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Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:24 pm
by CrimsonNL
A video of a TK 321 reportedly being "deiced" is making rounds on Facebook and Twitter. It basically shows 2 guys on a ladder rolling what looks like a water-cooler bottle down the wing of the aircraft. The video maker claims that this is how they deiced the wing. Obviously it's not a proper way to deice, but I can't think of any other reason why you would be pouring water on a wing..

http://twitter.com/u_g_u_r_p/status/818794037486424065

Martijn

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:36 pm
by LAXintl
I doubt the wing had any real ice on it especially with the bright sun heating it. At most it was frost.

They likely simply desired to coat the wing small amount of warmer fluid.

Really not much different than using these small handheld sprayers to apply small of liquid against frost.

Image

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:38 pm
by BasilFawlty
Looks more like a 737. ;)

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:40 pm
by moo
CrimsonNL wrote:
A video of a TK 321 reportedly being "deiced" is making rounds on Facebook and Twitter. It basically shows 2 guys on a ladder rolling what looks like a water-cooler bottle down the wing of the aircraft. The video maker claims that this is how they deiced the wing. Obviously it's not a proper way to deice, but I can't think of any other reason why you would be pouring water on a wing..

http://twitter.com/u_g_u_r_p/status/818794037486424065

Martijn


It doesn't have to be water in that bottle...

I don't get why so many are jumping to the conclusion that it *has* to be water in that bottle - it could be anything.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:47 pm
by readytotaxi
I've seen this before, many times, this is the standard AF plane washing procedure. :rotfl:

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:48 pm
by CrimsonNL
moo wrote:
CrimsonNL wrote:
A video of a TK 321 reportedly being "deiced" is making rounds on Facebook and Twitter. It basically shows 2 guys on a ladder rolling what looks like a water-cooler bottle down the wing of the aircraft. The video maker claims that this is how they deiced the wing. Obviously it's not a proper way to deice, but I can't think of any other reason why you would be pouring water on a wing..

http://twitter.com/u_g_u_r_p/status/818794037486424065

Martijn


It doesn't have to be water in that bottle...

I don't get why so many are jumping to the conclusion that it *has* to be water in that bottle - it could be anything.


Ok yeah, then let's just assume that they've got a completely transparent deicing fluid in there. Do you still think this is a good way to deice a passenger aircraft?

Martijn

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:53 pm
by jayeshrulz
Even if its okay to but water over the wings, what if the "Bump" causes dent on the aircraft skin? Yeah i know its plastic and all that, but what if?
Either way, I was too, a little uncomfortable with that. Bad job TK.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:58 pm
by mercure1
That wing looks quite clean so it's not really deicing.

Looks more like desire just to clear any potential frost with little running water.

I have seen same done in places like Southern France and around Mediterranean on very cold mornings with something as simple as hose you have in your house or portable spray applicator pump that farmers use to apply pesticides.

While it might look funny in video I don't see as much concern as social media likes to make of this.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:58 pm
by D L X
moo wrote:
It doesn't have to be water in that bottle...

I don't get why so many are jumping to the conclusion that it *has* to be water in that bottle - it could be anything.


I'm not sure why one would jump to the conclusion that it is not water in that WATER bottle. It's completely transparent, while deicing fluid typically isn't.

But let's say it's some sort of deicing fluid. Would you feel comfortable with the coverage if THAT was how it was applied to a plane you're flying on? Would you feel comfortable with that AMOUNT of fluid applied to your plane?

Deicing usually looks more like this:


I would have demanded to be let off.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:08 pm
by moo
CrimsonNL wrote:
moo wrote:
CrimsonNL wrote:
A video of a TK 321 reportedly being "deiced" is making rounds on Facebook and Twitter. It basically shows 2 guys on a ladder rolling what looks like a water-cooler bottle down the wing of the aircraft. The video maker claims that this is how they deiced the wing. Obviously it's not a proper way to deice, but I can't think of any other reason why you would be pouring water on a wing..

http://twitter.com/u_g_u_r_p/status/818794037486424065

Martijn


It doesn't have to be water in that bottle...

I don't get why so many are jumping to the conclusion that it *has* to be water in that bottle - it could be anything.


Ok yeah, then let's just assume that they've got a completely transparent deicing fluid in there. Do you still think this is a good way to deice a passenger aircraft?

Martijn


If thats the only method they have at that point, yes. The aircraft doesn't look like its significantly contaminated at all, so its probably a precautionary measure on a frosty morning at an airport which doesn't normally have de-icing equipment...

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:15 pm
by moo
D L X wrote:
moo wrote:
It doesn't have to be water in that bottle...

I don't get why so many are jumping to the conclusion that it *has* to be water in that bottle - it could be anything.


I'm not sure why one would jump to the conclusion that it is not water in that WATER bottle. It's completely transparent, while deicing fluid typically isn't.


Great argument, simply great one. As if there could *never* be anything other than water in that there container - hell, it was probably sold as a water container, so thats it, the universe won't allow anything else in it. Water container it was, water container it will be forever more.

On the other hand, its a perfect container for getting a fairly decent quantity of a certain fluid up onto that wing in one go when you don't have a pump...

And where did I jump to a conclusion? I was simply questioning why other people were jumping to a rather idiotic conclusion, one which was far from foregone. That doesn't mean I jumped to any alternative conclusion...

But let's say it's some sort of deicing fluid. Would you feel comfortable with the coverage if THAT was how it was applied to a plane you're flying on? Would you feel comfortable with that AMOUNT of fluid applied to your plane?

Deicing usually looks more like this:


I would have demanded to be let off.


Looking at the wing, I don't see anything wrong with it. Demand to be let off all you want, you would probably end up having to make your own arrangements for onward travel if you did - the plane seems to have survived, so it doesn't look like there was any misadventure here.

And deicing fluid can come in all different colours - this may even have been a watered down solution.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:28 pm
by D L X
moo wrote:
D L X wrote:
moo wrote:
It doesn't have to be water in that bottle...

I don't get why so many are jumping to the conclusion that it *has* to be water in that bottle - it could be anything.


I'm not sure why one would jump to the conclusion that it is not water in that WATER bottle. It's completely transparent, while deicing fluid typically isn't.


Great argument, simply great one. As if there could *never* be anything other than water in that there container - hell, it was probably sold as a water container, so thats it, the universe won't allow anything else in it. Water container it was, water container it will be forever more.


Hey, I'm only getting on you for your chiding others for thinking it's water in the WATER bottle, which especially considering that people on this forum know what water and deicing fluid typically looks like, you'd have to agree is a fairly reasonable assumption.

moo wrote:

Looking at the wing, I don't see anything wrong with it. Demand to be let off all you want, you would probably end up having to make your own arrangements for onward travel if you did - the plane seems to have survived, so it doesn't look like there was any misadventure here.


You didn't answer the question. Would you feel comfortable riding a plane where they applied deicing fluid that way instead of using deicing equipment?

Let's say it's not being deiced at all -- would you feel comfortable flying a plane after watching mechanics roll a water jug down the wing?

"It didn't crash" is not an answer to that question.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:57 pm
by mercure1
D L X wrote:
. Would you feel comfortable riding a plane where they applied deicing fluid that way instead of using deicing equipment?


You realize many airports don't have any formal deicing equipment hence use if things like a regular hose, or portable spray applicators?

It used to be a pretty regular sight in Italy for example where many airlines operated the MD-80 which were subject to wing cold soak, to literally rinse the wings with a little water or broom it by staff on stepladder.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:09 pm
by D L X
mercure1 wrote:
D L X wrote:
. Would you feel comfortable riding a plane where they applied deicing fluid that way instead of using deicing equipment?


You realize many airports don't have any formal deicing equipment hence use if things like a regular hose, or portable spray applicators?

It used to be a pretty regular sight in Italy for example where many airlines operated the MD-80 which were subject to wing cold soak, to literally rinse the wings with a little water or broom it by staff on stepladder.


First off, you too have not answered my question.

Second, IST has deicing equipment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWeta4CEkOg

I live in Washington, DC. We have long memories of what happens when deicing is not taken seriously.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:11 pm
by Calder
Wouldn't surprise me if it's just some ramp jockeys trying to freak out pax out of sheer boredom.

I de-iced a 206 with a credit card once, that was not a fun time.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:30 pm
by B737900ER
Could be a mixture of water and isopropyl alcohol, which is sometimes used for deicing in general aviation. In any event it looks ghetto, and the whole process looked pointless because they really didn't cover much. It looks like no harm no foul, except that this is Turkish airlines, a supposedly world class airline. If that's how operations or maintenance is trained, I'd consider that pathetic.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:58 pm
by mercure1
D L X wrote:
First off, you too have not answered my question.


You are asking the wrong person. Your question previously was directed to someone else.

But to answer, yes I would be OK. As client its not my job to second guess crew or airline. Anyhow with this short video we hardly have all the facts.

I have no issues with TK. Have flown then many times and will continue so. Overall quite decent airlines from an amazing country.

D L X wrote:
Second, IST has deicing equipment:


I have yet to see confirmation this video was in IST and not some other local airport.
But never the less we know they have minimal de-ice and snow equipment capability. Airport has been closed on/off for since last week due repeated snow events and many hundreds of flights cancelled each day. As posted on other threads, we've even have had 2 A.net posters stuck in Turkey for several days due to the very unusual weather event.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 10:02 pm
by VSMUT
De-icing procedures continue to amaze me. During my flight training, MCC course in a 737 simulator (Ryanair procedures) and ATR type rating deicing meant shutting down the engines prior to deicing.
Then in December I witnessed my A320 (I was traveling as a passenger) being deiced with it's engines running, and on top of that a man climbed onto a ladder not half a meter from the air intake to check the wing.
As if that didn't surprise me enough, a Dash-8 pulled up alongside and was deiced with it's propellers running! Lo and behold, the same man drove over and checked the wing just half a meter from the rotating propellers! :shock:

And now this... :rotfl:

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:18 pm
by longhauler
VSMUT wrote:
De-icing procedures continue to amaze me. During my flight training, MCC course in a 737 simulator (Ryanair procedures) and ATR type rating deicing meant shutting down the engines prior to deicing.
Then in December I witnessed my A320 (I was traveling as a passenger) being deiced with it's engines running, and on top of that a man climbed onto a ladder not half a meter from the air intake to check the wing.
As if that didn't surprise me enough, a Dash-8 pulled up alongside and was deiced with it's propellers running! Lo and behold, the same man drove over and checked the wing just half a meter from the rotating propellers! :shock:

And now this... :rotfl:

Engines ON de-icing is quite common in Canada. By a very wide margin, it is how de-icing and anti-icing is completed. Yes, even in propeller aircraft.

However, your description of checking the wing afterward is not normal. With engines running or not.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:25 pm
by benbeny
B737900ER wrote:
Could be a mixture of water and isopropyl alcohol, which is sometimes used for deicing in general aviation. In any event it looks ghetto, and the whole process looked pointless because they really didn't cover much. It looks like no harm no foul, except that this is Turkish airlines, a supposedly world class airline. If that's how operations or maintenance is trained, I'd consider that pathetic.

I bet Russians has so many stocks of vodka for deicing :rotfl:

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:48 am
by rbretas
On the winter of 2013/2014 I had two layovers on Atatürk Airport. Both times my flight was delayed over 4h and many other flights were canceled due to the inadequacy of deicing equipment. Despite the airport mess, both times the aircraft I was in was properly deiced using the platform truck and the orange goo.

The TK flight itself was great, the most comfortable I had so far, which makes me even angrier to see that after 3 years they apparently haven't solved the deicing shortcomings.

Re: Questionable Turkish Airlines "Deicing" video

Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:08 pm
by jupiter2
benbeny wrote:
B737900ER wrote:
Could be a mixture of water and isopropyl alcohol, which is sometimes used for deicing in general aviation. In any event it looks ghetto, and the whole process looked pointless because they really didn't cover much. It looks like no harm no foul, except that this is Turkish airlines, a supposedly world class airline. If that's how operations or maintenance is trained, I'd consider that pathetic.

I bet Russians has so many stocks of vodka for deicing :rotfl:


Excuse me, you do not waste vodka pouring it over aircraft wings :drunk: