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B747man
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747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 1:31 am

Hello just curious if anyone knows where I can find the specs for the domestic version of the 747-400 like size and weight. I tried searching online but didn't see anything for this variant.

Thanks
 
RetiredWeasel
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 2:38 am

Domestic version? How would that differ from an international version?
 
johns624
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:01 am

RetiredWeasel wrote:
Domestic version? How would that differ from an international version?
I think he's talking about the ones built for JAL and ANA for high density domestic routes.
 
RetiredWeasel
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:19 am

johns624 wrote:
RetiredWeasel wrote:
Domestic version? How would that differ from an international version?
I think he's talking about the ones built for JAL and ANA for high density domestic routes.


In that case, I don't know except for more seats, maybe a couple more lavs and more flight attendants.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:31 am

Minus the winglets, too.
 
Transpac787
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:52 am

The 747-400D retained the typical max zero fuel weight of 535.0, same as the other base-model variants. The max gross takeoff weight was considerably less, though; 600.0, compared to the usual 870.0 or even 875.0

Length was exactly the same, at 231ft and change. Wingspan was a bit smaller, however. 195ft, compared to the typical 211ft. Incidentally, 195ft was the wingspan of the 747-100/200/300 predecessors.
Last edited by Transpac787 on Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Transpac787
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:53 am

This website has all the Boeing Airport Compatibility manuals, for most Boeing and McDonnell Douglas types. It should have most of what you're looking for, dimensions and weights wise.

https://www.boeing.com/commercial/airpo ... nuals.page

Here is a direct link for the 747-400 manual:

https://www.boeing.com/resources/boeing ... /747_4.pdf
 
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AirKevin
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:20 am

Transpac787 wrote:
Wingspan was a bit smaller, however. 195ft, compared to the typical 211ft. Incidentally, 195ft was the wingspan of the 747-100/200/300 predecessors.

The wingspan of the -400D remained the same as the older 747 variants because they determined that the added weight of the wingtip extension and the winglets didn't help with improving fuel economy for flights that were that short.
Captain Kevin
 
unimproved
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 5:44 am

AirKevin wrote:
Transpac787 wrote:
Wingspan was a bit smaller, however. 195ft, compared to the typical 211ft. Incidentally, 195ft was the wingspan of the 747-100/200/300 predecessors.

The wingspan of the -400D remained the same as the older 747 variants because they determined that the added weight of the wingtip extension and the winglets didn't help with improving fuel economy for flights that were that short.

It does have the -400 wing however, and IIRC they could be reconfigured to normal ops
 
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747classic
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:23 am

The following 747-400D aircraft are especially produced for short range operations (11x ANA, 9x JAL) :

L/N-serialnumber-type- basicnumber- variable (tabulation)number-airline

844 25213 747-446D R2901 RU801 JAL
879 25214 747-446D R2902 RU802 JAL
891 25292 747-481D R2903 RU831 ANA
907 26347 747-446D R2904 RU803 JAL
914 25639 747-481D R2905 RU832 ANA, converted to -481 12/2001
920 25640 747-481D R2906 RU833 ANA
927 25642 747-481D R2907 RU834 ANA
935 26345 747-446D R2908 RU804 JAL
941 26348 747-446D R2909 RU805 JAL
948 26349 747-446D R2910 RU806 JAL
952 25646 747-481D R2911 RU835 ANA
963 26351 747-446D R2912 RU807 JAL
972 25643 747-481D R2913 RU836 ANA
975 25644 747-481D R2914 RU837 ANA
978 26352 747-446D R2915 RU808 JAL
991 25647 747-481D R2916 RU838 ANA
996 27163 747-481D R2917 RU839 ANA
1031 27099 747-446D R2918 RU809 JAL
1060 27436 747-481D R2919 RU840 ANA
1066 27442 747-481D R2920 RU841 ANA

The only airframe that I could prove to be converted to the long range configuration is L/N914. this airframe was converted in 12/2001 . The airframe was scrapped after a cargo fire inside a hangar at BKK, see : https://aviation-safety.net/database/re ... 20080803-0

To complicate things further two 747-481 aircraft were modified to the 481D configuration (shortend wing + removal of the winglets), to produce a short haul aircraft in 2003 at the former Boeing Military Airplanes facility (Wichita).
However the fuselage was AFAIK not fully upgraded to the real 744D's specification.
Both aircraft are already sold and converted again by Bedek, now as a 747-481BDSF(again with winglets) before the cycle count became to high.
Aircraft involved :
1133 28282 747-481 R2716 RT756 ANA
1142 28283 747-481 R2724 RT757 ANA
Operating a twin over the ocean, you're always one engine failure from a total emergency.
 
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AirKevin
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Wed Feb 19, 2020 12:05 pm

unimproved wrote:
AirKevin wrote:
Transpac787 wrote:
Wingspan was a bit smaller, however. 195ft, compared to the typical 211ft. Incidentally, 195ft was the wingspan of the 747-100/200/300 predecessors.

The wingspan of the -400D remained the same as the older 747 variants because they determined that the added weight of the wingtip extension and the winglets didn't help with improving fuel economy for flights that were that short.

It does have the -400 wing however, and IIRC they could be reconfigured to normal ops

That is correct. From what I remember, they reconfigured some of them to the standard -400. Interestingly enough, some -400s were also converted to -400Ds, minus the extra upper deck windows.
Captain Kevin
 
blacksoviet
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Thu Feb 20, 2020 5:24 pm

AirKevin wrote:
unimproved wrote:
AirKevin wrote:
The wingspan of the -400D remained the same as the older 747 variants because they determined that the added weight of the wingtip extension and the winglets didn't help with improving fuel economy for flights that were that short.

It does have the -400 wing however, and IIRC they could be reconfigured to normal ops

That is correct. From what I remember, they reconfigured some of them to the standard -400. Interestingly enough, some -400s were also converted to -400Ds, minus the extra upper deck windows.

Why does the domestic version have extra windows on the upper deck?
 
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AirKevin
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:38 pm

blacksoviet wrote:
AirKevin wrote:
unimproved wrote:
It does have the -400 wing however, and IIRC they could be reconfigured to normal ops

That is correct. From what I remember, they reconfigured some of them to the standard -400. Interestingly enough, some -400s were also converted to -400Ds, minus the extra upper deck windows.

Why does the domestic version have extra windows on the upper deck?

If I remember right, there were no galleys there, so more space for passenger seats.
Captain Kevin
 
blacksoviet
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:58 pm

AirKevin wrote:
blacksoviet wrote:
AirKevin wrote:
That is correct. From what I remember, they reconfigured some of them to the standard -400. Interestingly enough, some -400s were also converted to -400Ds, minus the extra upper deck windows.

Why does the domestic version have extra windows on the upper deck?

If I remember right, there were no galleys there, so more space for passenger seats.

They must have sent up the beverages from the main deck.
 
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AirKevin
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:33 pm

blacksoviet wrote:
AirKevin wrote:
blacksoviet wrote:
Why does the domestic version have extra windows on the upper deck?

If I remember right, there were no galleys there, so more space for passenger seats.

They must have sent up the beverages from the main deck.

There was a much smaller galley in the back of the upper deck that didn't take as much space as the standard galley. Do keep in mind that the flights were pretty short, so I don't know how much beverage service was actually getting done.
Captain Kevin
 
spacecadet
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 3:33 am

AirKevin wrote:
There was a much smaller galley in the back of the upper deck that didn't take as much space as the standard galley. Do keep in mind that the flights were pretty short, so I don't know how much beverage service was actually getting done.


It's Japan, so almost definitely a full one on every flight. Every domestic Japanese flight I've taken has had a full drink service at least... even on SkyMark, but obviously also on ANA and JAL. I never flew the 747-400D (well, not domestically, at least - I did fly that converted one internationally!), but I can't imagine they added new drink services when they switched to 777's and 767's on those routes.
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
 
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Stitch
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Re: 747-400 Domestic variant.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:25 am

Looking at the 747-400D ACAP, there is a small galley located along the back of the upper deck cabin so that should be able to handle a few drinks carts as well as a potable water port and a coffee pot or two.

According to captions on some ANA 747-400D cabin pictures, only the nose section (premium seating) offered food service so if this is true, then the upper deck galley only holding drinks carts would have been sufficient to service that cabin.

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