Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
Sdmccray1984
Topic Author
Posts: 71
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:07 am

Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sun Dec 06, 2020 12:47 am

With the recent announcement of AA’s PVG service from Sea-Tac, as well as AA’s decision to route all PVG stuff through there instead of DFW, I’m wondering how common it is for airlines to run connections through non-hub cities. And can it be advantageous to plan connections in that way (LGA to PHX via RDU because I hate JFK)? Your thoughts...
 
Cubsrule
Posts: 15158
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 12:13 pm

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sun Dec 06, 2020 2:48 am

Connections at outstations aren’t a huge deal, and in the States WN sells connections at some pretty small stations. I’ve connected at WN stations as small as CLE.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
Woodreau
Posts: 2077
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2001 6:44 am

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sun Dec 06, 2020 3:25 am

That’s kind of normal if you’re trying to nonrev on AA between DFW and ORD precovid.

DFW to OKC/DSM/STL/MCI/ICT/TUL/XNA/COU/IAH/AUS/SAT to ORD or vice versa.

Much easier to do than DFW - ORD direct.

Though the Texas outstations of IAH/AUS/SAT could be harder than just going to ORD directly.
Bonus animus sit, ab experientia. Quod salvatum fuerit de malis usu venit judicium.
 
User avatar
YQBexYHZBGM
Posts: 286
Joined: Sun May 10, 2009 3:11 pm

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sat May 01, 2021 2:30 am

Woodreau wrote:
That’s kind of normal if you’re trying to nonrev on AA between DFW and ORD precovid.
DFW to OKC/DSM/STL/MCI/ICT/TUL/XNA/COU/IAH/AUS/SAT to ORD or vice versa.
Much easier to do than DFW - ORD direct.
Though the Texas outstations of IAH/AUS/SAT could be harder than just going to ORD directly.

This is an essential strategy for nonrev travel on any airline's network if load factors are high at your departure airport. The objective then becomes to keep moving and avoid being left behind. Get on any flight that has seats available in the direction of travel, provided the destination airport also has flights to one of the airline's other hubs.

As far as airlines planning a long-haul point-to-point flight to connect to their network through a station other than one of their major hubs, it can be a primarily geographic decision, as AA's SEA-PVG demonstrates. The potential market x-PVG is so large that the only real consideration is to provide a connection to AA's network anywhere it makes sense. Geographic proximity to Asian destinations vs. AA's hubs, and the availability of onward flights to other points in AA's network make SEA an obvious choice, even though they will face competition for origin/destination market share.

A different example was AC's YHZ-BDA nonstop flight, which operated for over 30 years but has since been dropped. While the economic and educational ties established by this route remain to some degree, the connection now must be made via YYZ, which is a considerable detour.
 
dstblj52
Posts: 672
Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:38 pm

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sun May 02, 2021 4:43 am

ish but in this case given the alaska code share this is sort of a hub route right
 
User avatar
TWA772LR
Posts: 7646
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:12 am

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sat May 08, 2021 6:22 am

I've been nonreving for 22 out of 28 years and I can attest that Woodreau is correct. I've done quite a few weird routings to get home. I even considered flying SFO-LHR-IAH since I couldn't get literally anywhere out of SFO as a nonrev coming back from ICN. On my last big trip just before covid my backup plan was to do DEN-RIC and drive to IAD to get to TLV because DEN-IAD didn't look so hot. But I lucked out with the nonstop.
When wasn't America great?


The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and are not influenced by my employer.
 
FlyHossD
Posts: 2185
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:45 pm

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sun May 09, 2021 10:41 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
I've been nonreving for 22 out of 28 years and I can attest that Woodreau is correct. I've done quite a few weird routings to get home. I even considered flying SFO-LHR-IAH since I couldn't get literally anywhere out of SFO as a nonrev coming back from ICN. On my last big trip just before covid my backup plan was to do DEN-RIC and drive to IAD to get to TLV because DEN-IAD didn't look so hot. But I lucked out with the nonstop.


Flexibility was - is - the key when non-revving. I remember using TYS a few times to get from IAH to EWR and back. Used PIT for that trip once, too.

EDIT: Just remembered, I used LAS once for that commute as well.
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
User avatar
TWA772LR
Posts: 7646
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:12 am

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Sun May 09, 2021 10:51 pm

FlyHossD wrote:
TWA772LR wrote:
I've been nonreving for 22 out of 28 years and I can attest that Woodreau is correct. I've done quite a few weird routings to get home. I even considered flying SFO-LHR-IAH since I couldn't get literally anywhere out of SFO as a nonrev coming back from ICN. On my last big trip just before covid my backup plan was to do DEN-RIC and drive to IAD to get to TLV because DEN-IAD didn't look so hot. But I lucked out with the nonstop.


Flexibility was - is - the key when non-revving. I remember using TYS a few times to get from IAH to EWR and back. Used PIT for that trip once, too.

EDIT: Just remembered, I used LAS once for that commute as well.

Yep. I've done a few connections in OKC between IAH and DEN. Also did DEN-ELP on UA and ELP-DAL on WN for a weekend during my WN internship.
When wasn't America great?


The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and are not influenced by my employer.
 
phllax
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 6:53 am

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Mon May 10, 2021 5:52 pm

Not only that, if you're flying hub-hub, and the flight is oversold, if you know the non-hub stations which are good, the gate agents will generally help you out if you volunteer. Pre-merger, UA served MSY non-stop from all of the hubs. I was doing ORD-LAX semi-frquently, and one day we were over, and she had nothing to LA non-stop the rest of the day. I asked about connecting in MSY, and sure enough, plenty of room. She wrote it down in her "Book of Tricks" for future need.
 
iuwnaa
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2016 3:19 pm

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Fri May 21, 2021 8:44 pm

Have been non-revving for 30+ years. Some "memorable" itineraries would include:
HNL-NRT-ORD
HKG-GUM-HNL-ORD
BOS-YYZ-DFW
LAX-EWR-DTW-ORD
HNL-EWR-MKE-Amtrak-Metra
DFW-MKE-MKG-APN and return, with a 3 minute connection in MKG
...and numerous examples of a "detour" on a hub-to-hub route. The best of these are when you can find a routing with the same aircraft all the way through. Guaranteed connection and often very confused Flight Attendants! ("Didn't you just get off?")
 
AntonioMartin
Posts: 859
Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:58 am

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Mon May 24, 2021 11:08 am

Woodreau wrote:
That’s kind of normal if you’re trying to nonrev on AA between DFW and ORD precovid.

DFW to OKC/DSM/STL/MCI/ICT/TUL/XNA/COU/IAH/AUS/SAT to ORD or vice versa.

Much easier to do than DFW - ORD direct.

Though the Texas outstations of IAH/AUS/SAT could be harder than just going to ORD directly.

You know I once bought a Sega Genesis Airline game (for $2 at Blockbuster!!!!) that had among its rules that you could only start flights from a hub...being about 22 at the time and really a kid I 1) did not know what a hub was and 2) began to think that is how it really was....after starting my timetable collection about a year later and seeing how, for example 80 percent of Delta's flights took off or landed at Atlanta and so on....

But it's kinda normal to be rerouted through hubs (versus flying non-hub to non-hub) isnt it? In fact, of my 14 flights, none have been using non-hubs purely IIRC.
 
Okie
Posts: 4249
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2003 11:30 am

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Mon May 24, 2021 11:48 am

Sort of off topic

Is Non-Rev considered in passenger counts for airport traffic?


Okie
 
SaschaYHZ
Posts: 278
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 4:41 pm

Re: Non-hub airports as connecting points

Tue May 25, 2021 9:21 am

I've connected quite a bit through various non-hub airports non-reving. And some small airports at that. I've done things such as YUL-YSJ-YHZ for example...anything to make it home!

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: classicjets, Tartarus and 15 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos