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gdavis003
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Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:35 am

I know that freighters like say a UPS 767 for example carry ULDs in the main cargo area of the plane that are loaded on via the lift. However, what do planes like these carry in the belly of the airplane? Since the ULDs do not fit down there, is it just loose items? When I have seen cargo freighters being unloaded, the ground crew usually attaches a belt loader or two to the belly of the aircraft it looks like, but I have never been able to see what sorts of items are loaded in the belly. Is it high-priority medical equipment? Next-day mail? Just a question out of curiosity. TIA
 
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Starlionblue
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:45 am

The 767 do load ULDs in the belly. The LD2, LD4 and LD8. They're just smaller than the ULDs that can fit larger aircraft. Whatever is loaded in the containers varies widely.

Belt loading is used on all large aircraft to some degree. The bulk hold in the back is not suited for containers due to its shape, so stuff is loaded piece by piece.

Image
Source: https://www.anacargo.jp/en/int/specific ... 6_300.html
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
gdavis003
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:48 am

Starlionblue wrote:
The 767 do load ULDs in the belly. The LD2, LD4 and LD8. They're just smaller than the ULDs that can fit larger aircraft. Whatever is loaded in the containers varies widely.

Belt loading is used on all large aircraft to some degree. The bulk hold in the back is not suited for containers due to its shape, so stuff is loaded piece by piece.

Image
Source: https://www.anacargo.jp/en/int/specific ... 6_300.html


I see, so what about on a more narrow aircraft like a 757F that FedEx flies? Do those have the ability to hold ULDs in the belly as well?
 
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Starlionblue
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:53 am

gdavis003 wrote:
Starlionblue wrote:
The 767 do load ULDs in the belly. The LD2, LD4 and LD8. They're just smaller than the ULDs that can fit larger aircraft. Whatever is loaded in the containers varies widely.

Belt loading is used on all large aircraft to some degree. The bulk hold in the back is not suited for containers due to its shape, so stuff is loaded piece by piece.

Image
Source: https://www.anacargo.jp/en/int/specific ... 6_300.html


I see, so what about on a more narrow aircraft like a 757F that FedEx flies? Do those have the ability to hold ULDs in the belly as well?


The 757 cannot. The A320 series can. The 737 cannot.

There's a comprehensive compatibility table on the Wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_load ... patibility
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
gdavis003
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 4:53 am

Starlionblue wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
Starlionblue wrote:
The 767 do load ULDs in the belly. The LD2, LD4 and LD8. They're just smaller than the ULDs that can fit larger aircraft. Whatever is loaded in the containers varies widely.

Belt loading is used on all large aircraft to some degree. The bulk hold in the back is not suited for containers due to its shape, so stuff is loaded piece by piece.

Image
Source: https://www.anacargo.jp/en/int/specific ... 6_300.html


I see, so what about on a more narrow aircraft like a 757F that FedEx flies? Do those have the ability to hold ULDs in the belly as well?


The 757 cannot. The A320 series can. The 737 cannot.

There's a comprehensive compatibility table on the Wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_load ... patibility


Got it. Makes more sense now. So then for a 757 or 737 that cannot carry ULD's in the belly, for a freighter version, what sort of loose items are stored below? Is there any sort of rhyme or reason as to what is stored in the belly, not in a ULD, since the belly is not carrying passenger luggage?
 
RJMAZ
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:18 am

I'm fairly certain the 757 and 737 freighters do not hand load the belly. They do not fit the same containers as the A320 family but there are other ways to transport cargo.
 
mmo
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:39 am

On the 747 family, the LD can be loaded with cans or pallets. Generally, it is pallets since the cans tend to get loaded on pax aircraft, but you can mix and match. I have noticed that pallets would get loaded in one compartment and cans in another assuming the CG can be maintained. But, you can also load pallets on a pax aircraft in the LD.
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fr8mech
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:11 pm

UPS B757 pits are bulk loaded. What is carried down there? Same stuff that’s carried topside, except that it isn’t containerized. Some odd shaped pieces (irregs) may be easier to bulk load than putting them in a container.

Also, all of the aircraft have a bulk compartment where pieces are hand loaded.
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FGITD
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:22 pm

Perhaps someone with more experience can give more info, but I've seen various cargo carriers with different uses for the bulk loaded areas. Some use it for rush cargo, some for odd size/weights, and some just use it for whatever doesn't fit in a container. Whether that be due to late arrival at the facility, or any of a variety of reasons.

Pax airlines use the bulk compartment similarly. Sometimes a few pieces of cargo, oversize bags, late connecting bags, priority bags, animals, etc. Most of them use it for whatever they need unless there's a specific load (usually animals) that need the space.

That said, loading up a 75 can be a miserable affair.
 
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fr8mech
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:40 pm

FGITD wrote:
Perhaps someone with more experience can give more info, but I've seen various cargo carriers with different uses for the bulk loaded areas. Some use it for rush cargo, some for odd size/weights, and some just use it for whatever doesn't fit in a container. Whether that be due to late arrival at the facility, or any of a variety of reasons.


That’s exactly what the bulk pit is used for. Occasionally, crew bags will go in the bulk pit if there are jumps eaters and the captain decides the bags can’t be secured properly.
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strfyr51
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Fri Apr 24, 2020 9:26 pm

RJMAZ wrote:
I'm fairly certain the 757 and 737 freighters do not hand load the belly. They do not fit the same containers as the A320 family but there are other ways to transport cargo.

I'm certain the 757 freighters are hand loaded. I know of a lot of 737's and 757's that have articulating loading systems in the lower holds to allow them to be bulk loaded by 2 guys per pit. We used them at United and when we sold airplanes? The "Magic Carpet Loading system wen't with them. The system is really easy to maintain and simple tp use.
 
gregorygoodwin
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Re: Belly Cargo on Freighter Question

Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:36 am

At FedEx, our 757 lower cargo bays are hand loaded. On the inside of the lower cargo bay there is no motorized loading system or rollers, its just a flat aluminum paneled floor. As I now work in the aircraft structures shop, we frequently have to repair punctures in the floor panels caused by loading operations. Many years ago, I worked as a handler/loader in San Antonio, TX and we loaded the 727 lower bays by hand also. They also had no rollers or motorized loading system in the lower bays. A belt loader was positioned at the door with a person stacking cargo on the belt while another person was in the bay and would push the cargo to the back and work forward until the cargo was all loaded or the bay filled to capacity. If you were the guy in the cargo bay, you had to hustle to keep up. Brutal work in the Texas summer heat. You usually could not tell what the item you were loading was, it was just a bunch of boxes and sometimes bags. On the 757 the aft bay extends all the way to the back. On our MD's, A300's, and 767's, there is a forward,center and aft or bulk cargo bay. The aft bay is hand loaded, it is just a flat paneled floor. When I loaded cargo at SAT,we would get a Airbus A300 early in the morning that frequently had the aft or bulk cargo bay loaded with bags that had locks and security devices on them. This was cash going to one of the federal reserve banks along with bonds and other financial instruments. A armored truck would show up with armed guards to collect the cargo. FedEx moves a lot of cash and valuables on some of it's flights.

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