dfwjim1
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Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Fri Aug 23, 2019 8:11 pm

Yesterday (08/22) I arrived in Fort Lauderdale from Campinas, Brazil on flight 8704. While in line for Customs the pilots from my flight where in the special line next to me and I noticed that all three were captains in their 50s. On my previous Azul flights on this route there was always one senior captain and two fairly young first officers. Just curious as to why there would be three captains on my flight. Would it be some type of training or could it have been that there were no first officers available for my flight?

I was almost going to ask them while waiting in line but I didn't want to bother them after such a long flight.
 
BravoOne
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Fri Aug 23, 2019 8:19 pm

Probably a standardization flight with one lead Captain observing one of the other Captains evaluating The 3rd Capt. Kind of awkward, but it does happen from time to time at most airlines, especially when new equipment is being introduced.
 
CosmicCruiser
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 1:34 am

maybe they were short of F/Os. Not a big deal. The capt. on the release is the PIC
 
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Starlionblue
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 4:48 am

Could be training, or the result of roster disruption. Easily happens if a couple of guys call sick, or an earlier flight on their roster was delayed and they couldn't make this one, or some flight was canceled. "The best laid plans" and all that.

Ops needs two crew, and no FOs are available on reserve, so they call two captains out. It is not that uncommon.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
BravoOne
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 1:58 pm

A lot of airline do to cross seat qualify their pilots it depnds on who the operator is. If all three of these pilots were check airman, then most likely they would be qualified in both seats.
 
RetiredWeasel
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 3:05 pm

Happened a few times at my former airlines at NRT. FO's got sick or family emergency or similiar and scheduling had to scramble to find somebody. If a CPT was available and caused the least amount of juggling, then he was given a pay incentive for the call down on top of his CPT's normal pay. That was when NRT was a huge hub though and all CPTs were qualified to fly in the FO position.
 
BravoOne
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 3:24 pm

RetiredWeasel wrote:
Happened a few times at my former airlines at NRT. FO's got sick or family emergency or similiar and scheduling had to scramble to find somebody. If a CPT was available and caused the least amount of juggling, then he was given a pay incentive for the call down on top of his CPT's normal pay. That was when NRT was a huge hub though and all CPTs were qualified to fly in the FO position.


Was that an US airline or the other airline in your past?
 
RetiredWeasel
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 4:21 pm

BravoOne wrote:
Was that an US airline or the other airline in your past?


US with the red tails..
 
e38
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 5:07 pm

dfwjim1, I just have a comment with regard to your last sentence, “I was almost going to ask them . . . but I didn’t want to bother them . . .”

jim, this is just my opinion, but don’t ever be hesitant to ask a pilot a question about the airline, or the aircraft, or any aspect of flight operations, regardless of the situation (such as a long flight).

These days, so few passengers seem interested in anything about what we do as pilots that I’m absolutely thrilled when someone asks me an aviation-related question. I’ll visit with them as long as they want (as long as I don’t have other duties to attend to) until all their questions are answered.
Yes, occasionally you will come across a pilot who is somewhat “self-absorbed” and will act like you’re imposing on their time, but for the most part we love to talk “flying” and will gladly answer your questions.

My advice, “Just ask!”

e38
 
dfwjim1
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 5:39 pm

e38 wrote:
dfwjim1, I just have a comment with regard to your last sentence, “I was almost going to ask them . . . but I didn’t want to bother them . . .”

jim, this is just my opinion, but don’t ever be hesitant to ask a pilot a question about the airline, or the aircraft, or any aspect of flight operations, regardless of the situation (such as a long flight).

These days, so few passengers seem interested in anything about what we do as pilots that I’m absolutely thrilled when someone asks me an aviation-related question. I’ll visit with them as long as they want (as long as I don’t have other duties to attend to) until all their questions are answered.
Yes, occasionally you will come across a pilot who is somewhat “self-absorbed” and will act like you’re imposing on their time, but for the most part we love to talk “flying” and will gladly answer your questions.

My advice, “Just ask!”

e38


Thank you for your input and I will surely "ask the pilot" next time I have a similar question. The captains that were next to me seemed like pleasant fellows so I am sure they would have accommodated my question...my loss I guess.
 
e38
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sat Aug 24, 2019 5:58 pm

but . . . you received some interesting responses here on Airliners.net!

my guess this situation was a “training/evaluation” event.

One Captain was completing his initial upgrade training in the aircraft; the second captain was the instructor completing the first captain’s training; the third captain was a company-designated examiner/evaluator conducting the first captain’s “line check.”

At the company at which I work, that is generally the situation in which you will see three Captains on the same flight.

But, it certainly could have been a crew substitution or a crew member deadheading as well.

e38
 
BravoOne
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sun Aug 25, 2019 6:16 pm

RetiredWeasel wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
Was that an US airline or the other airline in your past?


US with the red tails..


Are you saying that line Captaina could put the F/O in the left seat for landings at NWA?
 
mmo
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sun Aug 25, 2019 6:40 pm

BravoOne wrote:
RetiredWeasel wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
Was that an US airline or the other airline in your past?


US with the red tails..


Are you saying that line Captaina could put the F/O in the left seat for landings at NWA?


Re-read the post. Captains were right seat qualified, F/Os were right seat qualified only.
If we weren't all crazy we'd all go insane!
 
BravoOne
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Sun Aug 25, 2019 7:59 pm

mmo wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
RetiredWeasel wrote:

US with the red tails..


Are you saying that line Captaina could put the F/O in the left seat for landings at NWA?


Re-read the post. Captains were right seat qualified, F/Os were right seat qualified only.



Got it now. Thanks!
 
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RetiredNWA
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Mon Aug 26, 2019 12:40 am

BravoOne wrote:
RetiredWeasel wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
Was that an US airline or the other airline in your past?


US with the red tails..


Are you saying that line Captaina could put the F/O in the left seat for landings at NWA?


Nadine still owes me a few days off for a pattern that ended up that way - me in the right seat on the Generic...
 
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ojjunior
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Fri Aug 30, 2019 6:43 pm

dfwjim1 wrote:
I noticed that all three were captains in their 50s.


Now it's explained the average ticket prices VCP-FLL Azul charges....
 
dfwjim1
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:40 pm

ojjunior wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:
I noticed that all three were captains in their 50s.


Now it's explained the average ticket prices VCP-FLL Azul charges....


You have the right...surprising how much Azul charges at times.
 
luckyone
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Tue Sep 03, 2019 1:45 am

dfwjim1 wrote:
ojjunior wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:
I noticed that all three were captains in their 50s.


Now it's explained the average ticket prices VCP-FLL Azul charges....


You have the right...surprising how much Azul charges at times.

Unrelated to the overall topic, but if my destination isn’t Sao Paolo and I need to connect, IMHO Azul has the superior product all the way through and IMO their fares offer good value. Delta beats them on the long haul segment but on the domestic segment Azul beats Delta’s connecting partner Gol hands down. TAM is fine, but AA’s 77W is like some torture device from the Spanish Inquisition with 10 across and immovable armrests.
 
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ojjunior
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:42 am

luckyone wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:
ojjunior wrote:

Now it's explained the average ticket prices VCP-FLL Azul charges....


You have the right...surprising how much Azul charges at times.

Unrelated to the overall topic, but if my destination isn’t Sao Paolo and I need to connect, IMHO Azul has the superior product all the way through and IMO their fares offer good value. Delta beats them on the long haul segment but on the domestic segment Azul beats Delta’s connecting partner Gol hands down. TAM is fine, but AA’s 77W is like some torture device from the Spanish Inquisition with 10 across and immovable armrests.


I strongly agree with you, AD's onboard service is impeccable, I fly with them no matter the schedules just not to fly Gol or Latam if my destination has AD as an option. Airport services, onboard and ground services are off the curve, however, only for domestic flights in Brazil.
Intl longhaul, sorry, but for what they charge in some destinations is pure fare of who flies alone on the route (Eg. VCP-FLL) so anyway, who wants to go from GRU to FLL, even connecting in MIA or some other place finds better fares and services as good as AD without having to travel 2 or 3 hours from downtown Sao Paulo to VCP.
I love AD but nothing justifies what they charge on routes where there is no competition, until competition arrives.
 
dfwjim1
Topic Author
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Tue Sep 03, 2019 6:18 pm

ojjunior wrote:
luckyone wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:

You have the right...surprising how much Azul charges at times.

Unrelated to the overall topic, but if my destination isn’t Sao Paolo and I need to connect, IMHO Azul has the superior product all the way through and IMO their fares offer good value. Delta beats them on the long haul segment but on the domestic segment Azul beats Delta’s connecting partner Gol hands down. TAM is fine, but AA’s 77W is like some torture device from the Spanish Inquisition with 10 across and immovable armrests.


I strongly agree with you, AD's onboard service is impeccable, I fly with them no matter the schedules just not to fly Gol or Latam if my destination has AD as an option. Airport services, onboard and ground services are off the curve, however, only for domestic flights in Brazil.
Intl longhaul, sorry, but for what they charge in some destinations is pure fare of who flies alone on the route (Eg. VCP-FLL) so anyway, who wants to go from GRU to FLL, even connecting in MIA or some other place finds better fares and services as good as AD without having to travel 2 or 3 hours from downtown Sao Paulo to VCP.
I love AD but nothing justifies what they charge on routes where there is no competition, until competition arrives.


I wonder how much AD's fares increased after AA left VCP...
 
luckyone
Posts: 2788
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Re: Azul Airlines - VCP to FLL - 3 captains

Tue Sep 03, 2019 7:43 pm

dfwjim1 wrote:
ojjunior wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Unrelated to the overall topic, but if my destination isn’t Sao Paolo and I need to connect, IMHO Azul has the superior product all the way through and IMO their fares offer good value. Delta beats them on the long haul segment but on the domestic segment Azul beats Delta’s connecting partner Gol hands down. TAM is fine, but AA’s 77W is like some torture device from the Spanish Inquisition with 10 across and immovable armrests.


I strongly agree with you, AD's onboard service is impeccable, I fly with them no matter the schedules just not to fly Gol or Latam if my destination has AD as an option. Airport services, onboard and ground services are off the curve, however, only for domestic flights in Brazil.
Intl longhaul, sorry, but for what they charge in some destinations is pure fare of who flies alone on the route (Eg. VCP-FLL) so anyway, who wants to go from GRU to FLL, even connecting in MIA or some other place finds better fares and services as good as AD without having to travel 2 or 3 hours from downtown Sao Paulo to VCP.
I love AD but nothing justifies what they charge on routes where there is no competition, until competition arrives.


I wonder how much AD's fares increased after AA left VCP...

How much would that impacted competition though? AA launched their VCP flight from JFK, so there hasn't been any direct competition from VCP-South Florida, while they certainly do compete on Sao Paolo-South Florida, just using different airports.

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