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rjsampson
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MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:12 am

Here's an interesting incident. A couple of days ago, during takeoff roll, a passenger was videotaping the MLG of said Dash-8. The inner MLG wheel is sparking and, shortly after rotation, completely separates from the axle:

https://jalopnik.com/air-canada-passeng ... 1840832914

As shown in the video, the aircraft landed very smoothly without incident (on the single wheel) after burning off fuel. A couple questions:

1) Speculation: What could have caused this in the first place? Hot brakes?

2) Would the pilots have had any indication of this in the cockpit, or would they have more likely been notified by the cabin crew from what the passengers saw?

This is only two days ago, so of course any comments are pre-disclaimed as speculation.
"..your eyes will be forever turned skyward, for there.." yeah we know the DaVinci quote. Unfortunately, we're grounded :(
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:39 am

rjsampson wrote:

1) Speculation: What could have caused this in the first place? Hot brakes?


If the axle nut was left at initial/seat torque value rather than final during the previous tire change, this can happen.
"Nous ne sommes pas infectés. Il n'y a pas d'infection ici..."
 
stratable
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:39 am

Funny enough, two or three years ago I was on an Air Canada Express flight on a DC8-100 and we had a few sparks on take off, too, without losing the wheel though. Upon landing, more sparks. The Shocks seemed to be worn out, as well, since the bottom part of the MLG scraped the runway upon touchdown. I let the FA know but she said that could happen from time to time.
A313 319/20/21 332/3 343 359 B734/8 742/4/4M 752/3 763ER 772/E/W 787-8/-9 CRJ900 CS300 ERJ-145 F70 Q100/300/400
 
kalvado
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:41 am

There is some glow close to the axis. Bearing siezed, or something preventing bearing from spinning freely comes to mind. Incorrect mounting, as mentioned above. End result is most likely bearing destruction.
Brakes should be further out from the hub to be efficient.
 
StereoTechque
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:47 am

Same incident happened on an A320 a couple of years ago, where the nose wheel liberated after Aircraft rotation. Investigation revealed the Final Torque was given after the lowering the axle jack, resulting in inadequate final torque and loosening of the axle nut.
Looking California.. Feeling Minnesota.... R. I.P. Chris Cornell...
 
T prop
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:22 am

stratable wrote:
Funny enough, two or three years ago I was on an Air Canada Express flight on a DC8-100 and we had a few sparks on take off, too, without losing the wheel though. Upon landing, more sparks. The Shocks seemed to be worn out, as well, since the bottom part of the MLG scraped the runway upon touchdown. I let the FA know but she said that could happen from time to time.


Some sparking from the brakes is normal for the old Dash 8's, or any other aircraft that has metallic brakes. Also you are mistaken, the bottom part of the MLG of the Dash 8 you were on did not touch the runway on landing. The MLG axle is at the bottom of the gear strut, therefore if the strut has wheels on it, it is not possible for the gear to touch the runway.
 
stratable
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:26 am

T prop wrote:
Some sparking from the brakes is normal for the old Dash 8's, or any other aircraft that has metallic brakes. Also you are mistaken, the bottom part of the MLG of the Dash 8 you were on did not touch the runway on landing. The MLG axle is at the bottom of the gear strut, therefore if the strut has wheels on it, it is not possible for the gear to touch the runway.


That's just what it looked like from my angled perspective. I have no clue how the gear is built excatly but upon touchdown both the brakes were sparking and something was scraping along the runway between the two wheels. Apparently it was nothing major and we just taxied normally.
A313 319/20/21 332/3 343 359 B734/8 742/4/4M 752/3 763ER 772/E/W 787-8/-9 CRJ900 CS300 ERJ-145 F70 Q100/300/400
 
T prop
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:38 am

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
rjsampson wrote:

1) Speculation: What could have caused this in the first place? Hot brakes?


If the axle nut was left at initial/seat torque value rather than final during the previous tire change, this can happen.


Lol, I don't doubt it, some meathead on the tire change.

Another possible cause of bearings destroying themselves is the inner grease seal. If it fails debris, moisture and dust from the brakes gets into the bearings and kills them quickly.
 
744lover
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:22 pm

The video of the incident can be seen here:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1213602583220236288


BR,
744lover
 
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rjsampson
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:45 pm

Going back to one of my questions: Would there have been an alert in the cockpit to the pilots, indicating that this happened? Or would they have been made aware by the cabin crew notifying the cockpit?
"..your eyes will be forever turned skyward, for there.." yeah we know the DaVinci quote. Unfortunately, we're grounded :(
 
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Starlionblue
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:24 pm

Depends on the sensors on this aircraft. If they have tyre pressure and brake temperature sensors those would probably trigger a loss of data. And if a hydraulic line was severed that would trigger an alert.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Tristarsteve
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Re: MLG Wheel falls off AC Dash-8 on takeoff - 2 days ago

Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:52 pm

In 1978 I was working in the Gulf Air Maintenance Control in Bahrain.
A Tristar had departed LHR and was flying overnight to Bahrain.
I was called by British Airways and told that a nosewheel had been found on the runway at LHR, and they were sure it was from our Tristar.
I told Operations, and the Ops manager turned up. He sat and discussed it for a while and finally made a decision.
When the aircraft gets in VHF range, we can tell them the problem, and I give them permission to land. !!!
Wonder what the other option was?
The crew had no idea until we told them over the radio,.

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