I just read this piece called: What it’s like to be that fat person sitting next to you on the plane.

A very good read, and from a point of view seldom discussed.

Thought it was worth posting here.


[Edited 2016-03-07 14:55:48]

Try this...

http://medium.com/@thefatshadow/what...-the-plane-85006e263778#.1ej27a5le

Quoting B757Forever (Reply 1): Try this...

Thanks. Got it working eventually!

A very good read. Yes it is uncomfortable if you're sitting next to someone too big for their seat, but the experience is much much worse for them.

Quoting benjjk (Reply 3): but the experience is much much worse for them.

....but at the end of the day, they're still violating your personal space, not the inverse; so not really sure if that's a fair assessment.

Quoting benjjk (Reply 3): but the experience is much much worse for them.

I don't know about that. I had to fly from BOS-LAX one time between two very large people on a sold out flight and literally had cramps from being scrunched in between for almost six hours.

I do have sympathy to what the writer is saying but for 99% of obese people this is a problem they have brought about themselves and should fix themselves (diet and exercise) if for no other reason than their own health.

Quoting benjjk (Reply 3): Yes it is uncomfortable if you're sitting next to someone too big for their seat, but the experience is much much worse for them.

Although in 99.99% of cases, it's something that they can control and change. It's a choice to be that big...

Quoting rwsea (Reply 6): Although in 99.99% of cases, it's something that they can control and change. It's a choice to be that big...

Bull Squirt! There are so many reasons for heaviness & obesity, this your perspective in the Netherlands where no one is overweight, because you all can ride bikes the short distances in Amsterdam or whatever place you live in, also the fact that genetics does play a large role in weight as well, I've never met an overweight Dutchman except in South Africa. The fact is many people would benefit from a more active lifestyle, but you can not state that 99.99% of people can help their weight, that's just ignorant. This statement you need to provide facts for. Where is Doc Lightning when you need him?

Quoting klkla (Reply 5): I do have sympathy to what the writer is saying but for 99% of obese people this is a problem they have brought about themselves and should fix themselves (diet and exercise) if for no other reason than their own health.

Quoting rwsea (Reply 6): Although in 99.99% of cases, it's something that they can control and change. It's a choice to be that big...

You guys are definitely correct in the most technical sense. Almost all obesity is in fact controllable.

However, aversion to excercise and food addictions/eating disorders are fantastically difficult habits to break. There are many and well documented reasons why diets always fail and if you're not in the position of having to make those changes, it's almost impossible to understand how difficult that is to implement. It's, in all honesty, a harder change to make than quitting smoking or drinking.

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 4): ....but at the end of the day, they're still violating your personal space, not the inverse; so not really sure if that's a fair assessment.

No doubt. But there's room for both things to be true.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7): this your perspective in the Netherlands where no one is overweight,

It's also mine in the USA where everyone's a freakin' fatass.

Obviously "99%" is hyperbole, but the point remains-- for likely more individuals than not, being grossly overweight is a choice.

But then again, religion is a choice, and we cater to that crap (for whatever inane reason)... so sorta stunts my argument.  

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7): Bull Squirt! There are so many reasons for heaviness & obesity, this your perspective in the Netherlands where no one is overweight, because you all can ride bikes the short distances in Amsterdam or whatever place you live in, also the fact that genetics does play a large role in weight as well, I've never met an overweight Dutchman except in South Africa. The fact is many people would benefit from a more active lifestyle, but you can not state that 99.99% of people can help their weight, that's just ignorant. This statement you need to provide facts for. Where is Doc Lightning when you need him?

Fine, maybe the "99.99%" statistic is a bit of hyperbole, but his general point is still valid, which you yourself seem to acknowledge. Yes, there are some people who have medical conditions where their weight is beyond their control. But for the overwhelming majority of people (without quoting an exact statistic), obesity or being overweight is a direct result of lifestyle choices.

Yes, I did feel badly for the author of this article but I also found her response to the act of flying to be a bit over the top. If she's that emotional about it, just buy a second seat. Life isn't fair. Not everyone can do everything. Their rights and freedoms stop where mine begin, which, in this case, is the armrest and the edge of my seat.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7):

Nobody in The Netherlands is overweight? The percentage is indeed lower than most western countries and obesity is rare, but I have know some rather rotund Dutch people. Yes, still living there.

Quoting rwsea (Reply 6):

Yes, I have met hundreds of people who, at the age of 12, said "I want to be fat". It's not a choice, the choice is being unwilling, or unable, to do anything about it. Almost always unwilling.

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 11): It's not a choice, the choice is being unwilling, or unable, to do anything about it.

Bull.

No one's holding a gun to their head and making them eat a double-whopper with cheese... or deepfry everything... or drink nothing but pure sugar.

I think it's clearly true that for a good plurality, maybe even a majority of obese people, it's their own choices that determine their size. However it is also true that genetics, diabetes, hormones etc are also a major factor for many people. Beyond that we can talk about societal factors such as design of cities and living spaces that nudge people in one direction or the other.

But for me this article isn't about whose fault being fat is. The writer doesn't diminish the experience of those who have to sit next to a fat person. She's just sharing her own experience and how she views things, which I found to be very interesting because it's a point of view that's seldom expressed.

I do agree with the author on one thing, I think the mainstream media's depiction of pretty much all fat people as stupid and unclean is a simplification and is unhelpful.

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 12):

They still did not sit down one day and proclaim a desire to be fat. The choices they made are usually the cause, yes. But, most have very low self esteem, very poor parenting on food and/or addiction problems. I don't excuse the choices, nor do I say they cannot usually change it, I know it can be done. if you know a fat person, take them out for a walk, don't just judge them as unworthy.

Unless you are working out hard for an hour a day, eating one plate three times a day of which 75 % is vegatables or fruit spare us from all "I'm only fat for medical reasons."

Mind you none of this easy but part solving the problem is naming it accurately.

And yes , sitting next to a fat person is a drag.

Quoting Planeflyer (Reply 15):

Exactly right, overweight people do eat poorly as a rule. And if you are thinking I am claiming there is a medical reason, you are mistaken, I certainly am not. They tend to have no idea how to eat properly, they tend to eat fried greasy food, they tend to avoid fruits and vegetables, and they usually want to change. Much like most smokers, they know what is wrong, they just have people making fun of them, looking at them with disgust and ignoring them.

As for sitting next to a fat person on an airplane, it is not a bad a sitting next to walking ashtray, or a person who thinks they don't need soap because they just bought a large bottle of perfume.

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 16): Exactly right, overweight people do eat poorly as a rule. And if you are thinking I am claiming there is a medical reason, you are mistaken, I certainly am not. They tend to have no idea how to eat properly, they tend to eat fried greasy food, they tend to avoid fruits and vegetables, and they usually want to change. As for sitting next to a fat person on an airplane, it is not a bad a sitting next to walking ashtray, or a person who thinks they don't need soap because they just bought a large bottle of perfume.

   Yes! I will sit next to an overweight person over these examples above any day!

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 14): But, most have very low self esteem, very poor parenting on food and/or addiction problems. I don't excuse the choices, nor do I say they cannot usually change it, I know it can be done. if you know a fat person, take them out for a walk, don't just judge them as unworthy.

Yes! Well said.


IMHO it is often self discipline and a desire not to be lazy. I have recently consciously really dieted for the first time in my life, as I do not want to go from the healthy weight range, into the bottom of the overweight range to some upward spiral; used to be underweight range when I was much younger but age and lifestyle have been the 'biggest' contributor. Catch it early and manage it.

I feel for people on flights who are tall, that seems more of an issue, and one much less controllable. I guess that doesn't really affect other people as much though, unless it is the knees in the back of the seat thing and the dreaded ....reclining.

Quoting Imisspiedmont,

I know how tough addiction is and yes shame and blame only make it worse but it is also true that sympathy often enables the addict. It's a very tricky issue.

Having said that most people who are obese can turn it around. Given what we know today something like 99% of obesity is preventable even for those who have never exercised.

I think the complaints rise due to usually full aircraft. No more do we receive the space we pay for.

The reality is that seats are only safe with a person 75 to 275 pounds in them. A truly obese person needs to buy two seats for safety reasons. Or do we put kids and petite people in danger?

Quoting aryonoco (Reply 13): I think it's clearly true that for a good plurality, maybe even a majority of obese people, it's their own choices that determine their size. However it is also true that genetics, diabetes, hormones etc are also a major factor for many people. Beyond that we can talk about societal factors such as design of cities and living spaces that nudge people in one direction or the other.

While I agree, I've only met one obese person who tried, really tried, to change lifestyle. All others were happy victims. I eat too much, but I still have a great metabolism. Yet all obese people outeat me and do less excersize.


We have a crisis in obesity. It invades others personal space. I work on aircraft and we have to 'release' people from projects because they cannot fit in 18" wide spaces as required. Cest la vie. You either fit in to do the work or you don't.

Lightsaber

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 14): They still did not sit down one day and proclaim a desire to be fat.

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 14): The choices they made are usually the cause, yes.

What's the difference? Actions speak louder than words.

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 14): But, most have very low self esteem, very poor parenting on food and/or addiction problems.

Boooo hooooo  

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 19): The reality is that seats are only safe with a person 75 to 275 pounds in them. A truly obese person needs to buy two seats for safety reasons. Or do we put kids and petite people in danger?

At the end of the day, safety is the most important issue, over comfort.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 19): We have a crisis in obesity. It invades others personal space. I work on aircraft and we have to 'release' people from projects because they cannot fit in 18" wide spaces as required. Cest la vie. You either fit in to do the work or you don't.

Obesity is a real problem in this country (too). Smoking also invades others space, and is banned from most work areas, but that one has been dealt with much better over recent years. Both are a risk to health and safety, particularly on and around aircraft.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7): Bull Squirt! There are so many reasons for heaviness & obesity, this your perspective in the Netherlands where no one is overweight, because you all can ride bikes the short distances in Amsterdam or whatever place you live in, also the fact that genetics does play a large role in weight as well,

This is the biggest catch cry of the obese; it's mythical and it needs to be scotched. "It's my glands!/genes!/metabolism!" Obesity results only from calorie intake being greater than calorie expenditure. End of story.

There really are no medical conditions which cause obesity. Sure, there is a very small group of endocrine problems which can make weight control harder. Hypothyroidism for example. Genetics can play a role (although separating out what is genetic from what is actually behavioural and cultural can be difficult to do). Prader-Willi is a syndrome like Down's (although much rarer) where the sufferers are mentally impaired and also hard-wired to continually eat. But in all these situations, if calorie intake is adjusted appropriately, obesity will not result.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7): this your perspective in the Netherlands where no one is overweight, because you all can ride bikes the short distances in Amsterdam or whatever place you live in, also the fact that genetics does play a large role in weight as well,

Thanks for perfectly illustrating my point. If being fat is a genetic or medical condition, rather than a personal choice, then how could there possibly exist a country where "no one is overweight"?

Back to the original article, I certainly can understand the anxiety that the author feels and it doesn't sound like flying is a positive experience for them at all. But at the same time, she doesn't have to be morbidly obese. It's a personal choice to continue the status quo rather than get healthy and improve one's health.

Quoting rwsea (Reply 23): Back to the original article, I certainly can understand the anxiety that the author feels and it doesn't sound like flying is a positive experience for them at all. But at the same time, she doesn't have to be morbidly obese. It's a personal choice to continue the status quo rather than get healthy and improve one's health.

Exactly. I read the article, and must admit it generated no feelings of sympathy from me at all.

Maybe I should write an article too, as I have a size issue that makes air travel difficult. But mine I really cannot help - being cursed with Dutch genetics, I am 6'4" tall. Cue the violins.

This article was written just for the sympathy factor. You could replace the word "fat" or "obese" with any other malady and the article would still work.

When I read that article, I only see that heir weight seems to cause her discomfort and that she should reduce it.

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 16): Exactly right, overweight people do eat poorly as a rule.

Well, no. It's definitely not a rule. Or if it is, I'm the exception. If you'd see what I'm eating you'd think I'm a health freak. No fast food. Lean meat, fish, vegetables, fruit. Very little fried stuff - basically only occasional fried fish when I can's resist. Limited intake of carbs. Limited use of fatty products when cooking. No excessive portions. And yet, my BMI is 32, meaning obese. And you know what? I don't care. My blood sugar is 4.8 mmol/l, my total cholesterol is 4.65 mmol/l, blood pressure 125/70. According to my doctor I'm healthy. If somebody doesn't like how I look like, well, it's not my problem.
And back to the topic: Similarly to the article's author I have to contort myself on narrower seats too. But the problem isn't my bottom. The shoulders are what's protruding to the neighbour's space.

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 4): ....but at the end of the day, they're still violating your personal space, not the inverse; so not really sure if that's a fair assessment.

Quoting klkla (Reply 5): iter is saying but for 99% of obese people this is a problem they have brought about themselves and should fix themselves

Quoting rwsea (Reply 6):

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 9): everyone's a freakin' fatass.

Quoting UALFAson (Reply 10): Their rights and freedoms stop where mine begin, which, in this case, is the armrest and the edge of my seat.

Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 11): It's not a choice, the choice is being unwilling, or unable, to do anything about it. Almost always unwilling.

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 12): No one's holding a gun to their head and making them eat a double-whopper with cheese... or deepfry everything... or drink nothing but pure sugar.

Quoting Planeflyer (Reply 15): spare us from all "I'm only fat for medical reasons."

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 20): Actions speak louder than words.

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 20): Boooo hooooo

The most disappointing thing about this entire issue is how blatantly awful people are to each other. Look at the discourse in this thread. Everything is "us versus them". "My personal space, not yours". "My decisions are better than yours".

How incredibly selfish and childish. These are people with feelings that are just as valid as yours. Try being just a little bit compassionate instead of judging everyone.

It is exactly the attitudes being displayed by most of the posters, that it's the "fatties" lack of self discipline, that led the woman in the article to make her feelings known. I have sat next to 125 pound a-holes who think the entire seat area belongs to them. I have sat next to "people of size" who try to make themselves as small as possible. I'd rather sit next to the "person of size".

Quoting flashmeister (Reply 28): The most disappointing thing about this entire issue is how blatantly awful people are to each other. Look at the discourse in this thread. Everything is "us versus them". "My personal space, not yours". "My decisions are better than yours". How incredibly selfish and childish. These are people with feelings that are just as valid as yours. Try being just a little bit compassionate instead of judging everyone.

              

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7): Where is Doc Lightning when you need him?

Squished.   

Quoting flashmeister (Reply 28): The most disappointing thing about this entire issue is how blatantly awful people are to each other. Look at the discourse in this thread. Everything is "us versus them". "My personal space, not yours". "My decisions are better than yours".

That is not the point, we all have to live with our decisions. If you decide to be fat, you must accept the fact that people will not like sitting next to you on a plane. Just the same as people who decide that body hygiene is optional, must accept people complaining when they sit next to them.

It is always the "normal" person who is asked to show compassion, obviously compassion for this person is not so important.

Quoting UALFAson (Reply 10): If she's that emotional about it, just buy a second seat.

Aaaaaaaand we have a winner!!!!!!!!!
The only "customer of size" policy I'm even remotely familiar with is WN's...which says it WILL REFUND the second seat as long as the flight does not oversell. So you're literally only paying for it in cases where somebody else would have sat there. Seems quite fair to me.

Quoting flashmeister (Reply 28): Everything is "us versus them". "My personal space, not yours"

I can have sympathy for another person while still expecting to receive the space I paid for. Nobody is comfortable on a plane. Period.

I have a medical problem which makes sitting upright for long periods painful. When I need to I go stand in the back by the lavs for a little while and hope the crew is in a mood to chat. If it were a severe problem I'd buy a whole row of 3 so I could lie down. It's MY problem to deal with, not yours, and I deal with it. You can have sympathy without being expected to let me lie in your lap. I can sympathize with the obese person without being expected to let them sit on me.

Quoting seahawk (Reply 31): It is always the "normal" person who is asked to show compassion, obviously compassion for this person is not so important.

I'm not sure that you read the article, then. The author clearly discusses how they attempt to have as little impact on others as possible.

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 32): I can have sympathy for another person while still expecting to receive the space I paid for. Nobody is comfortable on a plane. Period.

You're right that nobody is comfortable on a plane. So, why wouldn't people just put as much effort into getting along and getting through it instead of bitching and moaning about guarding their "personal space" from potential "invasion". You are in a relatively small metal tube with a couple hundred other people for a couple of hours. Your expectation to completely control your "personal space" should have passed the second you walked through the door.

By the way, you don't pay for personal space on a plane (unless you're upgrading from economy). You pay for one spot in the tube one way or the other, and for the materials and labor to get said tube from point A to point B. It's not like you're leasing an apartment -- it's an airline seat.

Quoting flashmeister (Reply 33): So, why wouldn't people just put as much effort into getting along and getting through it instead of bitching and moaning about guarding their "personal space" from potential "invasion".

Because when the seat has already been reduced to the minimum possible size, any encroachment of even a few inches from any direction changes it from mildly uncomfortable to downright painful.

I already explained in my post...I, too, have issues which can cause economy flying to be problematic for me. I deal with them myself and I would never expect another passenger to make his already uncomfortable ride even more so on my account. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect fat people to do the same.

Quoting flashmeister (Reply 33): you don't pay for personal space on a plane (unless you're upgrading from economy). You pay for one spot in the tube one way or the other, and for the materials and labor to get said tube from point

blah blah blah...pretty standard airline apoligist line on this site...read it a hundred times before, will see it a hundred times again. Adds nothing new to the discussion.

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 34): Because when the seat has already been reduced to the minimum possible size, any encroachment of even a few inches from any direction changes it from mildly uncomfortable to downright painful.

Then I'd suggest your beef lies with the airline, not the person you're seated next to. In any case, I'd just hope that people would cut it out with the "I want mine, screw everyone else" rhetoric, on both sides. It's absurd.

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 34): Adds nothing new to the discussion.

I see. Your point is valid, but others are not. See my comment before about absurdity.

The point of view from "Someone of considerable size" is something I had never even thought of as far a flying is concerned although I had encountered a very large man in the USA on an AA MD-80 flight.
This Gent was the last to board on a half empty flight, there were plenty of seats available for him but no he had been assigned the empty seat next to me. I couldn't believe it when he leaned in and lifted the centre arm rest without asking and then turning around to ooze himself in Ass first.
As he sat I was seriously pushed against the side of the aircraft, he needed a seat belt extension at full length and you could see even that was tight for him. I had to get out, we all know that large people don't always smell great. I reclined my seat fully, undid my belt and went over the back awkwardly to the empty row behind. First words the large man said "never seen no one do that".
FA cam through the aisle to check belts and notice I had moved seats and insisted I return to my assigned seat, which I refused. More senior FA turned up and I explained that my seat is half occupied by someone else, "What harm can it do if I sit here?" They left it at that. I would later write to AA but not a complaint just stating the facts, I received a reply about load distribution on flights that were not full.
In this case I can see I did not consider this man at all, it was him that made me uncomfortable to the point I had to move away, the fact he barely spoke or excused himself added to the situation, all I cared about was my own comfort not his, I couldn't have cared less.

Ok so this guy has feelings and in his own mind he might have convinced himself that his biological make up made him that way but we all know that historically Americans came from other countries unless they are descended from native tribes, and those countries don't have such massive people so it can only relate to lifestyle.

I was astounded when I heard that Yankee stadium had all its seats removed and replaced with wider ones reducing the capacity by about 20% "Because Americans are getting bigger."
If you have a few photos of your great grand parents but you are bigger than all of them, Ask yourself who you take after?

There are few medical conditions that cause fluid retention, these are often isolated in single limbs.

Note also that prisoners freed from Changi POW camp in Singapore were all skinny, no fat people came out of there. I'm not saying that's a good thing but these poor individuals were seriously deprived of food, all of those that survived had lost masses of weight, the point being little food= weight loss regardless of how big you are.

Quoting flashmeister (Reply 33): I'm not sure that you read the article, then. The author clearly discusses how they attempt to have as little impact on others as possible.

And I understand the article as a complaint that she has to do this and that people are not happy when they are seated next to her. I understand this is no nice experience for her, but it is not a nice experience for the other passenger as well.

I've lost a lot of weight in my time, but I still take up as much space as I used to. I can't help having broad shoulders - I'm as wide as I was when I was fat. I'm sure people in the gate area were praying I wasn't going to be next to them, but I was always between the armrests across the stomach and thighs. I would impinge on your personal space just as much now but I bet you wouldn't look at me like I was scum.

Same as my partner is never going to be "light", you can feel she's structurally always not going to be small in her hips and shoulders.

She is working to lose weight (which even she admits is from poor lifestyle for a year after high school), but together we're always going to be awkwardly sized in seats anywhere. More than once one of us one of us has nearly come off the seat when a bus or train swerves, and we're usually closer together than the average passenger.

Simple question, does either of you need a seat belt extender?

Quoting seahawk (Reply 39): Simple question, does either of you need a seat belt extender?

They don't go around your shoulders, unless I've been totally misunderstanding the safety videos.

I didn't read the full article, but imagine the discomfort (in more ways than one) using the lav.

Quoting coolian2 (Reply 40): Quoting seahawk (Reply 39): Simple question, does either of you need a seat belt extender? They don't go around your shoulders, unless I've been totally misunderstanding the safety videos.

And that is the difference. If you have wide shoulders or a women has a wide hip, you still fit into the seat, you can use the normal seat belt, you can get the tray down. That is a totally different level to the people usually needing a seat belt extender on a plane.

Quoting seahawk (Reply 42): That is a totally different level to the people usually needing a seat belt extender on a plane.

I needed one on one flight back when I was ~180kgs. I was still between the armrests in the "fat" areas (on an all Y 737 classic) and used a laptop on the tray table with no issues. With the disclaimer that on my return A320 flight I got the fitted belt on fine and had to tighten it.

Put simply, I take up as much space into the other seat as I did 100 kilos ago. But now you wouldn't consider me scum of the earth and wouldn't demean or belittle me.

Quoting coolian2 (Reply 43): I needed one on one flight back when I was ~180kgs. I was still between the armrests in the "fat" areas (on an all Y 737 classic) and used a laptop on the tray table with no issues. With the disclaimer that on my return A320 flight I got the fitted belt on fine and had to tighten it. Put simply, I take up as much space into the other seat as I did 100 kilos ago. But now you wouldn't consider me scum of the earth and wouldn't demean or belittle me.

I can only speak for me, but as long as you get your tray down and do not need to remove the armrest between us to even fit into the seat, I do not care how you look. But once you are so big, that you need to fold the armrest back to even fit and need to use the other persons tray because yours won´t come down enough to put food on it, I think it would be fair to buy 2 seats instead of making another person (who paid for his ticket) miserable.

It is not like all people of size are nice people. I once flew on the middle seat between a couple of size, who intentionally booked the window and aisle seat of a row on a A320 in the hope that the person assigned to the middle seat would move away on his own, so that they have more space. Unfortunately for me the flight was fully booked. In the end I had the luck that the crew let me stand in the galley for most of the 2 hours and I could sit on a FA seat during landing with the FA going to the jump seat in the cockpit.

Quoting seahawk (Reply 44): I can only speak for me, but as long as you get your tray down and do not need to remove the armrest between us to even fit into the seat, I do not care how you look. But once you are so big, that you need to fold the armrest back to even fit and need to use the other persons tray because yours won´t come down enough to put food on it, I think it would be fair to buy 2 seats instead of making another person (who paid for his ticket) miserable. It is not like all people of size are nice people. I once flew on the middle seat between a couple of size, who intentionally booked the window and aisle seat of a row on a A320 in the hope that the person assigned to the middle seat would move away on his own, so that they have more space. Unfortunately for me the flight was fully booked. In the end I had the luck that the crew let me stand in the galley for most of the 2 hours and I could sit on a FA seat during landing with the FA going to the jump seat in the cockpit.

I like to put the armrest up and will use the middle seat/tray table on a shared basis if it's empty.

Obviously there are limits in how people behave and need to be realistic about what they need, but there's no need to be outright rude, and I'm aware it goes both ways. There's no doubt the couple you're referring to are jerkasses, whereas even now between myself and my partner, we're the first people to jump up if someone else could benefit from a seat, if we're together and it might be tight, two of us will move for one person since we know it's likely to be uncomfortable for the other person - and we're young and healthy (well, debatable). That's including me having an often dud knee and general politeness of letting the woman still sit. Did this paragraph have a point or have I pulled too many all-nighters lately?

I'm confused by your last sentence and I'm open to being wrong.....doesn't the FA have a bit of a need to be in the cabin?

It was a few years back and it could have been a A319, which at the time had 4 seats but only 3 FA.

rwsea wrote:

Quoting benjjk (Reply 3):Yes it is uncomfortable if you're sitting next to someone too big for their seat, but the experience is much much worse for them.
Although in 99.99% of cases, it's something that they can control and change. It's a choice to be that big...

Coming in late to the game but I have to disagree that it is a choice, in the way what kind of shirt to wear is a choice. Obesity is complex, but the fact is, we are all wired to be obese. It is a great evolutionary strategy when we evolved one meal away from famine. That is why feasts are common celebrations in every culture.

We are to food what a crackhead is to a rock. This is proven by MRI studies. So with the abundance of cheap starchy food no wonder there is an obesity epidemic. One of the things people don't talk about in terms of obesity is the fact that food - specifically cheap starchy food *engineered by scientists to set off your crack sensation in the brain* (read the end of overeating by a fat former FDA head) is so abundant. It wasn't this abundant even in the US 40 years ago. Look at the portion sizes in restaurants. Again these foods don't exist in nature and they are engineered specifically to be addictive, I mean truly addictive as in brain changes that can be seen in lab studies. Just like Maté de Coca is fine and natural but crack - an engineered artificial derivative sure isn't. Just like alcoholism skyrocketed when distilled spirits (don't exist in nature and far more alcoholic) became common. obesity is skyrocketing now that food crack is cheap and plentiful.

If you are think, you might say then 'why am I so thin?' A lot of reasons, but part of it is how you were raised. If you were raised on cheap starchy crap in a dysfunctional family then even as an adult *even when you should know better* the crackhead in your brain is jonesing for chips and the crackhead will win. If you are fat, that part of your brain is primed for crap and will be primed for crap until they day you die no matter how think you eventually become. Meaning willpower isn't evenly distributed. Just like I can have a beer or two and stop, an alcoholic simply cannot. I never snark at an alcoholic and say 'why can I have a glass of wine and stop.' My brain isn't primed for alcohol. If yours is you gotta avoid alcohol at all costs and the willpower to do that is immense and requires a huge support group. Same thing with food addiction which *permamantly rewires your brain.*

Oh and the reason starchy food is so cheap. If you're from the US, your tax dollars at work. Corn as in cornchips, High Fructose Corn sugar is one of the most subsidized crops.

flashmeister wrote:

The author clearly discusses how they attempt to have as little impact on others as possible.

They attempt to have as little impact by squishing their rolls of fat in between the armrests...big deal. If fatties really wanted to have as little impact as others as possible, they wouldn't have gotten fat in the first place, or they would actually stop eating and start exercising.

seahawk wrote:

Simple question, does either of you need a seat belt extender?

I've long felt these extenders should be banned. If someone is so huge that a normal seatbelt cannot reach around their gut they should either be forced to buy a first or business class seat, or they should be deemed "too fat to fly" and no allowed on a plane. With the seat belt extender we're not talking about people who call themselves "big boned" or are 20-30 lbs overweight. We're talking about people so ridiculously fat that they could keel over at any minute. They also risk the lives of all the other passengers in an emergency; in the event of an evacuation blimps this big could easily become wedged in the emergency exit....therefore justifying the "too fat to fly" label.

klkla wrote:

but for 99% of obese people this is a problem they have brought about themselves and should fix themselves (diet and exercise) if for no other reason than their own health.

Do you have any supporting medical evidence for quoting that metric, or is that just your own extremely offensive opinion?

Obesity has many complex causes; some of which are lifestyle (controllable), some of which are environmental (somewhat controllable), some of which are genetic (not controllable), and some of which are societal (not controllable). Reducing a complex epidemic like obesity (http://www.who.int/nutrition/topics/obesity/en/) to pat and uninformed opinions like you gave serves no purpose but to highlight your own prejudices, I'm afraid.