What's Better QF Or AC To SYD?

StarAC17 · Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:37 pm

Hey All,

I'm planning on going to Australia in 2 weeks for a 14 day Contiki tour on account that I have some time off over the winter and would love to do something exciting.

I went to a travel agency (Flight Centre) today and got some flight prices and would like to know which one is the better deal in terms of service and IFE compared to price.

Thanks.

Option 1:

Leave Jan 29 on OF3246 to LAX (Operated by an AA 738) from YYZ at 18:50
Arrive LAX: at 21:20
Connect to QF 108 (a B744) leaving at 23:45 and arriving in SYD Jan 31 at 9:20

This costs with the return which will be on Feb 20th (which I may change) is CAD $2801.60 tax included.

Option 2:

Leave YYZ on Jan 28th on AC 33 (a 77L) at 20:10 and arrive in SYD at 10:05 on Jan 30th.
This is slated as direct with a stop which I believe is YVR.

I would be returning on or around Feb 20th as well and this costs $2,467.30

EXAAUADL · Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:46 pm

AA/QF isnt worth the extra $350.......

ZBBYLW · Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:52 pm

If I were you I would take AC. First of all if your AA flight is late and the QF flight is on time you can miss your QF flight, with AC it is the same airplane that goes YYZ-YVR-SYD so that risk is eliminated. Also I think you would be happier with AC. I have flown QF LAX-SYD before and was unimpressed. The F/As were good but otherwise it was a bad experience. The IFE is much smaller on the QF plane (forget if it was AVOD or not). With AC you have a nice big AVOD system (That now works quite well). Plus you save some money with AC which would be a nice big treat.

jfk777 · Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:59 pm

Air Canada's new 777 are world leading and an Executive Class as good as any ones. Realize the fares mentioned are coach.

tayser · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:00 pm

Why force yourself to go through US immigration and customs?

Dunno if you've ever been to Australia before, but we're a tight-ar$e country with regards to immigration and customs and yes you will be put through the 3rd degree when you arrive - and no-one cares that you've been in transit for 20-24 hours Smile

So yes, do yourself a favour and minimise the pain, Air Canucker all the way.

$0.02.

brilondon · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:07 pm

I would take the AC flight as you would avoid having to enter the U.S. Also Having to go through LAX is not always the best route to Australia. I think that the trip through YVR if you could manage a couple of days on your return would be well worth it. I have done both and quite frankly the AC experience is much more pleasant then going on AA.

ZBBYLW · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:09 pm

And one thing I forgot to mention is AC's 77L are much newer than QF's 747s so that will be nice... Plus Doing the AC route you would not be stuck on AA and a Narrow Body.

Viscount724 · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:09 pm

And why put up with having to clear US customs/immigration (pre-clearance at YYZ) if you don't have to?

brilondon · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:11 pm

I would take the AC flight as you would avoid having to enter the U.S. Also Having to go through LAX is not always the best route to Australia. I think that the trip through YVR if you could manage a couple of days on your return would be well worth it. I have done both and quite frankly the AC experience is much more pleasant then going on AA.

Lufthansa · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:14 pm

I'd take AA/QF.

First of all QF has a bucket load of flights so if your AA flight is delayed you can get on an alternate flight via SFO or a different LAX departure, remembering QF goes out also to MEL AKL and BNE as well as sydney and they're are multiple frequencies.

Next. In flight catering. AC doesnt even come close to QF in this department.
QF also has mid flight snacks and things for econ passengers as well as ammenities kits. QF also has AVOD

Next. Time it right and you can get on the Airbus A380.

There are 3 major positives for AC on this route.
First is you can avoid transit in the USA.
The next is if your an A/C freuqent flyer you get miles.
The next is AC is cheaper.

Here is an air canada long haul economy meal from YYZ to LHR

Here's a QF one from Syd to Hong Kong

Next Air Canada are a 3 star airline
Qantas are a 4 star airline.

There's a couple of other options you've got that perhaps you haven't considered.

1 is via asia on Cathay, Singapore or JAL
2 - Air New Zealand are Very good and they actually fly to YVR a few times a week.
As NZ are star alliance you'll get points at AC.

StarAC17 · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:19 pm

Quoting Tayser (Reply 4):
Dunno if you've ever been to Australia before, but we're a tight-ar$e country with regards to immigration and customs and yes you will be put through the 3rd degree when you arrive - and no-one cares that you've been in transit for 20-24 hours Smile

I haven't and define the 3rd degree in terms of customs as I have really never had a problem entering any country that I have been to.

Ironically though I have been given the 3rd degree 3 times when crossing back into Canada, never by air though just crossing back by car.

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 9):
Next. Time it right and you can get on the Airbus A380.

When does that fly because I might try and do that for my return flight if I choose QF.

[Edited 2009-01-16 15:21:38]

[Edited 2009-01-16 15:23:00]

powercube · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:25 pm

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 9):
2 - Air New Zealand are Very good and they actually fly to YVR a few times a week.
As NZ are star alliance you'll get points at AC.

I've taken both AC and NZ to SYD. NZ is drastically superior, especially when it comes to catering and service.

tayser · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:26 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 10):
define the 3rd degree in terms of customs

Passport control's pretty quick as long as you and the people infront of you have the proper ETAs.

You'd be very lucky if you were just whisked through customs - we're tight because we have an island mentality and everything is screened - be prepared to wait in a customs line for an hour (hardest part of long-haul flying to Australia is the customs clearance).

jbernie · Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:32 pm

As an Aussie I say take the QF flight all the way.

As an Aussie who has done DEN-LAX/SFo-SYD/MEL a few times in my life I say go the non stop route on AC, why add in more hassle with the tranist in LAX when you can go nonstop and just relax and enjoy one flight.

An additional option, though not sure how it would fit into your plans but if QF still has the once weekly (Thursday?) morning flight from LAX-SYD then you can leave on a morning flight, arrive in SYD late evening, go straight to bed and wake up the next day feeling a whole lot better. It isnt easy staying awake late enough the day you arrive to get back into a normal sleep cycle, quite often by about 7-8pm I am ready for sleep and you then wake up at 4-5am with nothing to do for a few hours and repeat a few times until you can get onto a normal rythym.

Gmm Jan 29th is a Thursday, you might be in luck, just don't know if you can get there in time for a morning flight.

Viscount724 · Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:46 am

Quoting Powercube (Reply 11):
I've taken both AC and NZ to SYD. NZ is drastically superior, especially when it comes to catering and service.

But service also includes travel time and the fastest NZ connection YVR-AKL-SYD takes almost 3.5 hrs. longer (18:45) than AC's nonstop (15:20). On AC you're landing in SYD about the time the 3 hr. plus AKL-SYD connecting flight is departing.

Daily service is also an advantage especially for business traffic. An unnecessary connection also increases possibilities for delays and baggage to go astray.

StarAC17 · Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:18 am

Quoting Tayser (Reply 12):
You'd be very lucky if you were just whisked through customs - we're tight because we have an island mentality and everything is screened - be prepared to wait in a customs line for an hour

We do that here but its not for the screening process of what comes into Canada so much is that the government is looking for the guy who is bringing in 51 cigars from his trip to Cuba instead of the allowed 50 after a week away. Simply said they want the money from the duty they will charge.

Thanks for the advice and I'll try to make sure I don't bring anything that will get me in trouble with customs.

ACDC8 · Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:36 am

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 9):
Next. In flight catering. AC doesnt even come close to QF in this department.

I haven't been on QF, so I can't compare, but ACs catering is quite good IMHO. I've flown with them quite frequently long haul and have only been disapointed once, and that was way back in 04.

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 9):
QF also has AVOD

So does AC on their 767, 777 and some A330. If I'm not mistake, this flight uses the 777, so you'll have AVOD.

While I agree with ACs biggest advantage is not having to go through the US, personally I would book AA/QF, simply because I haven't been on either and would love to try them out, but thats just me Smile

Lufthansa · Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:18 am

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 16):
but ACs catering is quite good IMHO.

It's good compared to say, American or US Airways but its not good compared to Qantas or to NZ. Or Singapore or Emirates. Particularly in premium classes Air Canada is quite poor in this regard. As i said, compared to Just North America its not bad but by global standards, its not anywhere near euro carriers like Air France either. The poor presentation of food in J would deter me from travelling with air canada. Which is a real shame because I'd like to give them some business on trips to the USA instead of a US carrier at times. But these are LONG flights people. This isn't a quick hop to london.

longhauler · Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:36 pm

On QF, seat pitch is 31", seat width is 17.5".
On AC, seat pitch is 32", seat width is 18.5".

I am not sure if you need the extra inch, (ahem), but on a trip half way around the world, it might make a difference all the way from YYZ.

Also, with the hellish winter storms we have been having, you might feel more comfortable with a delay in YYZ, knowing it is the same aircraft through YVR to SYD.

SA7700 · Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:53 pm

I fly a fair bit on Qantas between South Africa & Australia and sometimes beyond. It is the fastest option between JNB-SYD-JNB; the fares are not that exorbitant IMO, I still get to accrue Star Frequent Flyer mileage with the SA codeshare-agreement in place and the overall service is usually good.

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 17):
The poor presentation of food in J would deter me from travelling with air canada. Which is a real shame because I'd like to give them some business on trips to the USA instead of a US carrier at times. But these are LONG flights people. This isn't a quick hop to london.

With regards to the presentation of food: During a recent long-haul in QF First, one of my entrees was presented with the “added bonus” of a human hair in the dish. Disgusting as it may be, it was reported and dealt with by the crew, to my satisfaction. Smile

I recently flew with AC (77W) - based on that experience and despite my love for Qantas, I will not spend an extra CAD334.00 in airfare on an AA/QF combo via LAX

-- I do my utmost best to avoid LAX like the plague.
-- AC offers a good product with reduced flying time via YVR.
-- AC offers AVOD, 32” seat pitch + 18.5” of seat width on their 77L's versus QF's AVOD, 31” seat pitch + 17.5” seat width on their 744’s.

Just ask yourself the question whether you are willing to fore-go CAD334.00 on a more expensive product, when you can get to SYD on a cheaper, yet comparable product and get to spend CAD334.00 on something more spectacular in Australia, other than 45 hours of combined flying time?

That being said, this is YOUR vacation and you get to decide which way to go. Whichever choice you make in the end, enjoy your visit to Australia! It is one of the greatest places to experience in the world. bigthumbsup

Rgds

SA7700

ACDC8 · Sun Jan 18, 2009 7:36 am

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 17):
It's good compared to say, American or US Airways but its not good compared to Qantas or to NZ. Or Singapore or Emirates

Which is why I said I can't compare it to QF, but rather that I find their catering quite good. And given the photos you provided, it doesn't look any worse than QF.

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 17):
But these are LONG flights people. This isn't a quick hop to london.

I wouldn't consider a 10 hour flight to LHR or FRA from YVR a "quick hop"

Sure, its not a 14+ YVR-SYD flight, but by no means a short hop.

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 17):
Particularly in premium classes Air Canada is quite poor in this regard. As i said, compared to Just North America its not bad but by global standards, its not anywhere near euro carriers like Air France either.

As far as Y class goes, ACs catering can compare very closely to that of Euro carriers. I find BA a tad better, but AC has, for the most part kept up with BA, LH, KL from my experiences.

[Edited 2009-01-17 23:37:39]

StarAC17 · Sun Jan 18, 2009 8:11 pm

Thanks for all the input Smile

I have chosen the QF flight because when I went back to the travel agency the AC flight went up to approx $4000 from $2460 and even after calling AC they were quoting fares that were at the minimum $3500 and no cheaper if I was to connect on UA or NZ out of LAX or SFO.

The final price is CAD $2900 because going there I'm going YYZ-LAX-SYD but returning I am going CNS-BNE-LAX-SYD due to the fact that the tour ends in Cairns and that added $100 to the fare.

I am really excited for this though Big grin

StarAC17 · Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:40 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 21):
CNS-BNE-LAX-SYD

I meant CNS-BNE-LAX-YYZ if some of you were thinking wtf.

ACDC8 · Sun Jan 18, 2009 10:59 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 21):
I have chosen the QF flight because when I went back to the travel agency the AC flight went up to approx $4000 from $2460 and even after calling AC they were quoting fares that were at the minimum $3500 and no cheaper if I was to connect on UA or NZ out of LAX or SFO.

I would have made the same decision Big grin

I'm sure it was the right one as well.

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 21):
I am really excited for this though

Hope you have a great trip Smile

cpd · Mon Jan 19, 2009 11:04 am

Quoting Tayser (Reply 12):

You'd be very lucky if you were just whisked through customs - we're tight because we have an island mentality and everything is screened - be prepared to wait in a customs line for an hour (hardest part of long-haul flying to Australia is the customs clearance).

Tell me about it. I got off a very long UA flight some time back, and got stuck a 2 hour queue waiting to get through the checks - only to get near the front and them be rushed through without any screening whatsoever.

By the end of that, I was properly tired.

EuroPL · Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:15 am

Hey,

I flew AC33 & AC34 last summer from YYZ in Y. The IFE was amazing (80+ hours of AVOD), the food was even better. The stop in YVR is fairly short 45-60 min. Basically you get off, they clean the plane, and your back on for thet next 15 hours. Believe it or not it goes by fairly quickly, YYZ-YVR seemed more dreadful, mostly because it was really late. Since you get on in YYZ you get an extra meal, and dont have to Buy on Board, that goes for the return as well.

On the way back its more of the same, SYD-YVR leg took about 12:45, the down part is that you must go through customs in YVR, and check your bags again.

Have a great time In Australia

-EuroPL

StarAC17 · Thu Jan 22, 2009 3:08 am

Quoting EuroPL (Reply 25):
I flew AC33 & AC34 last summer from YYZ in Y. The IFE was amazing (80+ hours of AVOD), the food was even better. The stop in YVR is fairly short 45-60 min. Basically you get off, they clean the plane, and your back on for thet next 15 hours.

If I could have got that fare I would have taken because of 1 big thing which is lost luggage. Which I dread happening if my AA flight is late to LAX and they can't get the bags on in time.

It turns out that the original Contiki tour that I wanted filled up over the past weekend so I am now leaving on Feb 11th and coming back March 5th. Also the QF route is better because I am leaving from Cairns and not Sydney and its just seems more convenient to use QF flying in Australia.

Quoting EuroPL (Reply 25):
Believe it or not it goes by fairly quickly, YYZ-YVR seemed more dreadful, mostly because it was really late.

The length of the flight is my biggest concern but I think with the IFE on demand I will be fine even a 14.5hr flight because I have the choice to watch whatever I want from the options and after reading some of the QF trip reports it seems very decent. I remember renting one of these on a TS flight from YYZ to POP and the flight went by like that, I actually hoped the flight was longer because I didn't get all the way through watching Talledega Nights.

I also plan to fill up my Ipod touch with a bunch of movies, tv shows, podcasts and music as well.

longhauler · Thu Jan 22, 2009 5:22 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 26):
If I could have got that fare I would have taken because of 1 big thing which is lost luggage.

Is it too late to change your plans? With AC's current sale, the YYZ-SYD fare for your new dates is CAD 799.00 each way !!!! Heck of a deal.

I guess we all have our own concerns, mine would be one of our famous winter storms rolling through YYZ and AA canceling or delaying your flight. There is some comfort knowing the ship on which your sitting in YYZ which is now 3 hours late, its the one that will also fly you from YVR-SYD.

StarAC17 · Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:29 pm

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 27):
Is it too late to change your plans? With AC's current sale, the YYZ-SYD fare for your new dates is CAD 799.00 each way !!!! Heck of a deal.

Damn Damn Damn, I see it on AC's website for basically the same days banghead

It is too late because I have already been issued the tickets from QF and have paid for them in full and I am not going to screw with a confirmed seat this time of year to Australia.

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 27):
I guess we all have our own concerns, mine would be one of our famous winter storms rolling through YYZ and AA canceling or delaying your flight. There is some comfort knowing the ship on which your sitting in YYZ which is now 3 hours late, its the one that will also fly you from YVR-SYD.

This does worry me but I can't control the weather and I hope it doesn't happen crossfingers

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