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Topic Author
Posts: 330
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 5:48 am

Why No Start-up Control In US?

Tue Oct 22, 2002 7:52 pm

I??m just wondering why there is no start up control or something like that in the USA?
I think it is ridiculous just to start up your engine and taxi to the runway. This is stupid waste of fuel.

Just look at this picture:

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Photo © E. Seth Sterling

In Europe we always contact clearance delivery first and then start up control.

Can anyone explain that to me?
yes i can handle that alone. - - -famous last words
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RE: Why No Start-up Control In US?

Tue Oct 22, 2002 8:39 pm

Actually, most substantial stations will require a clearance to "push."

If you note the caption on the "example" you've posted, "A large dust storm had just blown through Phoenix"

In Phoenix, a "large dust storm" is a significant meteorological event, affecting traffic flow, just like any other WX.
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...

RE: Why No Start-up Control In US?

Wed Oct 23, 2002 2:29 pm

In the U.S. you can pretty much assume that you will get your clearance at whatever particular time you request. If there are airway saturation problems, weather delays, etc and they want to keep you on the ground you will be told to contract clearance delivery or ground control prior to engine start. It doesn't happen all that often - unless you frequent certain airports like SFO. (That seems to big the big one here on the west coast)


RE: Why No Start-up Control In US?

Wed Oct 23, 2002 4:18 pm

Um... Fly 8...

What your seeing there, as mentioned, are grounded aircraft due to adverse meteorological conditions. Their engines probably aren't running, and so, no, it is not a "stupid waist of fuel."

Topic Author
Posts: 330
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 5:48 am

RE: Why No Start-up Control In US?

Wed Oct 23, 2002 5:37 pm

Thank you guys for your replies.

I thought that it works like Jetguy explained. Well AA_Cam, those engines are running just think about it. In Europe it can happen that there are also aircafts waiting, but never more then 3 to 4. If there is one runway in use only every 30 to 50 seconds an aircraft gets the start up clearance. So it will never happen that there ar more then 3 to 4 aircrafts waiting at the runway with the engines running!
yes i can handle that alone. - - -famous last words

RE: Why No Start-up Control In US?

Thu Oct 24, 2002 5:36 am

There is in fact a "start-up" control in the US, but it is not on a dedicated or separate frequency, such as many European airports have...
Clearance delivery assumes that function... When you request your "airways clearance" on a "cpt frequency" (clearance prior taxi), you may be informed that there is a "gate hold", or a "slot time", or other restriction i.e. on flight levels available...
Recently, MIA told me, before issuing a clearance, that my FL 330 requested would be subject to some 30 minutes delay, but I could start immediately, if I could accept FL 290... if we say "negative" for FL 290, we stay on the frequency, and they would give us a call for "wheels up time"...
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RE: Why No Start-up Control In US?

Sun Oct 27, 2002 10:31 am

I've been stuck in similarly long queues during thunderstorms, and the pilots shut down the engines while waiting.

But of course, we are not as clever as the Europeans.

"In God we trust, everyone else bring data"

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