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acavpics
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Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:44 am

The Trent 800 obviously did very well on older models (-200, -200ER, 300). In fact, it did way better than the GE90 on those models. Why did RR give up on making engines for newer 777s?

Is there a possibility that in the future, they would make an engine variant for the 777X?
 
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Starlionblue
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:48 am

IIRC, GE negotiated an exclusive on supplying engines for the -200LR and -300ER. And I think the same arrangement applies for the -8 and -9.

Given the astronomical development cost, this was probably a good idea from a risk perspective.
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ALTF4
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:22 am

All of the competing manufacturers for the 300ER and 200LR requested or agreed that whoever won the contract would be the sole supplier, due to the (I think) development costs associated with the increased performance.
The above post is my opinion. Don't like it? Don't read it.
 
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zeke
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:24 am

Starlionblue wrote:
IIRC, GE negotiated an exclusive on supplying engines for the -200LR and -300ER. And I think the same arrangement applies for the -8 and -9.

Given the astronomical development cost, this was probably a good idea from a risk perspective.


If my memory serves GE paid Boeing around 100 million fir the exclusive rights.
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surrodox2001
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:31 am

FYI: RR did make an engine for the 2nd generation 777s.

It's called Trent 8104 (104000lbs thrust?) and made 110000lbs in testing. Making it close to the GE90-110/115s.
But GE came and take all the money away and airlines only have GE on offer.
 
trex8
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Sun Apr 12, 2020 11:19 pm

Boeing wanted the engine OEMs to invest into the 77W/LR program to get exclusivity, GE agreed, Rolls walked.
 
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CCA
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Mon Apr 13, 2020 6:19 am

RR has exclusivity with the A350 a sign of the time perhaps.
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trex8
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Tue Apr 14, 2020 12:39 am

CCA wrote:
RR has exclusivity with the A350 a sign of the time perhaps.

Only because GE, which was launch engine for the original Mk1 A350 (pre XWB), refused to provide something for the A350-1000
 
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MoKa777
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:46 pm

surrodox2001 wrote:
FYI: RR did make an engine for the 2nd generation 777s.

It's called Trent 8104 (104000lbs thrust?) and made 110000lbs in testing. Making it close to the GE90-110/115s.
But GE came and take all the money away and airlines only have GE on offer.


That is a fantastic article! Thank you for sharing
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Stitch
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Wed Apr 15, 2020 7:21 pm

Boeing requested RFPs from all three 777 engine OEMs on both the LR777 (777-200LR / 777-300ER) and 777X programs.

Due to the projected small sales of the LR777 family ( in hindsight, I can only :rotfl: ), both GE and P&W pushed Boeing for engine exclusivity. Rolls-Royce was willing to share the market, but they had RLI from the UK so that might have played a role in their magnanimousness. :silly:

I imagine Pratt's RFP was never seriously considered due to the PW409x series issues with NOx and fuel burn, so that really left GE and RR. GE had spent a fortune on the GE90 (as it was arguably the only "new" design - RR and PW went with scaled-up derivatives of existing engines for the PW4090 and Trent 800) and had not seen the return on the investment so the head of GE Aero Engines (James McNerney) worked a deal with Boeing that they would invest in the LR777 program for exclusivity and Boeing agreed. At the time, Cathay and American were the only two RR 777 operators who publicly resisted a GE-only option, but both eventually came around and did order the 777-300ER.

As for the 777X, again, Pratt's GTF proposal was considered too risky so they were eliminated in the first round, leaving just RR and GE. I imagine GE's long tenure on the LR777 program and the commonality between the GE90 and GE9X helped push Boeing to choose them over the RR RB3025 (which was a more 'clean-sheet' design than the GE9X).
 
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777GE90
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Re: Why did Rolls Royce stop making engines for the 777?

Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:13 pm

Can't beat them GE90's
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