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Tristarsteve wrote:Modern jet airliners do not have an anti ice system on the tailplane.
Hot air deicing of the stabilisers was present on some 1960 jet aircraft, but not fitted to large jet transports today.
XLA2008 wrote:Tristarsteve wrote:Modern jet airliners do not have an anti ice system on the tailplane.
Hot air deicing of the stabilisers was present on some 1960 jet aircraft, but not fitted to large jet transports today.
Then what is the metal leading edge on the tail for? And back to the original question why is it some airlines have it and others don’t, and is it an option to omit it from the A350 or is it a permanent fixture?
As far as I was aware the metal leading edge was heated to prevent ice build up, and with Airbus some come with it some don’t and others are painted… but again ultimate question is that is this an option for the A350 to paint it or not have it?
Velocirapture wrote:XLA2008 wrote:Tristarsteve wrote:Modern jet airliners do not have an anti ice system on the tailplane.
Hot air deicing of the stabilisers was present on some 1960 jet aircraft, but not fitted to large jet transports today.
Then what is the metal leading edge on the tail for? And back to the original question why is it some airlines have it and others don’t, and is it an option to omit it from the A350 or is it a permanent fixture?
As far as I was aware the metal leading edge was heated to prevent ice build up, and with Airbus some come with it some don’t and others are painted… but again ultimate question is that is this an option for the A350 to paint it or not have it?
The metal strip is unpainted as an abrasion response. That is, the leading edge of the horizontal tail is occasionally subject to abrasion, especially frozen precipitation kicked up from the main landing gear, so not painting it prevents the paint from being removed or worn off.
Of the Boeing aircraft I've flown - 727, 737, 757/767 and 777 - none had anti-icing or de-icing features on the tail, as I recall. Also, IIRC, when Boeing designed the 777, it didn't have wing anti-ice either. However, the launch customers insisted on it, so the middle leading edge devices are heated. You can tell which ones they are by locating the vent holes underneath that allow the hot air to escape.
XLA2008 wrote:Perhaps it's to do with the fact that the tailplanes are carbon fibre and this is a metallic protection strip against any impacts?Velocirapture wrote:XLA2008 wrote:
Then what is the metal leading edge on the tail for? And back to the original question why is it some airlines have it and others don’t, and is it an option to omit it from the A350 or is it a permanent fixture?
As far as I was aware the metal leading edge was heated to prevent ice build up, and with Airbus some come with it some don’t and others are painted… but again ultimate question is that is this an option for the A350 to paint it or not have it?
The metal strip is unpainted as an abrasion response. That is, the leading edge of the horizontal tail is occasionally subject to abrasion, especially frozen precipitation kicked up from the main landing gear, so not painting it prevents the paint from being removed or worn off.
Of the Boeing aircraft I've flown - 727, 737, 757/767 and 777 - none had anti-icing or de-icing features on the tail, as I recall. Also, IIRC, when Boeing designed the 777, it didn't have wing anti-ice either. However, the launch customers insisted on it, so the middle leading edge devices are heated. You can tell which ones they are by locating the vent holes underneath that allow the hot air to escape.
So of Airbus like I said some 320/330/380 etc operators have either not had that metal strip installed or they have painted it and this includes the newer generation of NEO’s, but yet to see an A350 without it, so wasn’t sure if it was just something airlines have not done yet or chosen not to do, or if because it’s a clean sheet design that it is standard and can’t be removed or painted, that’s pretty much the question.
ReverseFlow wrote:XLA2008 wrote:Perhaps it's to do with the fact that the tailplanes are carbon fibre and this is a metallic protection strip against any impacts?Velocirapture wrote:
The metal strip is unpainted as an abrasion response. That is, the leading edge of the horizontal tail is occasionally subject to abrasion, especially frozen precipitation kicked up from the main landing gear, so not painting it prevents the paint from being removed or worn off.
Of the Boeing aircraft I've flown - 727, 737, 757/767 and 777 - none had anti-icing or de-icing features on the tail, as I recall. Also, IIRC, when Boeing designed the 777, it didn't have wing anti-ice either. However, the launch customers insisted on it, so the middle leading edge devices are heated. You can tell which ones they are by locating the vent holes underneath that allow the hot air to escape.
So of Airbus like I said some 320/330/380 etc operators have either not had that metal strip installed or they have painted it and this includes the newer generation of NEO’s, but yet to see an A350 without it, so wasn’t sure if it was just something airlines have not done yet or chosen not to do, or if because it’s a clean sheet design that it is standard and can’t be removed or painted, that’s pretty much the question.
XLA2008 wrote:ReverseFlow wrote:XLA2008 wrote:Perhaps it's to do with the fact that the tailplanes are carbon fibre and this is a metallic protection strip against any impacts?
So of Airbus like I said some 320/330/380 etc operators have either not had that metal strip installed or they have painted it and this includes the newer generation of NEO’s, but yet to see an A350 without it, so wasn’t sure if it was just something airlines have not done yet or chosen not to do, or if because it’s a clean sheet design that it is standard and can’t be removed or painted, that’s pretty much the question.
Well and I initially thought perhaps this may be the case but isn’t the A380 tail carbon fiber? And some of them don’t have the metal leading edge to it. Lol feel like a lot of people are getting stuck on the anti ice thing. I understand now it isn’t anti ice… Probably the metal leading edge is just to protect the tail from impacts, but still doesn’t answer the actual question… why do some airlines have it on their Airbus fleet and some don’t? And is it an option to not have on the A350?
ReverseFlow wrote:None of the Airbusses have tailplane anti-ice.
All have wing and nacelle anti-ice.
As on the 777, the A380 wasn't supposed to have wing anti-ice. But iirc the authorities insisted on it and there is anti-ice between the engines on the leading edge.
AirKevin wrote:ReverseFlow wrote:None of the Airbusses have tailplane anti-ice.
All have wing and nacelle anti-ice.
As on the 777, the A380 wasn't supposed to have wing anti-ice. But iirc the authorities insisted on it and there is anti-ice between the engines on the leading edge.
Why wouldn't they have wing anti-ice.
N1120A wrote:AirKevin wrote:ReverseFlow wrote:None of the Airbusses have tailplane anti-ice.
All have wing and nacelle anti-ice.
As on the 777, the A380 wasn't supposed to have wing anti-ice. But iirc the authorities insisted on it and there is anti-ice between the engines on the leading edge.
Why wouldn't they have wing anti-ice.
They both have ridiculously big wings and the designs are not susceptible to ice build up.
Starlionblue wrote:Going back to the metal strip on the fin leading edge, I am fairly sure all A350s come with it. Some operators may just choose to paint it for aesthetics.
I can't think of any operators with the strip painted. Which ones are you thinking of?
battlegroup62 wrote:Starlionblue wrote:Going back to the metal strip on the fin leading edge, I am fairly sure all A350s come with it. Some operators may just choose to paint it for aesthetics.
I can't think of any operators with the strip painted. Which ones are you thinking of?
Since it is for erosion protection it is likely that they are painted from factory, but the paint erodes off so fast it is not worth trying to repaint.
deebee278 wrote:True, most airliners don't have tail deice. However, there is a major exception, the MD80.
GalaxyFlyer wrote:N1120A wrote:AirKevin wrote:Why wouldn't they have wing anti-ice.
They both have ridiculously big wings and the designs are not susceptible to ice build up.
To be fair, the A-10 wing wasn’t ridiculously big (fat, maybe); no anti-icing wings or engines and we’d fly around in the Northeast winters, ice building on the pylons, the stores, but wings stayed pretty clean. Beech Baron in those conditions might have a very different flight—I’ve been pretty scared in ice in a light twin with only boots.