them. If I was a crew member I would want to present my bathrooms in a good state for my passengers, as that’s what I expect as a pax, especially on a long haul. Don’t think anyone thinks it’s a glamorous or pleasurable task but provide me with the right equipment and I’ll do it.

Ever get into a co-worker's car and find it in a shocking state? I have. Some people are slobs and will live in filth if no one else cleans up for them. To think otherwise is not realistic.

What about in Europe?

Woodreau wrote:

Water on the deck is never water…

I could come from the sink...

I remember in the late 80s when I was still a kid, the toilets onboard the B747SPs I flew from Hong Kong to San Francisco and from Seattle to Hong Kong were disgusting

There was no vacuum flash back then

UAUA wrote:

What about in Europe?

My wife flies for a Dutch major airline and for and long as she had been flying she had to clean the toilets. Before departure they even have toilets assigned to them for cleaning. If a bom had dropped and it's to filthy it will be locked.

aeromoe wrote:

Woodreau wrote:

Water on the deck is never water…

I could come from the sink...

737MAX anyone?

My last US domestic flight had 2 of four lavs out of service for the 3.5hour flight, yet the remainder weren't too gross so I suspect some cleaning (B6)

Surprisingly most toilets onboard US airlines long haul flights are spotless even just before landing. Guess most people are well toilet trained

So no toilet cleaning at all for US airlines? Geez

No volunteers?