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hayzel777
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Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:42 am

A story came out today that showed a picture of CI flight attendants sleeping in the hotel restaurant after a 13 hour flight from TPE in Amsterdam. The reason was that after arrival, they had to wait over 3 hours before they could even check in and get a room.

https://udn.com/news/plus/9739/2419202
 
Prost
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:49 am

It has happened to me more than once. European hotels seem to be the countries that this happens to mostly for my carrier.

It is understandable when crew arrive early morning, and most customers at hotels don't check out until 11AM. But it still sucks.
 
kaitak
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:10 am

But that CI arrival into AMS is not that early. I think CI will be having a firm discussion with this hotel, to the effect that it must never let this happen again, if it wants to keep the airline's business.
 
nzrich
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:26 am

A lot of hotels use the same rooms for out going and incoming crew meaning there is a small amount of time to clean them sometimes resulting in a delay where problems get worse is when the incoming plane breaks down and the hotel doesn't have rooms for the incoming crew as the outgoing crew still has them.
"Pride of the pacific"
 
mjoelnir
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:33 am

Strange this non understanding of operational needs of hotels. The problem is not even overbooking but late availability of rooms. Perhaps this helps a little bit, with how passengers are feeling, when airlines operational needs screws with the passenger´s travel plans.
 
jbflyguy84
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:54 am

mjoelnir wrote:
Strange this non understanding of operational needs of hotels. The problem is not even overbooking but late availability of rooms. Perhaps this helps a little bit, with how passengers are feeling, when airlines operational needs screws with the passenger´s travel plans.


What operational needs? Most airline contracts with hotels are that they are contractually obliged to have a hotel room ready as soon as the crew arrives and that the crew have that room until pick up for the next duty, irrespective of delays. Crew room usage do not follow standard check in check out times... at my airline, the crew may arrive at 0300 and leave at 0100 the next day thereby essentially using that hotel room for 2 nights (and the airline pays for this), so there is no excuse on the hotels part that a room is not available.
 
sierrakilo44
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:29 am

A proper airline would pay to ensure the hotel rooms for their crew are ready when their crew are scheduled to arrive at the hotel.

I have heard stories about some Low Cost Carriers and third world carriers who in order to save money won't pay for early check in or late check out, meaning a crew arriving at 6am will have to wait in a common room until their rooms are ready at the standard check in time of 2pm (and vice versa). Obviously this is horrible for fatigue.
I've also heard of some crews being forced to share rooms, crews getting substandard rooms (next to noisy streets or without proper aircon) or forced to pay for upgrades to rooms which are suitable.

This story could of course have been a one off due to an unforeseen delay in the assignment of hotel rooms, I just hope some cost cutting manager doesn't see this and think "well, if crews are able to sleep in the lobby...."
 
ASFlyer
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:37 am

sierrakilo44 wrote:
A proper airline would pay to ensure the hotel rooms for their crew are ready when their crew are scheduled to arrive at the hotel.


This
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:08 am

ASFlyer wrote:
sierrakilo44 wrote:
A proper airline would pay to ensure the hotel rooms for their crew are ready when their crew are scheduled to arrive at the hotel.


This


For an airline the size of CI with multiple long haul flights per day and only one reported instance I think it's fair to assume that they are doing the right thing and this is a stuff up by the hotel. If however a CI pilot or flight attendant comes out and says that this is routine at their airline then I agree that is definitely cause for concern, but at this stage I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
mjoelnir
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:13 am

jbflyguy84 wrote:
mjoelnir wrote:
Strange this non understanding of operational needs of hotels. The problem is not even overbooking but late availability of rooms. Perhaps this helps a little bit, with how passengers are feeling, when airlines operational needs screws with the passenger´s travel plans.


What operational needs? Most airline contracts with hotels are that they are contractually obliged to have a hotel room ready as soon as the crew arrives and that the crew have that room until pick up for the next duty, irrespective of delays. Crew room usage do not follow standard check in check out times... at my airline, the crew may arrive at 0300 and leave at 0100 the next day thereby essentially using that hotel room for 2 nights (and the airline pays for this), so there is no excuse on the hotels part that a room is not available.


Yes and airlines promise to fly you on a certain date and time to a certain place and arrive at a certain time. What does it matter if a service is paid in advance when the operational need arises.
The most hypocritical argumentation from an industry that prides itself on overbooking and not having to full fill your contract when some of the multitude of cop outs in the COC creeps up.
 
jbflyguy84
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:51 am

mjoelnir wrote:
jbflyguy84 wrote:
mjoelnir wrote:
Strange this non understanding of operational needs of hotels. The problem is not even overbooking but late availability of rooms. Perhaps this helps a little bit, with how passengers are feeling, when airlines operational needs screws with the passenger´s travel plans.


What operational needs? Most airline contracts with hotels are that they are contractually obliged to have a hotel room ready as soon as the crew arrives and that the crew have that room until pick up for the next duty, irrespective of delays. Crew room usage do not follow standard check in check out times... at my airline, the crew may arrive at 0300 and leave at 0100 the next day thereby essentially using that hotel room for 2 nights (and the airline pays for this), so there is no excuse on the hotels part that a room is not available.


Yes and airlines promise to fly you on a certain date and time to a certain place and arrive at a certain time. What does it matter if a service is paid in advance when the operational need arises.
The most hypocritical argumentation from an industry that prides itself on overbooking and not having to full fill your contract when some of the multitude of cop outs in the COC creeps up.


Who said promise? I've never read a CoC with the word guarantee in it...

A hotel is fixed and doesn't move. It isn't affected by traffic, weather, strikes, technical issues to level of affecting safety - I do a love a three-legged argument... knock the other one out and down it goes.

Regarding overbooking - I'm pretty much 110% sure hotels also overbook... and then there were 2 legs left on the proverbial table.
 
TonyBurr
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:02 pm

This is typical for passengers arriving in the morning at hotels. Many, many times arriving in Europe early in the morning I have waited hours in the hotel lobby for my room. Check in generally is not until around 3:00 PM, and if the flight arrives at say 5:30 AM, there is a long wait. Airline crews generally get checked in right away.
 
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AirlineCritic
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:06 pm

Duh. The hotel was slightly overbooked, or they needed to give the rooms to their staff. They should have called security to deal with the guests with such unreasonable expectations such as getting a room. Besides, there's probably more to this story. There must be something shady with the crew's past. Maybe they were looking for a fight? Sleeping at a restaurant? Clearly trying to attract attention!
 
mjoelnir
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:25 pm

AirlineCritic wrote:
Duh. The hotel was slightly overbooked, or they needed to give the rooms to their staff. They should have called security to deal with the guests with such unreasonable expectations such as getting a room. Besides, there's probably more to this story. There must be something shady with the crew's past. Maybe they were looking for a fight? Sleeping at a restaurant? Clearly trying to attract attention!


:checkmark:

It is nearly hilarious the difference in what service airline and there crews and staff expect to give, compared with what they expect to receive.
Last edited by mjoelnir on Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Newbiepilot
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:27 pm

The hotel messed up. There could be lots of reasons like another flight was delayed and the crew used their rooms longer than planned. Hotels need to plan for this when bidding for contracts from airlines.

TonyBurr wrote:
This is typical for passengers arriving in the morning at hotels. Many, many times arriving in Europe early in the morning I have waited hours in the hotel lobby for my room. Check in generally is not until around 3:00 PM, and if the flight arrives at say 5:30 AM, there is a long wait. Airline crews generally get checked in right away.


Yes that is what passengers have to deal with but not airline crew. Airlines setup contracts with hotels that allow check in and check out at the time of day that matches the flight schedule. I have never heard of a hotel making crew checkout at noon if their flight is at 6pm for example.
 
ozark1
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:07 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
AirlineCritic wrote:
Duh. The hotel was slightly overbooked, or they needed to give the rooms to their staff. They should have called security to deal with the guests with such unreasonable expectations such as getting a room. Besides, there's probably more to this story. There must be something shady with the crew's past. Maybe they were looking for a fight? Sleeping at a restaurant? Clearly trying to attract attention!


:checkmark:

It is nearly hilarious the difference in what service airline and there crews and staff expect to give, compared with what they expect to receive.

Don't appreciate your generalization. Most crews understand that there are circumstances when their rooms won't be ready yet. LHR, for instance, has to deal with a lot of crews staying at the same hotel. They do their best, always courteously, to ensure that our wait after arrival is kept to a minimum---usually 45 minutes to an hour. Most of us understand that, it being early in the morning, many rooms must be cleaned since it is hours before normal checkout time. Some international cities give us a complimentary breakfast while we wait, GRU being one of them, if we have to wait at all. I've never had to wait for a room in Asia, and in thinking back on it, i can count on one hand the times i've had to wait at all. So now we've had the social media drama move from the airplane aisle, to the entry door, to the airport itself, and now to the hotel. So I will either be looking for a crew van issue (pilots wanted their windows cleaned) or a room service issue (a flight attendant threw her undercooked steak at the waiter). Anything that can be invented or inflated to create twitter notoriety.
 
davescj
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:11 pm

Newbiepilot wrote:
Yes that is what passengers have to deal with but not airline crew. Airlines setup contracts with hotels that allow check in and check out at the time of day that matches the flight schedule. I have never heard of a hotel making crew checkout at noon if their flight is at 6pm for example.


Without doubt, the contract would allow for 'necessary' check in/out times that are not 'standard.' This would be a logical inclusion into the contract.

But, as to the crew being treated unfairly - or out of contract - I'm sure in the contract with the hotel there is an out clause. Just like in the COC. If staff called in sick, and rooms could not be made up...or if the laundry service from the hotel had broken equipment and sheets didn't get delivered....or there was damage to a room that had to be dealt with...or there was a booking error by the airline's computer.
Can I have a mojito on this flight?
 
IPFreely
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:11 pm

jbflyguy84 wrote:
What operational needs? Most airline contracts with hotels are that they are contractually obliged to have a hotel room ready as soon as the crew arrives and that the crew have that room until pick up for the next duty, irrespective of delays. Crew room usage do not follow standard check in check out times... at my airline, the crew may arrive at 0300 and leave at 0100 the next day thereby essentially using that hotel room for 2 nights (and the airline pays for this), so there is no excuse on the hotels part that a room is not available.


And when a passenger buys a ticket for a flight they have entered a contract that an airline will transport them and their bags from point A to point B at a specific time on a specific day. Sometimes sh#* happens as evidenced by Delta cancelling over 3,500 flights in a few days period earlier this month. If there is "no excuse" for the hotel, why is there an excuse for the airlines?

Believe me there is zero sympathy from the public for an airline crew being forced to endure a three hour delay.
 
RetiredWeasel
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:18 pm

While delays in getting a room happened occasionally in my career, you have to remember that stricter FAA 'uninterrupted' crew rest regulations were initiated in the 2000's. I don't know about this case, but if the cockpit crew layover was running up against this requirement, then the crew would have rightfully asserted the regs and called scheduling and told them the flight the following day would have to be delayed. This gets the airline's attention in their dealings with hotel contracts.
 
thaiflyer
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:41 pm

I'm a hotel owner myself.
I can understand that the hotel has a contract with a airline to have x amount of rooms available for them.
Many times the same rooms will be used for the outgoing and incoming flight crews.
But we can not expect that hotels keep spare rooms empty just in case the outgoing crew has a delay etc and this would delay the check-in for the incoming crew.
If this would be expected then the airline has to pay for this otherwise it is unreasonable to expect that the hotel looses revenue just in case this happens.
 
LJ
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:44 pm

thaiflyer wrote:
I'm a hotel owner myself.
I can understand that the hotel has a contract with a airline to have x amount of rooms available for them.
Many times the same rooms will be used for the outgoing and incoming flight crews.
But we can not expect that hotels keep spare rooms empty just in case the outgoing crew has a delay etc and this would delay the check-in for the incoming crew.
If this would be expected then the airline has to pay for this otherwise it is unreasonable to expect that the hotel looses revenue just in case this happens.


Indeed, and hotels at AMS are now running at full capacity.

BTW didn't CI have its own house fo its crew in The Netherllands? Or is that Garuda?
 
Waterbomber
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:46 pm

Newbiepilot wrote:
The hotel messed up. There could be lots of reasons like another flight was delayed and the crew used their rooms longer than planned. Hotels need to plan for this when bidding for contracts from airlines.

TonyBurr wrote:
This is typical for passengers arriving in the morning at hotels. Many, many times arriving in Europe early in the morning I have waited hours in the hotel lobby for my room. Check in generally is not until around 3:00 PM, and if the flight arrives at say 5:30 AM, there is a long wait. Airline crews generally get checked in right away.


Yes that is what passengers have to deal with but not airline crew. Airlines setup contracts with hotels that allow check in and check out at the time of day that matches the flight schedule. I have never heard of a hotel making crew checkout at noon if their flight is at 6pm for example.


It's a give and take.
Airlines pay low rates for their rooms, but do this throughout the year regardless of whether the hotel is busy or not.
Usually airlines pay extra for morning arrivals.

Unfortunately with hotels, you can get unexpected overbookings. A reservation that didn't come through or was manually booked into the wrong date by either hotel staff, staff working in a reservation center or by the customer themselves. It can also be a corporate customer that brings in much more money than the airline asking for 10 rooms. Usually this can then be managed by having housekeeeping clean the rooms before the crews arrive.
The hotel did mess up, but it's not the end of the world.

In a proper airline, crews have proper rest times on board and on the ground. The occasional 3-hour delay shouldn't need to be a problem immediately.
How many times don't crews need to survive being stuck on the ground because the aircraft goest technical before departure. I don't see them laying down in the aisles when that happens.
 
IPFreely
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:35 pm

RetiredWeasel wrote:
While delays in getting a room happened occasionally in my career, you have to remember that stricter FAA 'uninterrupted' crew rest regulations were initiated in the 2000's. I don't know about this case, but if the cockpit crew layover was running up against this requirement, then the crew would have rightfully asserted the regs and called scheduling and told them the flight the following day would have to be delayed. This gets the airline's attention in their dealings with hotel contracts.


FAA regulations don't apply to an Air China crew in Amsterdam.
 
patrickw421
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:07 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
ASFlyer wrote:
sierrakilo44 wrote:
A proper airline would pay to ensure the hotel rooms for their crew are ready when their crew are scheduled to arrive at the hotel.


This


For an airline the size of CI with multiple long haul flights per day and only one reported instance I think it's fair to assume that they are doing the right thing and this is a stuff up by the hotel. If however a CI pilot or flight attendant comes out and says that this is routine at their airline then I agree that is definitely cause for concern, but at this stage I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.


Unfortunately this seems to be the case here with CI. In the news which is actually taken from a Facebook page run by some CI crews, says that they couldn't get a room because CI would not pay for the 3-hr early check in. Also, the company gave out various excuses (including some reasonable ones like the hotel is full or housekeeping can't keep up but also some unreasonable ones like local office's fault or the plane arrived too early) to the crew instead of dealing with the issue.
 
jetwet1
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:21 pm

kaitak wrote:
But that CI arrival into AMS is not that early. I think CI will be having a firm discussion with this hotel, to the effect that it must never let this happen again, if it wants to keep the airline's business.


As was discussed in another airline/hotel thread, hotels take airlines business as a steady cash flow, it's not a great profit maker, airlines bargain hard with hotels to get the lowest possible price for the most in return, as they should.

nzrich wrote:
A lot of hotels use the same rooms for out going and incoming crew meaning there is a small amount of time to clean them sometimes resulting in a delay where problems get worse is when the incoming plane breaks down and the hotel doesn't have rooms for the incoming crew as the outgoing crew still has them.


This is one possibility, to give people an idea, in general (yes there are different cases, but in general), the airlines contract for a number of rooms, for ease of math, let's say 10 rooms, those are then blocked off for the airlines use only, now (as I have sen happen), the airline sends to many crew and you end up needing 12 rooms, the hotel will contact the airline pointing this out to them and asking if they want to pay for the 2 extra rooms, if the hotel is slow, they may give them the two rooms at the contract rate, if it is busy they may ask for the rack rate, it's then down to the airline to say yes or no. I have never seen a contract that states that the hotel must supply an unlimited number of rooms at the contract price.

jbflyguy84 wrote:

What operational needs? Most airline contracts with hotels are that they are contractually obliged to have a hotel room ready as soon as the crew arrives and that the crew have that room until pick up for the next duty, irrespective of delays. Crew room usage do not follow standard check in check out times... at my airline, the crew may arrive at 0300 and leave at 0100 the next day thereby essentially using that hotel room for 2 nights (and the airline pays for this), so there is no excuse on the hotels part that a room is not available.


Yes and no, crews can check in/out at any time, it doesn't make a difference as the airline is paying for the room for the length of the contract, but, if the airline has used it's allocation of rooms, then there can be a problem.

jbflyguy84 wrote:


A hotel is fixed and doesn't move. It isn't affected by traffic, weather, strikes, technical issues to level of affecting safety - I do a love a three-legged argument... knock the other one out and down it goes.

Regarding overbooking - I'm pretty much 110% sure hotels also overbook... and then there were 2 legs left on the proverbial table.


You would be incorrect in that statement, hotels are most certainly affected by weather, strikes and technical issues, including those affecting safety, for example, we had a hotel 2 weeks ago have a failure in one of it's sprinkler risers, this meant that overnight we lost over 100 rooms, nobody could stay in those rooms until the riser was repaired. I have also been at hotels where the maids have gone on strike, suddenly the turnover rate for the rooms drops amazingly.

Newbiepilot wrote:
The hotel messed up. There could be lots of reasons like another flight was delayed and the crew used their rooms longer than planned. Hotels need to plan for this when bidding for contracts from airlines.


Again, there could be a number of reasons the crew had to wait, some the hotels fault (the rooms were not clean and someone called in sick who was meant to clean the room), the airline over scheduled the amount of crew, then refused to pay for more rooms or maybe the outbound crew were still in the hotel and the the hotel was sold out, only the airline and the hotel know what really happened.

thaiflyer wrote:
I'm a hotel owner myself.
I can understand that the hotel has a contract with a airline to have x amount of rooms available for them.
Many times the same rooms will be used for the outgoing and incoming flight crews.
But we can not expect that hotels keep spare rooms empty just in case the outgoing crew has a delay etc and this would delay the check-in for the incoming crew.
If this would be expected then the airline has to pay for this otherwise it is unreasonable to expect that the hotel looses revenue just in case this happens.


Exactly
 
peterinlisbon
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:57 pm

On a recent trip around India, the hotel I was staying at let us sleep on the sun loungers by the swimming pool after we arrived on an overnight train at 7am. At another place we arrived at 5am and they let us check in at 8am (official check in time was 1pm), but I guess it depends on when the person that had the room before you leave and also if they have cleaners available. This is a big problem when travelling on any kind of overnight transport. Either you pay an extra night or you have to wait a few hours. I don't think an airline can be expected to pay for an extra night just for the sake of a few hours, but hopefully the hotel would be reasonable and let them check in early if possible.
 
IPFreely
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:33 pm

peterinlisbon wrote:
I don't think an airline can be expected to pay for an extra night just for the sake of a few hours, but hopefully the hotel would be reasonable and let them check in early if possible.


"If possible" is the key...the hotel may not have any rooms available. If the airline isn't willing to pay for an extra night for a few hours and the hotel has other customers who are willing to pay for the whole night and not just a few hours, the other customers are going to get the rooms. It's a risk the airline takes if they're not willing to pay for guaranteed rooms.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:40 am

I don't see this as the airlines fault. The hotel probably tries to honor the early check ins as this group probably is often early. Either they needed to book a different hotel(regular that knows them was sold out) , they were earlier then usual (plane early and no traffic ie the perfect storm of usually early) or else the hotel was flat sold out and didnt have time to clean the rooms or people hadn't checked out. The hotel cant force people out if there was a wedding or something etc no one maybe wanted to leave early.

As someone who has worked in a hotel i can tell you Sundays in particular most people dont check out until LATE and its really hard to honor early arrivals on Sundays but date will vary based on location etc

I dont think this is the airlines fault probably rarely happens, but i imagine it does at times. This has happened to me as a traveler. The hotel has to have time to clean and if people are late or just not leaving early they wont have time to clean.
 
RetiredWeasel
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:02 am

IPFreely wrote:
RetiredWeasel wrote:
While delays in getting a room happened occasionally in my career, you have to remember that stricter FAA 'uninterrupted' crew rest regulations were initiated in the 2000's. I don't know about this case, but if the cockpit crew layover was running up against this requirement, then the crew would have rightfully asserted the regs and called scheduling and told them the flight the following day would have to be delayed. This gets the airline's attention in their dealings with hotel contracts.


FAA regulations don't apply to an Air China crew in Amsterdam.


Of course they don't, but I assume that they they have some protection against sleeping in a dining room or lounge for half of their layover and obtaining the proper crew rest to fly out the next day. The topic headline asked a general question, and I responded more or less with a US airline input. It happened to me more than once in my career that a hotel screwup (either the hotel or airline scheduling) caused a delay in the flight out the next day due to inadequate crew rest.
 
TW870
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:26 am

To back up RetiredWeasel and the other airline employees on here, the airline contracts hotel rooms to be ready as soon as the long haul crew arrives. During my time as a United flight attendant, we would have occasional short delays, such as at the CDG downtown layover which would give us a free breakfast in exchange for an extra 45 minutes to get the last rooms ready. But in the event of longer delays, we were allowed to "walk" to a different hotel, and the airline would cover any costs we incurred. SYD often had crews "walk" with 747-400s arriving from MEL, LAX, and SFO, and the company was proactive to get us moved to a different hotel once that repeat problem popped up. In no case does the regular 11am checkout 3pm check in count toward airline crews - because this is not how the airline purchases the rooms. Any visible disagreement in a hotel between a crew and a hotel manager is likely because of a repeat ocurrence of rooms not being ready. After 16 hours on duty, negotiations between the captain, the purser, union reps, ops, and the hotel can get fatiguing. But I have never seen it be anything but professional.
 
jbflyguy84
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Re: Is it normal for a crew after a long haul to wait over 3 hours for a hotel room?

Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:51 am

IPFreely wrote:
jbflyguy84 wrote:
What operational needs? Most airline contracts with hotels are that they are contractually obliged to have a hotel room ready as soon as the crew arrives and that the crew have that room until pick up for the next duty, irrespective of delays. Crew room usage do not follow standard check in check out times... at my airline, the crew may arrive at 0300 and leave at 0100 the next day thereby essentially using that hotel room for 2 nights (and the airline pays for this), so there is no excuse on the hotels part that a room is not available.


And when a passenger buys a ticket for a flight they have entered a contract that an airline will transport them and their bags from point A to point B at a specific time on a specific day. Sometimes sh#* happens as evidenced by Delta cancelling over 3,500 flights in a few days period earlier this month. If there is "no excuse" for the hotel, why is there an excuse for the airlines?

Believe me there is zero sympathy from the public for an airline crew being forced to endure a three hour delay.



There is no excuse for the hotel because hotel staff don't undertake safety critical duties or deal with safety critical functions... hotel staff can come to work tired and hungover or whatever and not put people's lives at risk - airline crews can't and thats why they get access to their rooms immediately upon arrival. Added on to this which I eluded to in another post, no one of sane mind could place airlines and hotels in the same bucket - A hotel is a fixed piece of infrastructure that is not affected my weather, traffic, strike, safety related technical issues or pretty much any other reason why airlines get delayed. So yes, airlines get to get you to your destination in as shorter time as possible, not a guarantee that you will arrive at X time on X date.

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