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LMP737
Topic Author
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Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Fri Jun 18, 2004 10:40 pm

The packs on the F100 start needing to be replaced. Once the temperature and humidity starts rising here in the mid west the F100 lives up to it's nickname, "The Dutch Oven". In the past week we have had two F100's go out of service for cracked heat exchangers. Anyone who has ever changed one knows that a pain the packs can be.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
AUAE
Posts: 292
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 4:41 am

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Fri Jun 18, 2004 10:49 pm

Does the F100 have a similar a/c layout to the M88 with it all in the tail? The C-5 had all its a/c equip in one area too, it was affectionately called the boiler room!  Smile
Air transport is just a glorified bus operation. -Michael O'Leary, Ryanair's chief executive
 
LMP737
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Posts: 6136
Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Fri Jun 18, 2004 11:24 pm

The packs on the F100 are in the nose, outboard and above the nose wheel well. Here's a picture, you can see the intake for the left hand pack in the position.



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Photo © Alex G.-Denicourt - Contrails Aviation Photography

Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
dl757md
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Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 9:32 am

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Fri Jun 18, 2004 11:46 pm

......when fuel tanks start leaking all the time.
......when tire changes outnumber upper management changes.
757 Most beautiful airliner in the sky!
 
AUAE
Posts: 292
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 4:41 am

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sat Jun 19, 2004 12:06 am

Thanks LPM737,

It is always interesting to look at how manufactures stuff all the systems into thier planes.

Shawn
Air transport is just a glorified bus operation. -Michael O'Leary, Ryanair's chief executive
 
cdfmxtech
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Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2000 11:37 am

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:13 am

...they start talking layoffs for the fall!
 
NKP S2
Posts: 1665
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 3:16 am

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sat Jun 19, 2004 10:45 am

Actually, I've found changing the pack units on the F100's not all that bad. Of course, we had the 2 spool packs while I've heard AA had 3 ( I've heard the 3 cools better ). Biggest pain IMO is just getting it on and off the mounts while struggling with the weight.

Since they don't put a lot of relative volume ( air wise ), they depend more on temperature...I've found 38 degrees to be the magic number for output. Any less...consider it acceptable. Any more...start troubleshooting. I know temp control valves were notorious for leaking hot air past the closed butterfly and downstream into the output. TBV's and rate control valves also caused their share of hot packs as I recall.

The biggest PIA in my experience was working on or changing other parts in the pack bays with the packs installed....very tight!

Still miss the damn things though............
 
LMP737
Topic Author
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Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sat Jun 19, 2004 11:02 am

One problem with the packs on the F100 is just getting to them. Just to access the pack you have to take off a panel with about 75 screws. Once you do get access it's a very tight fit. Unlike Boeing products which have latched panels and plenty of room to move around in.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
NKP S2
Posts: 1665
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 3:16 am

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sat Jun 19, 2004 11:22 am

Just to access the pack you have to take off a panel with about 75 screws

It's actually 82 screws...but who's counting? Smile

Unfortunately, since they are in a pressurized area, access panels are the way they are. I usuually try to avoid removing the big panel and try to work from the small oval hatch....until I get so pissed off I end up getting out the speed handle and start cranking.

I liked the F100....but not that part..........
 
LMP737
Topic Author
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RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sat Jun 19, 2004 9:37 pm

Even that small hatch can be a pain. You either can get it in on the first try or you end up fighting it for five to ten minutes.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
NKP S2
Posts: 1665
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 3:16 am

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sat Jun 19, 2004 10:50 pm

I agree about that hatch: It goes in only if you have the right facial expression...otherwise it's like trying to put a grapefruit through a doughnut hole.

One mod ( a couple really ) that was done in our Heavy Maint was adding two butterfly type outflow valves to the rear bulkhead that vented to the tailcone area: They opened if the throttles were closed and aided flow through for better ground cooling. Also replaced was the external pre-conditioned air connection; The "stock" one only admitted ground air through a 4 inch diameter opening, this was replaced by one more like the rest of the world uses. In fact, before this mod was done, if we wanted to cool the cabin in a hurry ( before taxiing a fixed A/C to the gate for a flight ) we'd just bring the PC air hose right in the cabin and blast it. Then we'd run the packs off the engines at such a speed just before TMSOV changeover to get the most air to the packs on the way over. Get it on the gate and get PC air on RIGHT NOW! If the plane was sitting all day in the sun ( in that dark paint ) it would be so hot that loading passengers would be undoable before pre-cooling. Dutch oven indeed.

Did AA planes have these mod already? I figured they might since they were somewhat newer.
 
LMP737
Topic Author
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Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:53 am

AA's F100's have the standard external pre-conditioned air hook up. As for the other mod my guess is that it does. I'll have to ask some of guys who have been working on the F100 longer about it to be sure.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
avioniker
Posts: 1100
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RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sun Jun 20, 2004 3:24 am

There's another startup getting ready to go out west and the owner was asking me if I thought the AA 100's would be a bargain way to get short haul aircraft for a reasonable price.
He'll never understand why I was rolling on the floor...
I'm sure you guys will all miss them in ORD  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
One may educate the ignorance from the unknowing but stupid is forever. Boswell; ca: 1533
 
LMP737
Topic Author
Posts: 6136
Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: AN A&P Knows It's Summer When...

Sun Jun 20, 2004 5:02 am

Avioniker:

If for some reason you did not particularly care for the guy you could have said "You know, buying used F100's would be a GREAT idea for a startup carrier." That's of course if you were able to keep a straight face.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.

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