WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 7:54 pm

Pilots: On the ramp? On a taxiway to scare feral cats?
If on the ramp, under what circumstances? No ramper response to request to push?

MX: When yelling out the window at someone with no radio doesn't get their attention, or is wearing ear buds because they just went off shift?
Any rules on using the horn inside a hangar?
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 1959
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:02 pm

I’ve never seen a plane with one.

GF
 
User avatar
7BOEING7
Posts: 2828
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:28 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:45 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
I’ve never seen a plane with one.

GF


I would assume he’s talking about the ground crew call “horn” (Boeing).
 
FlyHossD
Posts: 1737
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:45 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:48 pm

A horn like a horn in an automobile? I haven't seen one (727, 737, 757 or 767).

The 727 and 737 do have "Ground Call" horns or buzzers to get the attention of a ramp agent - IF one is nearby. I don't recall that feature in the 757/767, though (maybe my memory is failing me). I've never heard one from outside the aircraft, so I don't really know how loud it would be.
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:58 pm

All Boeing types should have a horn labelled labelled GND or GND CALL
https://blog.klm.com/assets/uploads/201 ... ane_02.jpg
https://i.stack.imgur.com/4cZxI.png
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 1959
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:32 pm

Maybe a KLM option. You’d never hear on the ramp unless right next to the speaker. I suspect it works to alert the ground crew on headsets, not as horn.

GF
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:32 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cXsuSTOZIE Harder to hear after engine start unless near the NLG.
Correction... I don't think https://i.stack.imgur.com/4cZxI.png is a Boeing.
At least some B767s had GND call horns... I thought all Boeing types did.
Post # 3 at viewtopic.php?t=736163
Last edited by WPvsMW on Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
acmx
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:49 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:45 pm

There is a ground call that’s used to get the attention of personnel on the ground. Usually if you want them to get on headset to talk. I don’t see it used often. The ground call is a momentary switch so it stops when the switch is released. When the alarm is continuous like in the video it usually means something is powered up but you lost equipment cooling. Like the iru’s are aligned but external power dropped off.
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:49 pm

Yes, IIRC, the ground call "horn" (GND or GND CALL) is like a car horn and is LOUD, but momentary. The warble tone is a cooling system failure, and continues until cleared.
 
ilovelamp
Posts: 205
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:45 am

Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:27 am

WPvsMW wrote:
Yes, IIRC, the ground call "horn" (GND or GND CALL) is like a car horn and is LOUD, but momentary. The warble tone is a cooling system failure, and continues until cleared.


The 737 ground horn is a fast repeating hi-lo sound that can be manually made with the button as you see in the photos above. Its so loud it’ll wake the dead, IMHO. It’s easily discernible from the flight deck even though the horn is in the nose wheel well and pointed towards the ground.

In addition to alerting the ground crew of a potential equipment cooling fan failure, it helps notify them of a battery drain condition exists.
 
stratclub
Posts: 701
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:10 am

Ground call is a pretty standard function these days. It is used when someone in the cockpit needs to talk to someone on the ground. It does have other functions as in when ground power power is shut down and the Adiru reverts to battery when AC power is lost when power ground power is shut down without switching off the Adiru's first.

I have no idea what "horn" your are referring to.
 
747Whale
Posts: 271
Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:41 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:25 am

It's called a landing light.
 
ilovelamp
Posts: 205
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:45 am

Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:34 am

stratclub wrote:
Ground call is a pretty standard function these days. It is used when someone in the cockpit needs to talk to someone on the ground. It does have other functions as in when ground power power is shut down and the Adiru reverts to battery when AC power is lost when power ground power is shut down without switching off the Adiru's first.

I have no idea what "horn" your are referring to.


The horn that our manuals refer to when pressing the ground call button. Your operator may not refer to it as a horn but mine does.
 
stratclub
Posts: 701
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:46 am

Oh. O.K.
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:41 am

Airbus types also have a "ground call", call MECH on the instrument panel. It is so soft I wouldn't call it a horn ... more of a buzzer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uejnfF_ojHk
https://www.pprune.org/tech-log/300851- ... -horn.html

I'm puzzled by the what a/c uses the ACP in https://i.stack.imgur.com/4cZxI.png
The switches look like switches used in Avtech's modules, which are used in many Citations, but the ACP in the photo doesn't look like a Citation panel.
 
User avatar
7BOEING7
Posts: 2828
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:28 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 6:02 am

WPvsMW wrote:
Airbus types also have a "ground call", call MECH on the instrument panel. It is so soft I wouldn't call it a horn ... more of a buzzer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uejnfF_ojHk
https://www.pprune.org/tech-log/300851- ... -horn.html

I'm puzzled by the what a/c uses the ACP in https://i.stack.imgur.com/4cZxI.png
The switches look like switches used in Avtech's modules, which are used in many Citations, but the ACP in the photo doesn't look like a Citation panel.


737 (the one pictured is an NG)
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 7:11 am

Thanks... mystery solved.
 
User avatar
Acey559
Posts: 1271
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:40 pm

The 757/767 also has a loud “beep beep beep” horn that indicates an APU fire (same noise as the equipment overheat horn). The ground crew has be ability to shut the APU down and fire a bottle (767) on the panel located on the back of the nose gear.
In Dixie Land I'll take my stand to live and die in Dixie.
 
747Whale
Posts: 271
Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:41 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:00 pm

Actually reaching the external APU control panel is another matter...
 
stratclub
Posts: 701
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Tue Dec 25, 2018 12:25 am

747Whale wrote:
Actually reaching the external APU control panel is another matter...

On what aircraft is that? Don't you just walk up to it on most aircraft?
 
747Whale
Posts: 271
Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:41 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Tue Dec 25, 2018 3:53 am

It's too high to reach on quite a few, especially if the aircraft isn't loaded enough to compress the gear.
 
VSMUT
Posts: 2133
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:40 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Dec 27, 2018 8:24 pm

They are on all ATRs, officially it's the mechanics call. On older ones they sound like the horn on an older French or Italian car, and are quite loud. We use them to get the attention of the ground and for general shenanigans.
 
User avatar
DL_Mech
Posts: 2263
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2000 7:48 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:21 pm

747Whale wrote:
It's too high to reach on quite a few, especially if the aircraft isn't loaded enough to compress the gear.


I know on the MD-11, some people needed a ladder to reach the panel on the belly. I always thought it was a bad design. The Boeings, L-1011 and Airbus A/C I have worked are all accessible.
This plane is built to withstand anything... except a bad pilot.
 
acmx
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:49 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:43 pm

I agree with the md11 location. Some people would need a ladder and it’s also has an access door with latches that never get used. And it’s definitely not as noticeable as other planes I’ve worked on.
 
User avatar
nuke
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2012 4:21 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:19 pm

VSMUT wrote:
They are on all ATRs, officially it's the mechanics call. On older ones they sound like the horn on an older French or Italian car, and are quite loud. We use them to get the attention of the ground and for general shenanigans.

Got to be my favourite thing about flying the ATR, I found it so amusing at first that an aircraft would have a horn similar to a car. And yep, hilarious to use around the ramp sometimes.
Dependable Engines.
 
stratclub
Posts: 701
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:27 pm

acmx wrote:
I agree with the md11 location. Some people would need a ladder and it’s also has an access door with latches that never get used. And it’s definitely not as noticeable as other planes I’ve worked on.

Haven't worked the 10's much but it really is kind of a strange bird. One example of strange is the sound the hydraulic transfer pump makes. Sounds kinda ghost like. And then there is the placement of the center engine........
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 3:29 am

The center engine? That's what makes the 10 and 11 special. That, and a few hundred other things, like landing them. :duck: Ooops, my bad. This is the horn thread.
 
User avatar
CrimsonNL
Posts: 2049
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:34 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:09 am

The Avrojet has an actual "car horn" sound as the ground call. The mentioned Boeing ground calls are super loud and very distinct, you definitely hear that over every other sound on the ramp.

There's also one type that starts sounding a constant "horn" sound when the ground power fails and the aircraft switches to battery power. I don't really remember which one but I think it was on the 737 classic.

Martijn
Always comparing your flown types list with mine
 
stratclub
Posts: 701
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:26 am

That most likely would be any aircraft with ADIRU's (Air Data Inertia Reference Units) . If you shut off or lost ground power with out shutting off the ADIRU's, the ground call would go off continuously because the ADIRU's were on battery. True as well for the 787's and for the IRS's (Inertia Reference System) on the 747's.
 
Apprentice
Posts: 735
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:51 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:16 am

WPvsMW wrote:
Pilots: On the ramp? On a taxiway to scare feral cats?
If on the ramp, under what circumstances? No ramper response to request to push?

MX: When yelling out the window at someone with no radio doesn't get their attention, or is wearing ear buds because they just went off shift?
Any rules on using the horn inside a hangar?



Hi: When flying, on cruise, and a peatón do not pay attention crossing a way point.

Rgds
(Sorry, ...)
“An4; IL18; IL6; Tu5; D10; MD11; MD83; B32; B34: B37; B744; B748; B752; B763; B772; B773; B77W; A320; A332; A333; A342; A343.
"A NO" is a positive answer., "DON'T KNOW" is not. My Tutor (a wise man)
“CUBANA” 90 years Flying”
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:17 am

@CrimsonNL. At least on Boeings, the horn sound and the "avionics cooling" alarm sound (which is also emitted through the nose wheel well horn) are different. The former is like a truck air horn, and sounds only as long as the GND call button is pushed. The latter is continuous until power is restored or the alarm is silenced.
Last edited by WPvsMW on Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
WPvsMW
Topic Author
Posts: 1483
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:23 am

Apprentice wrote:


Hi: When flying, on cruise, and a peatón do not pay attention crossing a way point.

Rgds
(Sorry, ...)


You honk at pedestrians during cruise?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=su141UIHqOI at 1:06
 
User avatar
Balerit
Posts: 593
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 9:14 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 12:29 pm

On the 747's there is also a horn in the r/h b/gear wheel well for the APU fire alarm.

Often pilots would flash the nose gear taxi lights to get our attention, especially if the ramp is busy with aircraft coming or going.
Licensed Aircraft Maintenance Engineer (retired).
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 5573
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:18 pm

Acey559 wrote:
The 757/767 also has a loud “beep beep beep” horn that indicates an APU fire (same noise as the equipment overheat horn). The ground crew has be ability to shut the APU down and fire a bottle (767) on the panel located on the back of the nose gear.


IIRC, all Boeing models have the APU fire Horn on the nose wheel panel and fire bottle switch that you mention. All models also have the IRU on Battery horn on the same panel. Someone mentioned that earlier. It tells you that the IRUs are aligned but only being powered by the Standby Battery, which is at risk of running down the battery fairly quickly.
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 5573
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:25 pm

stratclub wrote:
That most likely would be any aircraft with ADIRU's (Air Data Inertia Reference Units) . If you shut off or lost ground power with out shutting off the ADIRU's, the ground call would go off continuously because the ADIRU's were on battery. True as well for the 787's and for the IRS's (Inertia Reference System) on the 747's.


All Boeing models have the IRU on Battery Horn as mentioned earlier, regardless of specific architecture.

Every current Boeing model has some form of IRUs, whether it be seperate IRUs on older 747s, 737s, 757s and 767s; ADIRUs on newer 737s, 767s, 747s, KC-46, and 757-300s; single ADIRU and SAARU on the 7777; or the ERS and AHRS system on the 787 and 777X.

The inertial system architecture on the various Boeing models would be an interesting topic for another thread.
 
Apprentice
Posts: 735
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:51 pm

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:18 am

Hi: Resuming,
-Auto: 1 Fire warning
2. IRS is being feeding not by AC, but by their own Battery ( signaling, most of the times, APU or GPU electric power drop from aircraft bars, on ground
-3. Manual, when crew press push button in cockpit, to cal Mx who is not with headset on at this time.

Note: There is also a push button on power in panel, external fuselage, lower part, behind NLG, that is pressed by Mechanics to call Pilots whenever it is necessary

Rgds
“An4; IL18; IL6; Tu5; D10; MD11; MD83; B32; B34: B37; B744; B748; B752; B763; B772; B773; B77W; A320; A332; A333; A342; A343.
"A NO" is a positive answer., "DON'T KNOW" is not. My Tutor (a wise man)
“CUBANA” 90 years Flying”
 
ELBOB
Posts: 126
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2015 6:56 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:58 am

CrimsonNL wrote:
The Avrojet has an actual "car horn" sound as the ground call.


It IS an actual car horn, surplus stock from BMC. Allegedly from the Morris Minor.
 
CosmicCruiser
Posts: 2272
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 3:01 am

Re: Pilots and AMTs, when do you use the a/c horn?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:19 pm

747Whale wrote:
It's called a landing light.

that's all we ever used

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: CrimsonNL and 15 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos