jerrychoo
Topic Author
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:51 am

IDG maintenance service package

Mon Aug 26, 2019 7:03 am

Hi I am new here and hope my first question don't appear silly. I understand that IDG repair costs is very expensive and i have heard from one airline that they actually have an service package which doesn't require them to pay anything when they experience unscheduled removal. Is there such an service package? Thanks.
 
unimproved
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:14 pm

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Mon Aug 26, 2019 8:39 am

Nothing is free in life...

You're probably talking about something like power by the hour, which means you pay per hour that it's used. Maintenance, both scheduled and unscheduled, is included in that price.
 
Dalmd88
Posts: 2928
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 3:19 am

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:18 am

I think the main cause of failure for IDG's is improper service while in use. It's basically a transmission that takes the shaft power from the engine and regulates that to a even output to run the electrical generator. That transmission has oil in it. There is a task to check the level of the oil. To check the level you over fill the IDG and then drain it down to the proper level. Not enough oil is bad, too much oil is bad.

So I'm sure power by the hour exists for IDG's but I would bet its rather expensive.
 
extender
Posts: 264
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 2:52 am

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Mon Aug 26, 2019 10:37 am

AS unimproved pointed out, PBH. You pay one way or another.
 
battlegroup62
Posts: 37
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2017 5:05 am

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:48 am

Some airlines use a program whereby they have a list of components that a third party stores and makes available whenever they are needed. The system can be used by multiple airlines to share the same components so long as the inventory levels are adjusted accordingly. At my company we call this a pool parts program. The airlines pay a subscription fee to be able to use the program and select which items they want available to them.
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AA737-823
Posts: 5448
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 11:10 am

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:54 am

Dalmd88 wrote:
I think the main cause of failure for IDG's is improper service while in use. It's basically a transmission that takes the shaft power from the engine and regulates that to a even output to run the electrical generator. That transmission has oil in it. There is a task to check the level of the oil. To check the level you over fill the IDG and then drain it down to the proper level. Not enough oil is bad, too much oil is bad.

So I'm sure power by the hour exists for IDG's but I would bet its rather expensive.


Wow. There’s a lot of false info in that post:
1. No. IDG’s fail on their own.
2. That is not how you check the oil level at all.
3. That is not how you service the oil level.

Things you got right:
1. Yeah it’s basically a transmission.
2. Yeah it has oil in it.
3. Yeah too much or too little is bad. Just like any other gearbox.

But, believe it or not, licensed mechanics are actually pretty competent at knowing too much from too little.
But I see you have no confidence in our abilities.
 
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fr8mech
Posts: 7710
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Re: IDG maintenance service package

Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:14 am

AA737-823 wrote:
Wow. There’s a lot of false info in that post:

1. No. IDG’s fail on their own.
2. That is not how you check the oil level at all.
3. That is not how you service the oil level.


Umm, he is absolutely correct, because there is no way to tell if an IDG is over-serviced.

From our B767 AMM, all others are similar:

(h) Use the pump on the oil service equipment to fill the IDG with oil, using a maximum of 40 psi (276 kPa).NOTE: When you start to put the oil into the IDG, oil could flow from the overflow drain hose. This does not show that the IDG is full.
1 Use D00520 Mobil Jet Oil II to fill the IDG.
(i) Stop pumping oil into the IDG when approximately one quart of oil flows from the overflow drain hose into the container.NOTE: The one quart (one liter) of oil does not include the oil that drained when the overflow drain hose was connected to ensure that the IDG oil level is correct.
(j) Disconnect the hose on the oil service equipment from the IDG pressure fill coupling.
(k) Install the cover on the pressure fill coupling.

CAUTION: DO NOT REMOVE THE OVERFLOW DRAIN HOSE FROM THE IDG UNTIL TWO MINUTES AFTER THE OIL FLOW HAS DECREASED TO DROPS. FAILURE TO DRAIN THE IDG CORRECTLY WILL CAUSE TOO MUCH OIL IN THE IDG. THIS CONDITION WILL CAUSE AN IMMEDIATE OVERHEAT CONDITION AND CAUSE DAMAGE TO THE IDG.

(l) When the oil from the overflow drain hose decreases to a drop, wait two minutes then remove the overflow drain hose.
(m) Install the cover on the IDG overflow drain coupling


We painted over the oil level view ports on all our IDG's years ago.

Of course, different operators have different rules, but in our operation, and apparently DALmd88's, the only proper way to check the oil level is to properly service the IDG. And the only proper way to service the IDG is to allow at least 1 quart of oil to flow out of the overflow port.
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mikeinatlanta
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2016 5:34 pm

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Sat Sep 14, 2019 4:09 pm

Guys are getting into a semantics argument over the servicing.

To answer the OP's question: Yes that does exist, but maybe not a common thing for a larger airline. An example would be when World Airways leased some power by the hour Delta MD-11s. Part of the lease conditions would have Delta absorb the costs of an IDG change. Delta even paid for tires and brakes on that contract.

This example is actually a pretty entertaining case in hind sight. World would bring an EX Delta MD-11 into Delta for an A-Check. Pretty much no matter how minor the inspection finding, the World Reps would say to change the part. Seat cushion dirty?... Change the seat kind of stuff. The low level Delta Managers and Inspection thought the World Reps were idiots with endless money. What the World Reps actually knew that the Delta guys didn't was that Delta was footing the entire bill. One time Delta presented a Non-Routine Card with a main tire having an in limits cut to the World Rep. The World Rep said to change the tire. At that moment Delta didn't have stock of an MD-11 main so they leased a wheel assembly from World to install it on a World airplane, when the old one was perfectly serviceable. The Delta guys on the floor had no idea of the contract.

This example should make it clear why this type of arrangement isn't generally a good idea. The operator has no real financial incentive to properly service and troubleshoot when the parts are free.
Aircraft Maintenance Professional since 1979.
 
Lpbri
Posts: 175
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:18 pm

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:47 pm

On newer airplanes such as 777 or 787, the electrical page displays "Normal" or "service" for oil level, be it an IDG, BUG, or VFSG. On ETOPs and lower level checks, this is how oil levels are checked. Higher level level checks may call for you to check the sight glass, and service to full whatever the level is. On engines where the IDG is mounted on the core, it may be easier just to service it than open up the T/R's to check the glass
 
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DarkSnowyNight
Posts: 2278
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Re: IDG maintenance service package

Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:25 am

fr8mech wrote:
AA737-823 wrote:
Wow. There’s a lot of false info in that post:

1. No. IDG’s fail on their own.
2. That is not how you check the oil level at all.
3. That is not how you service the oil level.


Umm, he is absolutely correct, because there is no way to tell if an IDG is over-serviced.

From our B767 AMM, all others are similar: ...



For a specific airplane, sure. Our B767 AMM have instructions that match what you have quoted more or less exactly.

But any 320 I've ever encountered uses a sight gauge.
For 777/787, it's a message on the Electrics page.

For the 7M8s, there is No over service danger, as that stand-pipes to the drain mast.

These differences matter.

Whoever posted that upthread was right about one particular aircraft at one particular operator. He should not have applied that as a blanket statement, however, as the amount of variation is not trivial.

Fr8mech wrote:
We painted over the oil level view ports on all our IDG's years ago.




Why?
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"Yeah? That means there's no Oxygen for him Neither..."
 
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fr8mech
Posts: 7710
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 9:00 am

Re: IDG maintenance service package

Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:30 pm

DarkSnowyNight wrote:

Why?


We don’t want the sight glass used to determine level. We don’t have a “check” task. Basically, our maintenance program says if you need/want to check/service the IDG, you will service it per the AMM.
When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
Unless it's expressly prohibited, it's allowed.
You are not entitled to a public safe space.
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