User avatar
Pudelhund
Topic Author
Posts: 196
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2019 11:06 pm

What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Thu Jan 24, 2019 7:16 pm

Perhaps I suffer from a lack of imagination, but if we have the 797 as roughly a 757-200 sized aircraft that could fly a little but further with more efficiency, which routes are the most prized for the taking that aren’t currently operated nonstop? Like would we really see something like Boston to Lyon? Cincinnati to Munich? New York to Pisa? Or is it far more modest than that? What are some examples?
 
User avatar
BWIAirport
Posts: 839
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 10:29 pm

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Thu Jan 24, 2019 9:22 pm

It mostly depends on who orders it. If AF or KL (or even DL) gets the 797, you're going to see a lot more secondary cities to CDG or AMS, for example. Same goes with EI and DUB, BA and LHR/LGW, etc. If/when DL orders it, you'll see a lot more European cities connected to JFK. You could also see them expanding southward into South America from ATL. Further, I could absolutely see them tapping into the secondary market in HNL, setting up a 797 base there and adding HNL-RNO/BOI/TUS/ABQ and the like. But maybe we're both a little too imaginative.
I'm certainly hoping it starts to connect some dots on BWI's European map. From what I've heard (rumblings, nothing substantial) it sounds like EI might send the A321LR to BWI when it arrives. I could see any combination of CDG, MAD, MUC, CPH, and AMS depending on who orders it.
Next flight: October 17 DL2641 BWI-ATL B739
October 17 DL2607 ATL-TPA B752

SWA, UAL, DAL, AWE, ASA, TRS, DLH, CLH, AFR, BAW, EIN, AAL | E190 DC94 CRJ2 B712 B733 B737 B738 B739 B744 B752 B753 B762 B77W A319 A320 A321 A333 A343 A388 MD88
 
JayinKitsap
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 9:55 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:55 am

The B738 and the A321 has opened up lots of pairs in the 6 hour length, look to the 797 to do the same out a few hours longer.

A lot of spokes are just beyond direct range but easy to do via a NB hub. The spoke becomes a mini hub with direct flights to 26 destinations, up from 16 a decade ago.
 
marcelh
Posts: 678
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:43 pm

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:11 pm

BWIAirport wrote:
It mostly depends on who orders it. If AF or KL (or even DL) gets the 797, you're going to see a lot more secondary cities to CDG or AMS, for example. Same goes with EI and DUB, BA and LHR/LGW, etc. If/when DL orders it, you'll see a lot more European cities connected to JFK. You could also see them expanding southward into South America from ATL. Further, I could absolutely see them tapping into the secondary market in HNL, setting up a 797 base there and adding HNL-RNO/BOI/TUS/ABQ and the like. But maybe we're both a little too imaginative.
I'm certainly hoping it starts to connect some dots on BWI's European map. From what I've heard (rumblings, nothing substantial) it sounds like EI might send the A321LR to BWI when it arrives. I could see any combination of CDG, MAD, MUC, CPH, and AMS depending on who orders it.

It will open some new routes, but I don’t see a huge move. DL, AF and KLM are modernizing their WB fleet and those planes are for hub-hub flights.
 
TTailedTiger
Posts: 1424
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:19 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:01 am

While it wouldn't be a new route, if the 797 has enough range for SEA-Asia, I could see Alaska ordering some to start their own flights. I think the DOT would be willing to give a new entrant like Alaska a HND slot.
 
User avatar
LAX772LR
Posts: 12490
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:06 pm

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:55 am

Pudelhund wrote:
New York to Pisa?

DL already launched that flight in 2007 and flew it off&on (seasonally) until 2017.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
RJMAZ
Posts: 1625
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2016 2:54 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:04 am

Hawaiian could do dozens of new thin routes that couldn't fill an A330 or 767-300ER. More Australian destinations, more destinations to the east coast of the US. Multiple destinations to China.

Qantas could operate international flights to Asia from Adelaide, Canberra and Hobart. Perth can do direct to New Zealand. Less traffic passing through Sydney.
 
jetblueguy22
Posts: 3235
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:26 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Mon Feb 04, 2019 4:40 pm

Maybe I’m a pessimist, but I see the same thing happening with the NMA that happened with the 787. Boeing and even the airlines presented it as an opportunity to open up point to point routes, but it’s stayed on relatively normal hub to hub or hub to spoke routes. I don’t think a whole new range of destinations will come on. It will just replace the planes already on those routes
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 6314
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:26 am

jetblueguy22 wrote:
Maybe I’m a pessimist, but I see the same thing happening with the NMA that happened with the 787. Boeing and even the airlines presented it as an opportunity to open up point to point routes, but it’s stayed on relatively normal hub to hub or hub to spoke routes. I don’t think a whole new range of destinations will come on. It will just replace the planes already on those routes


Not this again. They did not literally mean point-to-point like FAT-COR. It was a figure of speech meaning that the 787 would allow many new non-stops to be flown economically that bypassed large hubs.

The 787 has opened up LOTS of new routes. In some cases the routes started with a 787 to develop them and then taken over by a larger airplane (e.g. AUS-LHR).
 
TheEuphorian
Posts: 352
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:35 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:06 am

In Asia:
BKK-HKD
DEL-DPS
SUB-KIX
MDC-NRT
KNO-DXB
NRT-KBV
MLE-PUS
 
User avatar
TWA772LR
Posts: 6831
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:12 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:00 am

I'd love to see more US-Eastern Europe. Maybe even UAs return to Moscow! :cloudnine:

I think we'd also see (as far as the US3 are concerned):
AA:
MIA-tertiary South America (nonstop Asuncion, Mendoza and the like)
MIA-West Africa
JFK-Helsinki/secondary EU
PHL- see above
DFW-secondary Latin America
ORD-secondary western Europe

DL-ATL/DTW/JFK/MSP-secondary western Europe (connecting dots really, seasonal routes becoming year round)
JFK/ATL-PRG (contingent on AF/KL making their rumored team building with OK)
ATL-secondary LatAm
DTW-gru returning (the DTW crowd owes me on that one)
JFK-LED (most unlikely scenario but I see DL as more likely to go to LED than the others)

UA:
EWR-eastern Europe, maybe even year round PRG and a return to Moscow (my pipe dream)
IAD: connecting dots already served by EWR that have connection potential, West Africa (return to LOS and ACC,)
ORD: see above
*PIPEDREAM: IAD/IAH-LFE-JNB/CPT with 5th freedom rights*
IAH: return to CDG, start MAD/BCN/MXP/FCO as proposed by CO pre-787, secondary South America
SFO/LAX: maybe Fiji
*PIPEDREAM: if the govt ever allows TWOV, UA could make GUM a mean Oz-East Asia connection point*
When wasn't America great?


The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and are not influenced by my employer.
 
WPvsMW
Posts: 2090
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:43 am

I think the NMA will enable thin route scissor hubs, S.Am/E.Asia with the pivot at HNL. Given a choice of LAX (and several extra hours of travel time without counting waiting for a gate and blowing a connection) or HNL as a connection....
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=scl-hnl-hnd&MS=bm&DU=mi
vs.
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=scl-lax-hnd&MS=bm&DU=mi
 
JayinKitsap
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 9:55 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Sat Feb 09, 2019 4:48 am

4200 nm from HNL has all of North America except NY and New England, Guam, Japan, Korea, New Zealand, and Coastal China.
4200 nm from BOS has Alaska, North America, half of South America, and all of Europe
4200 nm from DXB - All of Europe, Asia, and Africa.
4200 nm from KIX - All of Asia and Australia
4200 nm from SIN - All of Asia, Australia, and most of the Middle East.
4200 nm from MUC - Nearly all of Asia and Africa, Eastern US & Canada
4200 nm from DEL - All of Asia, Europe, and most of Africa.
4200 nm from KEF - All of North America & Europe, the Middle East.
4200 nm from CKG - Asia, Australia, Middle East, and half of Europe
4200 nm from Moscow - All of Europe and Asia, half of Africa.
4200 nm from MAN - most of North America, Africa, Russia, and Middle East, including India

So just using NB's and the NMA any of the above could hub to those destinations. HNL, BOS, KIX, KEF, and CKG all could be decent hubs but are currently mainly just spokes. All of the cities of Europe could have a dozen more destinations than can be reached with NB's now.
 
blacksoviet
Posts: 1233
Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2016 10:50 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Mon Jun 24, 2019 11:30 am

The 797-6 will replace the 757 and the 797-7 will replace the 767. I don't think Aeromexico will order it as MEX is a hot high airport and the 797 will have limited range (much lower than a 787 or a 762).
 
User avatar
exFWAOONW
Posts: 663
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:32 pm

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:54 pm

I have to ask. How do you know it has limited hot-high performance? This plane isn’t even on the drawing board.
Is just me, or is flying not as much fun anymore?
 
User avatar
PatrickZ80
Posts: 3916
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 2010 5:33 am

Re: What are the city pairs that the anticipated NMA will open up?

Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:05 pm

exFWAOONW wrote:
I have to ask. How do you know it has limited hot-high performance? This plane isn’t even on the drawing board.


Because every plane has this limitation, any aircraft not affected by hot-high performance is still to be designed. The 797 isn't going to change that for sure.

Besides, it is expected that the 797 will compete with the A321XLR which has a similar range, but is also affected by hot-high performance.

However this doesn't matter too much since for every hot-high airport there is another one at short distance which is a lot lower and can be used as a fuel stop. Denver is a hot-high airport and for that reason an A321XLR cannot make it all the way from Denver to Hawaii. No matter, they can do Denver - Seattle, refuel there and then continue to Hawaii.

For the 797 (or A321XLR for that matter), Hawaii could be a very strategic location. From there they can reach into mainland USA as well as a whole lot of Asian destinations. Japan, South Korea and even some parts of China are easily within reach. They could also fly from Honolulu to Guam, using that as a hub to reach all the way into southeast Asia and Australia.

Just imagine a route Houston - Honolulu - Guam - Kolkata. The A321XLR can do it, as can the 797.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 28 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos