The thread in Civ-Av re Ryanair ordering 150 737-10 threw up an interesting question regarding Ryanair's continued use of the 737's integrated stairs. My personal view is that FR will continue to order 737s with integrated stairs as long as they're available as an option, because of the way FR operates (not using air bridges).

I expressed an interest in understanding how much FR saves in costs by using integrated stairs at the front, given there must be some fuel burn/payload penalty to carrying them around, plus the maintenance costs associated with them. There were some widely varying posts on just how much the integrated stairs weigh.

Some questions:

Does anyone know definitively the weight of the whole system - stairs, hand rail, plus mechanics to deploy and retract.

Any idea of the cost as an option at time of ordering the 737?

How reliable are they in day to day operation - keeping in mind that every FR 737 uses them multiple times every day?

Are there any other airlines currently taking 737s that also have integrated stairs installed?

I think there was a post on here a while ago that discussed the costs incurred from the stairs, and it seems it isn't particularly significant, especially given the time and money saved by using them. They add about 200 pounds to the airplane, which is conveniently one passenger - so not much in the grand scheme of things.

N1120A wrote:

I think there was a post on here a while ago that discussed the costs incurred from the stairs, and it seems it isn't particularly significant, especially given the time and money saved by using them. They add about 200 pounds to the airplane, which is conveniently one passenger - so not much in the grand scheme of things.

I can't imagine it's 200 lbs. It's got to be hardy enough to support a few heavy people on it simultaneously, in windy conditions. And the machinery must add to the total weight as well. I'm thinking 300+ lbs minimum, though that's only a guess.

Western727 wrote:

N1120A wrote:

I think there was a post on here a while ago that discussed the costs incurred from the stairs, and it seems it isn't particularly significant, especially given the time and money saved by using them. They add about 200 pounds to the airplane, which is conveniently one passenger - so not much in the grand scheme of things.

I can't imagine it's 200 lbs. It's got to be hardy enough to support a few heavy people on it simultaneously, in windy conditions. And the machinery must add to the total weight as well. I'm thinking 300+ lbs minimum, though that's only a guess.

https://mentourpilot.com/built-in-airst ... have-them/

200 pounds. The owner of that site is a check captain for Ryanair.

N1120A wrote:

200 pounds. The owner of that site is a check captain for Ryanair.

200 pounds is the weight saved if the stairs are removed. Weight penalty to have stairs added would be somewhat more due to the door and associated mechanism.

scbriml wrote:

Some questions:

Does anyone know definitively the weight of the whole system - stairs, hand rail, plus mechanics to deploy and retract.

How reliable are they in day to day operation - keeping in mind that every FR 737 uses them multiple times every day?

scbrimi, re: question above "plus mechanics to deploy and retract."

At my company, airstair operation did not require a mechanic. The ground crew--not not necessarily a mechanic--i.e., aircraft marshaller, were all trained to operate the integral stairs from the exterior panel. In addition, the aircrew aboard the aircraft--flight attendants and pilots--could extend/retract the airstairs as well. We did this routinely, particularly on charters and aircraft ferry missions.

We used them frequently. They were reliable.

e38

MrHMSH wrote:

e38 wrote:

scbriml wrote:

Some questions:

Does anyone know definitively the weight of the whole system - stairs, hand rail, plus mechanics to deploy and retract.

How reliable are they in day to day operation - keeping in mind that every FR 737 uses them multiple times every day?

scbrimi, re: question above "plus mechanics to deploy and retract."

At my company, airstair operation did not require a mechanic. The ground crew--not not necessarily a mechanic--i.e., aircraft marshaller, were all trained to operate the integral stairs from the exterior panel. In addition, the aircrew aboard the aircraft--flight attendants and pilots--could extend/retract the airstairs as well. We did this routinely, particularly on charters and aircraft ferry missions.

We used them frequently. They were reliable.

e38

I think scbriml meant the mechanisms that actually extend/retract the stairs, not mechanics the people.

Indeed, that's what I meant. Sorry for any confusion.

It's a quite simple (almost clever) design for the retract and extend, basically a gear motor and some bicycle chain. The lower frame is at half speed and connected to the rails. When the lower frame hits its stop it's motion uses the railings as the link arms to lift and fold the stair. Maybe a couple of limit switches to ensure safety. After designing building aluminum stairs it would be hard to get to 200# for just the stairway, likely another 200# for the fixed rails, door closer, gear motors, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkpnTc4JEe4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ-6PDYRj80

JayinKitsap wrote:

It's a quite simple (almost clever) design for the retract and extend, basically a gear motor and some bicycle chain. The lower frame is at half speed and connected to the rails. When the lower frame hits its stop it's motion uses the railings as the link arms to lift and fold the stair. Maybe a couple of limit switches to ensure safety. After designing building aluminum stairs it would be hard to get to 200# for just the stairway, likely another 200# for the fixed rails, door closer, gear motors, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkpnTc4JEe4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ-6PDYRj80

It is a clever design I always thought to be pretty neat in concept and execution, rugged yet it tucks away neatly and doesn’t interfere in the normal use of jetways like on some regional types with drop down stairs integrated into the boarding door

Very useful !

The airstair (looking at you, CRJ) was a legacy of the Challenger from which it was designed. Originally, when planned as a small freighter for a Memphis-based company, the door was a upward clamshell with a ladder that slide from behind the pilot’s where it showed out of the way for loading. Well, they moved on to the 737 & 727 when the CAB was sunsetted. Now, a bizjet, the slide out ladder was decidedly out of place. So, on number 14, the original door was replaced as an airstair, most of the previous numbers were mod’d to the airstair. The original design, with a side opening door, might have been superior.

Airstairs work, but only Gulfstream has one that is truly comfortable for boarding—easy slope, wide, good hand rail.