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The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:22 pm
by filipinoavgeek
With the A380 ceasing production next year and the worldwide A380 fleet expected to shrink by as early as 2030, what does the future hold for three-gate A380-capable gates? Are future airports and terminals that are yet to be built or are being built still being designed with them in mind? And for existing ones, considering they apparently can't be used for 747-8is (which are an even more niche product) or 777Xs, what will happen to them once A380 fleet numbers go down and become very rare? I understand that some gates can use the bottom two tubes for other widebodies, or even to board two narrowbodies at once, but that leaves that third tube.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:56 am
by hongkongflyer
just leave the 3rd bridge even you don't need it, and remove it when the next major maintenance is due.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:06 pm
by mxaxai
filipinoavgeek wrote:
Are future airports and terminals that are yet to be built or are being built still being designed with them in mind?

Large green-field airports like in Beijing or Istanbul are designed around code F aircraft, even if not all their gates or taxiways are. I doubt that we'll see many new gates with 3 jetbridges but most new terminal layouts (for widebodies) appear able to handle either one widebody of any size or two narrowbodies at one gate. The A380 may, slowly, be on its way out but future aircraft will feature increasing aspect ratios. The 777X already requires extra clearance on the runway compared to regular code E aircraft. Between 250 A380 and 300+ 777X, plenty of airports will see service from at least one of them.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 6:45 pm
by Vladex
Why would you worry about something that is at least a decade off? It's also not wise to worry about minor cost compared to overbuilt airports that have unoccupied gates due to politics, terrorism and health issues as they do today. Or the ever busier airports with ever increasing wait, late and walking times will become even more problematic for passengers at least.
By the way, EK , SQ and probably BA and QF will keep A380 for as long as they can as they are irreplacable for them . By that time, limitation of twins, single decks and narrow bodies will become apparent and someone will start thinking about a new double decker .

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:36 pm
by JayinKitsap
The 747's were bought as much for their range as capacity. The analysts missed on separating the effects of this in the market. Actually there are relatively few city pairs that needs larger than the 779 serves well. For decades the 747 churned out 40 to 50 per year, now it will be the 779 churning out at that rate. Just below it capability wise is the A350 and B787, so a lot of choices to best match routes for profitability.

In 30 years, the world will have adapted to a route system that does not require VLAs.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:54 am
by Sokes
mxaxai wrote:
Large green-field airports like in Beijing or Istanbul are designed around code F aircraf...but most new terminal layouts (for widebodies) appear able to handle either one widebody of any size or two narrowbodies at one gate.


I am happy to hear that. I wondered earlier how these new airports are build considering that Embraer E2 jets have 35 m wingspan.
Anybody knows how much separation between two narrowbodies are required?
Did Istanbul or Beijing keep a few meter tolerance? I just wonder if a potential future 45 m wingspan plane would fit with a 35 m wingspan plane between two gates.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:19 pm
by Vladex
JayinKitsap wrote:
The 747's were bought as much for their range as capacity. The analysts missed on separating the effects of this in the market. Actually there are relatively few city pairs that needs larger than the 779 serves well. For decades the 747 churned out 40 to 50 per year, now it will be the 779 churning out at that rate. Just below it capability wise is the A350 and B787, so a lot of choices to best match routes for profitability.

In 30 years, the world will have adapted to a route system that does not require VLAs.


You are such a Boeing troll , I hope you get paid at least. It's not an insult , more like a badge of honor .

Non VLA do offer range and even capacity to an extent but they do take lots of slots and lots of gates and space including in the air and thus produce lots of delays and I assume more costs. Also they seem very limited in the ground clearance for new engines and they seem space limited for future electric battery designs whenever they come. If there is no VLA then aviation itself will shrivel down to irrelevance

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 8:30 am
by filipinoavgeek
Vladex wrote:
If there is no VLA then aviation itself will shrivel down to irrelevance

Aviation seems to be doing just fine right now with the 787/777/A350 though.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 8:08 pm
by Vladex
filipinoavgeek wrote:
Vladex wrote:
If there is no VLA then aviation itself will shrivel down to irrelevance

Aviation seems to be doing just fine right now with the 787/777/A350 though.


Not at all if you live in reality today and are not listening to dead end legacy airlines and quick money investors and not only because of Corona Virus and various wars and political conflicts , Loads of airlines lost money (Norwegian, Etihad, Qatar and Chinese) and were flying on empty because of over the top and misguided expansion as they bought and flew supposedly low risk airplanes without branding and long term plans in the wrong geographical areas. It makes psychological sense that doing conscious low risk in one area will push high risk in other areas. Besides the expansion is vastly in the A321NEO market and tiny bit in the wide body market. A321 NEO is even less risk than the wide body which makes sense with the big recent orders however narrow body create lots of issues by themselves.

But long term, those types airplanes have no potential and they will start to create problems and they are not an easy recipe for making money per se. They lack ground clearance for future engines (5-10 years from now) and electrification whenever it comes (in 20 years at least) will only be feasible on an airplane with the most efficient engine and the biggest size which makes dual deck airplanes inevitable. Bear in mind that electric cars will make transportation so cheap that regional flying will be under big pressure. I haven't even mentioned the airport size growth and delays that will be inherent with ever more narrow bodies. These are some of the reasons why double decks are the future of aviation if aviation has much of a future at all.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2020 9:46 pm
by PITingres
Vladex wrote:
... Bear in mind that electric cars will make transportation so cheap that regional flying will be under big pressure. ...


Huh??? What are you calling "regional", and what on earth do electric cars have to do with it? In the US, I'd say that any flight shorter than maybe 250 miles is more likely to be driven than flown, but that has everything to do with time and nothing to do with driving costs.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:59 am
by strfyr51
Vladex wrote:
filipinoavgeek wrote:
Vladex wrote:
If there is no VLA then aviation itself will shrivel down to irrelevance

Aviation seems to be doing just fine right now with the 787/777/A350 though.


Not at all if you live in reality today and are not listening to dead end legacy airlines and quick money investors and not only because of Corona Virus and various wars and political conflicts , Loads of airlines lost money (Norwegian, Etihad, Qatar and Chinese) and were flying on empty because of over the top and misguided expansion as they bought and flew supposedly low risk airplanes without branding and long term plans in the wrong geographical areas. It makes psychological sense that doing conscious low risk in one area will push high risk in other areas. Besides the expansion is vastly in the A321NEO market and tiny bit in the wide body market. A321 NEO is even less risk than the wide body which makes sense with the big recent orders however narrow body create lots of issues by themselves.

But long term, those types airplanes have no potential and they will start to create problems and they are not an easy recipe for making money per se. They lack ground clearance for future engines (5-10 years from now) and electrification whenever it comes (in 20 years at least) will only be feasible on an airplane with the most efficient engine and the biggest size which makes dual deck airplanes inevitable. Bear in mind that electric cars will make transportation so cheap that regional flying will be under big pressure. I haven't even mentioned the airport size growth and delays that will be inherent with ever more narrow bodies. These are some of the reasons why double decks are the future of aviation if aviation has much of a future at all.

the A380 failed because the premise that built it was flawed, Airbus built that airplane to defeat the 747. An airplane that was already in it's operating decline. they built an airplane that needed Airport modifications to operate. And worse than that? They sold the airplane to a Status Hungry second rate carrier. who was attempting to bully the world into making room for them, They did operate but? In many places? They weren't even Welcome. LH flew the A380 and they were welcome when they came to My home town Airport, And we were happy to see them. But we were happy to see them because they were a good airline and good neighbors. They had built a great relationship already, Emirates on the other hand? were NOT so welcome and theyt tried to Bully and Cajole to get what they wanted. And they didn't put a damn dime nor take a damn dime from anybody in their coming or Not coming aside from them being Underhanded. Airbus had to supply emergency equipment and even regular maintenance equipment for them in the USA because Nobody was going to Buy any for an airplane they weren't gop of thosing to fly in the USA. United and Delta flew the 747-400 so they had facilities that fit the 747. But Airbus never thought of that in building the A380. And? t date there are very few facilities in the USA where an A380 may be jacked safely. They may have to make adjustments as well for the 777-300. the 777X-8 and -9 and even the 787-10 and the A350-1000 though I'd bet the whole group of those airplanes can use nearly all the same support equipment and Hangars

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2020 1:08 pm
by Noshow
In fact Airbus did plan and discuss the concept with airports and airlines well in advance. This is how they ended up with their 80 meters by 80 meters sizing and with very low noise emissions for LHR's night curfew. Fun fact: The A380 can be boarded and deboarded via stairs from the apron as well. No bridges needed triple or not.

The only specific airport equipment it needs are tow tractors capable of handling it's weight and upper deck catering trucks. It's not so much of a monster. Heavy twins put more weight/pressure on airport surfaces.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:20 pm
by Vladex
PITingres wrote:
Vladex wrote:
... Bear in mind that electric cars will make transportation so cheap that regional flying will be under big pressure. ...


Huh??? What are you calling "regional", and what on earth do electric cars have to do with it? In the US, I'd say that any flight shorter than maybe 250 miles is more likely to be driven than flown, but that has everything to do with time and nothing to do with driving costs.


Let's say regional is 500km/300 miles and many airlines are making money on it as there is less competition, at least here in Canada. Air Canada is charging at least 250$ return to Montreal/Ottawa/Windsor whereas with a typical gasoline car it's 150$ return but with Tesla EV and all the charging even in a supercharger it's about 40$ return. EV is just cheaper enough to make the decision so easy to take a car despite the speed but also considering other issues.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:35 pm
by Vladex
strfyr51 wrote:
Vladex wrote:
filipinoavgeek wrote:
Aviation seems to be doing just fine right now with the 787/777/A350 though.


Not at all if you live in reality today and are not listening to dead end legacy airlines and quick money investors and not only because of Corona Virus and various wars and political conflicts , Loads of airlines lost money (Norwegian, Etihad, Qatar and Chinese) and were flying on empty because of over the top and misguided expansion as they bought and flew supposedly low risk airplanes without branding and long term plans in the wrong geographical areas. It makes psychological sense that doing conscious low risk in one area will push high risk in other areas. Besides the expansion is vastly in the A321NEO market and tiny bit in the wide body market. A321 NEO is even less risk than the wide body which makes sense with the big recent orders however narrow body create lots of issues by themselves.

But long term, those types airplanes have no potential and they will start to create problems and they are not an easy recipe for making money per se. They lack ground clearance for future engines (5-10 years from now) and electrification whenever it comes (in 20 years at least) will only be feasible on an airplane with the most efficient engine and the biggest size which makes dual deck airplanes inevitable. Bear in mind that electric cars will make transportation so cheap that regional flying will be under big pressure. I haven't even mentioned the airport size growth and delays that will be inherent with ever more narrow bodies. These are some of the reasons why double decks are the future of aviation if aviation has much of a future at all.

the A380 failed because the premise that built it was flawed, Airbus built that airplane to defeat the 747. An airplane that was already in it's operating decline. they built an airplane that needed Airport modifications to operate. And worse than that? They sold the airplane to a Status Hungry second rate carrier. who was attempting to bully the world into making room for them, They did operate but? In many places? They weren't even Welcome. LH flew the A380 and they were welcome when they came to My home town Airport, And we were happy to see them. But we were happy to see them because they were a good airline and good neighbors. They had built a great relationship already, Emirates on the other hand? were NOT so welcome and theyt tried to Bully and Cajole to get what they wanted. And they didn't put a damn dime nor take a damn dime from anybody in their coming or Not coming aside from them being Underhanded. Airbus had to supply emergency equipment and even regular maintenance equipment for them in the USA because Nobody was going to Buy any for an airplane they weren't gop of thosing to fly in the USA. United and Delta flew the 747-400 so they had facilities that fit the 747. But Airbus never thought of that in building the A380. And? t date there are very few facilities in the USA where an A380 may be jacked safely. They may have to make adjustments as well for the 777-300. the 777X-8 and -9 and even the 787-10 and the A350-1000 though I'd bet the whole group of those airplanes can use nearly all the same support equipment and Hangars


747 was long outdated (no FBW, very limited upper deck, limited ground clearance) so it's not comparable.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:27 pm
by aeropix
Noshow wrote:
Fun fact: The A380 can be boarded and deboarded via stairs from the apron as well. No bridges needed triple or not.

The only specific airport equipment it needs are tow tractors capable of handling it's weight and upper deck catering trucks.


AHHHH! That is absolutely NOT what airbus said to LAX during the world tour before the first deliveries! In a minor political scandal the airframe bypassed LAX during the A380 world tour because LAX was "Not A380 Ready". LAWA refused to foot the bill for the 3rd Jetway installations after having already to modify every fillet on every taxiway at great expense and hence was judged by Airbus as "Not Ready".

Airbus repeatedly stamped any airport around the world without a 3rd Jetway as "Not A380 Ready" in order to push this agenda. So it is with great irony that I see so many A380 being boarded with airstairs (on the lower deck only) after all the drama and fuss they made in the 2000's about "no being A380 ready" and unworthy of even a visit to the airport if their was no 3rd bridge.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:01 pm
by Vladex
By the way, what about all the airport expansions and new airports in Istanbul and Beijing that are now totally empty and losing big money? And what about if Heathrow built a 3rd runway now by demolishing hundreds of houses?

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Fri Mar 20, 2020 1:40 am
by Vladex
Will A380 make a miracle comeback amid the virus outbreak?

Now that virus, government and lack of money has grounded almost every airplane out there and many airlines will go out of business or will take years to recover and/or be replaced, this is a turning point. Also the deliveries will come very much down if not completely stop due to lack of money and passengers .To compound even more effect, oil prices have come down even faster going down more than double in just a month, touching 20$ per barrel drowning out any engine inefficiencies.

Airbus was planing to replace A380 with even more A320/1 NEO from a giant Lagardère plant but that may be superfluous now since China, USA and Europe are in heavy recession to say the least and it's not clear what will happen with and/or after US3 and EU3 China3, Nonetheless, just a few weeks ago , Airbus started to assemble the last of A380's for Emirates and the stream is drying out but what happens if the entire sea is dry and there are no new orders and a trickle of deliveries here and there?

In that case, Airbus may have no choice but to restart A380 by whatever cost along with Emirates at least until the next engine cycle. Emirates and Singapore are surely not going out of business and they may come out of this the least damaged and victorious due to their high efficiency, branding and airport quality from a city state hub. Also anti A380 club is really damaged so they will not complain like they did for the last 20 years. I can see EK converting that A350 to A380 again until the Superfan or whatever new engine comes along.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:53 am
by TTailedTiger
Vladex wrote:
Will A380 make a miracle comeback amid the virus outbreak?

Now that virus, government and lack of money has grounded almost every airplane out there and many airlines will go out of business or will take years to recover and/or be replaced, this is a turning point. Also the deliveries will come very much down if not completely stop due to lack of money and passengers .To compound even more effect, oil prices have come down even faster going down more than double in just a month, touching 20$ per barrel drowning out any engine inefficiencies.

Airbus was planing to replace A380 with even more A320/1 NEO from a giant Lagardère plant but that may be superfluous now since China, USA and Europe are in heavy recession to say the least and it's not clear what will happen with and/or after US3 and EU3 China3, Nonetheless, just a few weeks ago , Airbus started to assemble the last of A380's for Emirates and the stream is drying out but what happens if the entire sea is dry and there are no new orders and a trickle of deliveries here and there?

In that case, Airbus may have no choice but to restart A380 by whatever cost along with Emirates at least until the next engine cycle. Emirates and Singapore are surely not going out of business and they may come out of this the least damaged and victorious due to their high efficiency, branding and airport quality from a city state hub. Also anti A380 club is really damaged so they will not complain like they did for the last 20 years. I can see EK converting that A350 to A380 again until the Superfan or whatever new engine comes along.


What in the world?

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:44 am
by exFWAOONW
Vladex wrote:
Will A380 make a miracle comeback amid the virus outbreak?

Now that virus, government and lack of money has grounded almost every airplane out there and many airlines will go out of business or will take years to recover and/or be replaced, this is a turning point. Also the deliveries will come very much down if not completely stop due to lack of money and passengers .To compound even more effect, oil prices have come down even faster going down more than double in just a month, touching 20$ per barrel drowning out any engine inefficiencies.

Airbus was planing to replace A380 with even more A320/1 NEO from a giant Lagardère plant but that may be superfluous now since China, USA and Europe are in heavy recession to say the least and it's not clear what will happen with and/or after US3 and EU3 China3, Nonetheless, just a few weeks ago , Airbus started to assemble the last of A380's for Emirates and the stream is drying out but what happens if the entire sea is dry and there are no new orders and a trickle of deliveries here and there?

In that case, Airbus may have no choice but to restart A380 by whatever cost along with Emirates at least until the next engine cycle. Emirates and Singapore are surely not going out of business and they may come out of this the least damaged and victorious due to their high efficiency, branding and airport quality from a city state hub. Also anti A380 club is really damaged so they will not complain like they did for the last 20 years. I can see EK converting that A350 to A380 again until the Superfan or whatever new engine comes along.

And you accused Jay of being a troll for Boeing?? :rotfl:

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 8:16 pm
by Vladex
exFWAOONW wrote:
Vladex wrote:
Will A380 make a miracle comeback amid the virus outbreak?

Now that virus, government and lack of money has grounded almost every airplane out there and many airlines will go out of business or will take years to recover and/or be replaced, this is a turning point. Also the deliveries will come very much down if not completely stop due to lack of money and passengers .To compound even more effect, oil prices have come down even faster going down more than double in just a month, touching 20$ per barrel drowning out any engine inefficiencies.

Airbus was planing to replace A380 with even more A320/1 NEO from a giant Lagardère plant but that may be superfluous now since China, USA and Europe are in heavy recession to say the least and it's not clear what will happen with and/or after US3 and EU3 China3, Nonetheless, just a few weeks ago , Airbus started to assemble the last of A380's for Emirates and the stream is drying out but what happens if the entire sea is dry and there are no new orders and a trickle of deliveries here and there?

In that case, Airbus may have no choice but to restart A380 by whatever cost along with Emirates at least until the next engine cycle. Emirates and Singapore are surely not going out of business and they may come out of this the least damaged and victorious due to their high efficiency, branding and airport quality from a city state hub. Also anti A380 club is really damaged so they will not complain like they did for the last 20 years. I can see EK converting that A350 to A380 again until the Superfan or whatever new engine comes along.

And you accused Jay of being a troll for Boeing?? :rotfl:


Are you speaking for Jay in Kitsap and what does that have to with the topic? BTW Kitsap is across the water from Renton and Everett and I think Jay has other problems now than about feuding with someone on an internet forum assuming he works at Boeing.

TTailedTiger wrote:
Vladex wrote:
Will A380 make a miracle comeback amid the virus outbreak?

Now that virus, government and lack of money has grounded almost every airplane out there and many airlines will go out of business or will take years to recover and/or be replaced, this is a turning point. Also the deliveries will come very much down if not completely stop due to lack of money and passengers .To compound even more effect, oil prices have come down even faster going down more than double in just a month, touching 20$ per barrel drowning out any engine inefficiencies.

Airbus was planing to replace A380 with even more A320/1 NEO from a giant Lagardère plant but that may be superfluous now since China, USA and Europe are in heavy recession to say the least and it's not clear what will happen with and/or after US3 and EU3 China3, Nonetheless, just a few weeks ago , Airbus started to assemble the last of A380's for Emirates and the stream is drying out but what happens if the entire sea is dry and there are no new orders and a trickle of deliveries here and there?

In that case, Airbus may have no choice but to restart A380 by whatever cost along with Emirates at least until the next engine cycle. Emirates and Singapore are surely not going out of business and they may come out of this the least damaged and victorious due to their high efficiency, branding and airport quality from a city state hub. Also anti A380 club is really damaged so they will not complain like they did for the last 20 years. I can see EK converting that A350 to A380 again until the Superfan or whatever new engine comes along.


What in the world?


Like I said it's a miracle but it seems to be lined up

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 2:10 am
by JayinKitsap
Vladex wrote:
exFWAOONW wrote:
Vladex wrote:
Will A380 make a miracle comeback amid the virus outbreak?

Now that virus, government and lack of money has grounded almost every airplane out there and many airlines will go out of business or will take years to recover and/or be replaced, this is a turning point. Also the deliveries will come very much down if not completely stop due to lack of money and passengers .To compound even more effect, oil prices have come down even faster going down more than double in just a month, touching 20$ per barrel drowning out any engine inefficiencies.

Airbus was planing to replace A380 with even more A320/1 NEO from a giant Lagardère plant but that may be superfluous now since China, USA and Europe are in heavy recession to say the least and it's not clear what will happen with and/or after US3 and EU3 China3, Nonetheless, just a few weeks ago , Airbus started to assemble the last of A380's for Emirates and the stream is drying out but what happens if the entire sea is dry and there are no new orders and a trickle of deliveries here and there?

In that case, Airbus may have no choice but to restart A380 by whatever cost along with Emirates at least until the next engine cycle. Emirates and Singapore are surely not going out of business and they may come out of this the least damaged and victorious due to their high efficiency, branding and airport quality from a city state hub. Also anti A380 club is really damaged so they will not complain like they did for the last 20 years. I can see EK converting that A350 to A380 again until the Superfan or whatever new engine comes along.

And you accused Jay of being a troll for Boeing?? :rotfl:


Are you speaking for Jay in Kitsap and what does that have to with the topic? BTW Kitsap is across the water from Renton and Everett and I think Jay has other problems now than about feuding with someone on an internet forum assuming he works at Boeing.


Yes Kitsap is across the 'pond' from Everett and Renton, but I do not work for Boeing. I am a Consulting Engineer in the Building Construction industry, done a number of projects over the years at Boeing, as well as the paper mills, data centers, warehouses, and government projects. Boeing's faceplant may affect my business by 5%.

You called me a Boeing Troll on a post where I complimented both the 787 and the A350, thank you for my first time being called such.

BTW - there are a lot of very sophisticated airline managers out there, EK was the only one to place a follow on order for the A380 after having planes in service and almost no orders over the last decade. Technically a decent plane, but its economics just crater if not full, and those economics were challenged hard by the 77W. From a market standpoint somewhere between #fail and #epic fail. Possibly 20+ years from now there will be a new clean sheet larger than the 779.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 10:22 am
by Zkpilot
With the way aviation is cratering right now, it's possible the only airlines still flying the A380 in a years time will be EK (and limited numbers of them at that) and maybe BA.
SQ doesn't need them, QF was already planning to get rid of them in less than a decade (possibly immediately now), LH is struggling, as is KE and pretty much everyone else.
Only reason for BA to keep them is how slot constrained LHR and some of the US airports are.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:28 am
by strfyr51
Vladex wrote:
JayinKitsap wrote:
The 747's were bought as much for their range as capacity. The analysts missed on separating the effects of this in the market. Actually there are relatively few city pairs that needs larger than the 779 serves well. For decades the 747 churned out 40 to 50 per year, now it will be the 779 churning out at that rate. Just below it capability wise is the A350 and B787, so a lot of choices to best match routes for profitability.

In 30 years, the world will have adapted to a route system that does not require VLAs.


You are such a Boeing troll , I hope you get paid at least. It's not an insult , more like a badge of honor .

Non VLA do offer range and even capacity to an extent but they do take lots of slots and lots of gates and space including in the air and thus produce lots of delays and I assume more costs. Also they seem very limited in the ground clearance for new engines and they seem space limited for future electric battery designs whenever they come. If there is no VLA then aviation itself will shrivel down to irrelevance

Now you KNOW that's not true the A380 suffered from one thing. It was a "status symbol"! FEDEX and UPS waned the airplane and would have put it over the top had Airbus decided to build it as a freighter as well. they placed the cockpit low for some reason and negated the possibility of a "Whale Shark" front door That airplane was a cargo hailer Dream. and just like the 747-8 would be in service the next 30 years doing valuable work.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2020 9:01 am
by Strato2
JayinKitsap wrote:
The 747's were bought as much for their range as capacity. The analysts missed on separating the effects of this in the market. Actually there are relatively few city pairs that needs larger than the 779 serves well. For decades the 747 churned out 40 to 50 per year, now it will be the 779 churning out at that rate. Just below it capability wise is the A350 and B787, so a lot of choices to best match routes for profitability.

In 30 years, the world will have adapted to a route system that does not require VLAs.


The 777X will not be churned out for decades at 40 to 50 a year. It is DOA especially after this Corona mayhem is over. The 777X is a VLA and not needed.

Re: The future of A380-capable gates

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2020 11:15 am
by Starlionblue
strfyr51 wrote:
Vladex wrote:
JayinKitsap wrote:
The 747's were bought as much for their range as capacity. The analysts missed on separating the effects of this in the market. Actually there are relatively few city pairs that needs larger than the 779 serves well. For decades the 747 churned out 40 to 50 per year, now it will be the 779 churning out at that rate. Just below it capability wise is the A350 and B787, so a lot of choices to best match routes for profitability.

In 30 years, the world will have adapted to a route system that does not require VLAs.


You are such a Boeing troll , I hope you get paid at least. It's not an insult , more like a badge of honor .

Non VLA do offer range and even capacity to an extent but they do take lots of slots and lots of gates and space including in the air and thus produce lots of delays and I assume more costs. Also they seem very limited in the ground clearance for new engines and they seem space limited for future electric battery designs whenever they come. If there is no VLA then aviation itself will shrivel down to irrelevance

Now you KNOW that's not true the A380 suffered from one thing. It was a "status symbol"! FEDEX and UPS waned the airplane and would have put it over the top had Airbus decided to build it as a freighter as well. they placed the cockpit low for some reason and negated the possibility of a "Whale Shark" front door That airplane was a cargo hailer Dream. and just like the 747-8 would be in service the next 30 years doing valuable work.


It was decent as a package freighter. As a pure freighter it was not that ideal. Floor loading and general arrangement was heavily geared towards high passenger count. By contrast, the 747 was planned as a freighter from the start, since it was going to be replaced by SSTs. Or at least... so they thought...