Moderators: richierich, ua900, hOMSaR

 
seagulls2020
Topic Author
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu May 21, 2020 9:54 pm

Widebody supersonic airliners

Mon May 25, 2020 10:36 am

To make supersonic air travel more economical, would it be possible to make future SST's widebodies with at least 7 economy seats abreast along with modern efficiency cruise technology to lower operating costs comparable to a conventional airliner such as a Boeing 78

Which airlines would operate such aircrafts?
 
Airliner1973
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:48 am

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Mon May 25, 2020 11:03 am

As far as I have understood the issue has more to do with the sonic boom which prohibits SST's to fly faster than the speed of sound in the vicinity of land (or populated area's). So, as long as that is not 'fixed' I don't see any SST flying any time soon . . .
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 19871
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Mon May 25, 2020 11:50 am

There are plenty of routes that are almost entirely over water.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
mxaxai
Posts: 1758
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 7:29 am

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Mon May 25, 2020 12:51 pm

There's two key problems with large SST's IMHO:
1) Wave drag (aerodynamic drag generated by supersonic flow) increases with the thickness of an object. So the optimum diameter-to-length ratio increases; most supersonic aircraft feature this needle-like appearance.
2) Reducing costs is great, but does it get cheap enough to attract enough passengers? That's one of the problems of the A380, it had the lowest cost per seat of any long haul aircraft (except the 777X) but selling enough tickets requires even lower prices.

There's also the general problem of SST's that supersonic wings don't work well for subsonic flight, and subsonic wings are unusable for supersonic flight. Which means that flying long segments subsonic is inefficient compared to regular aircraft, but more importantly requires high takeoff/landing speeds and long runways. You can get around this - partially - by adding thrust, or using variable geometry wings, but a subsonic SST will never match the performance of a regular subsonic aircraft.
 
seagulls2020
Topic Author
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu May 21, 2020 9:54 pm

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Mon May 25, 2020 7:45 pm

To get over this the plane should have a flatter design and variable wing sweep for better performance is sub/supersonic flight, like in the Boeing 2707 but is 10 economy seats abreast. Imagine even putting a 747-style hump on this futuristic skyship.

Fuel efficiency is important in operating costs. The SST's should possibly be twinjet or trijet as 4 engine planes are failing these days.

Noise can be managed by 21st century aerodynamics along with more streamlined skin of aircraft, possibly inspired of shark skin, like in some car concepts.
 
744SPX
Posts: 197
Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2020 6:20 pm

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Mon May 25, 2020 9:54 pm

The 2707 was twin aisle 7 abreast and seated 300 in its swing-wing guise...
 
TonyClifton
Posts: 139
Joined: Thu May 14, 2020 3:19 pm

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Thu May 28, 2020 7:20 pm

seagulls2020 wrote:
To get over this the plane should have a flatter design and variable wing sweep for better performance is sub/supersonic flight, like in the Boeing 2707 but is 10 economy seats abreast. Imagine even putting a 747-style hump on this futuristic skyship.

Fuel efficiency is important in operating costs. The SST's should possibly be twinjet or trijet as 4 engine planes are failing these days.

Noise can be managed by 21st century aerodynamics along with more streamlined skin of aircraft, possibly inspired of shark skin, like in some car concepts.

Variable sweep does have aerodynamic advantages, but it massively massively increases weight, complexity, and cost. See how the 2707 morphed from the -200 to the -300 due to those exact issues. Certainly modern technology would better solve some of the associated issues, but it would still be a huge expense on an airline expensive frame.
 
rlwynn
Posts: 1485
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2000 3:35 am

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Fri May 29, 2020 4:34 am

Flatter does mean thinner. People still need to stand up and things still need to go in the bottom. The whole thing just gets larger.
I can drive faster than you
 
User avatar
Stitch
Posts: 27034
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 4:26 am

Re: Widebody supersonic airliners

Fri May 29, 2020 8:40 pm

744SPX wrote:
The 2707 was twin aisle 7 abreast and seated 300 in its swing-wing guise...


In general, the configuration was 2+2 in First and 3+3 in Tourist, but Boeing did also study an "Alternate Body Configuration" for the 2707-100 which became, I believe, standard on the 2707-200 which increased the diameter of the fuselage 12 inches at the maximum cross section area which allowed eight rows of 2+2+2 in Tourist forward of Door 2 and 10 rows of 2+3+2 aft of Door 2 which then became 2+2+2 until the aft fuselage where it was again 3+3.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: airtechy, ROSSIGNOL, tnair1974 and 13 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos