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Cubsrule
Topic Author
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739ER Extra Exit Door

Thu May 01, 2008 3:26 pm

There were a couple of posts on this in the CivAv thread on 739ER deliveries, but I'm wondering if anyone here can shed more light on the way in which CO's 739ERs were modified to remove the extra door... could it be installed if CO sold the aircraft, for instance?
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tdscanuck
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Fri May 02, 2008 12:34 am



Quoting Cubsrule (Thread starter):
There were a couple of posts on this in the CivAv thread on 739ER deliveries, but I'm wondering if anyone here can shed more light on the way in which CO's 739ERs were modified to remove the extra door... could it be installed if CO sold the aircraft, for instance?

As far as I know, it's still there, it's just covered up by the interior sidewall.

Tom.
 
FlyHoss
Posts: 534
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Sun May 11, 2008 3:41 am



Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 1):


Quoting Cubsrule (Thread starter):
There were a couple of posts on this in the CivAv thread on 739ER deliveries, but I'm wondering if anyone here can shed more light on the way in which CO's 739ERs were modified to remove the extra door... could it be installed if CO sold the aircraft, for instance?

As far as I know, it's still there, it's just covered up by the interior sidewall.

Tom.

That's correct. The door is visible from outside the aircraft, though not surrounded by a painted contrasting border as are the (still) active doors or emergency exits.
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Cubsrule
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Mon May 12, 2008 1:28 pm



Quoting FlyHoss (Reply 2):
The door is visible from outside the aircraft, though not surrounded by a painted contrasting border as are the (still) active doors or emergency exits.

I assume there's no slide installed, though, right? It seems like it would be a m/x nightmare if there were.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
BrettFromCLT
Posts: 106
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Tue May 13, 2008 6:35 pm



Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 1):
As far as I know, it's still there, it's just covered up by the interior sidewall.

Tom.

True - and there are pictures of it active and plugged here:

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/737...ily/737-900ER/pdf/presentation.pdf

Brett
 
Cubsrule
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed May 14, 2008 12:35 am



Quoting BrettFromCLT (Reply 4):

True - and there are pictures of it active and plugged here:

Thanks... that whole presentation is pretty interesting reading. I wonder why CO plugged the door rather than just not having it installed (which was apparently an option).
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
Viscount724
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed May 14, 2008 12:55 am



Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 5):
I wonder why CO plugged the door rather than just not having it installed (which was apparently an option).

The exit door probably makes the aircraft more valuable when the time comes to sell it or return it to a lessor. It wouldn't be atractive to low cost or charter carriers since they can't make use of the higher seating capacity above 189 without the additional exit.
 
EMBQA
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed May 14, 2008 1:16 am



Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 3):

I assume there's no slide installed, though, right?

Overwing exits don't have slides.....
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Cubsrule
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed May 14, 2008 1:28 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 7):

Overwing exits don't have slides.....

The exit isn't over the wing


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miamiair
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed May 14, 2008 11:36 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 7):
Overwing exits don't have slides.....

Not on the 737, but the 767 has them.
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BrettFromCLT
Posts: 106
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed May 14, 2008 3:40 pm



Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 8):
The exit isn't over the wing

Right - the one that's plugged is behind the wing, ahead of the rear door - 11 windows from the rear door in this pic:


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Not sure if the activated door has a slide or not...
 
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flyingclrs727
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed May 14, 2008 6:37 pm



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 6):
The exit door probably makes the aircraft more valuable when the time comes to sell it or return it to a lessor. It wouldn't be atractive to low cost or charter carriers since they can't make use of the higher seating capacity above 189 without the additional exit.

CO has a plug where the door goes. It is replaceable with an emergency exit if another operator wants to put one there.
 
Viscount724
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Thu May 15, 2008 12:26 am



Quoting Flyingclrs727 (Reply 11):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 6):
The exit door probably makes the aircraft more valuable when the time comes to sell it or return it to a lessor. It wouldn't be attractive to low cost or charter carriers since they can't make use of the higher seating capacity above 189 without the additional exit.

CO has a plug where the door goes. It is replaceable with an emergency exit if another operator wants to put one there.

As a sidenote, this thread reminds me of the somewhat controversial action taken by a very few 747-100/200 operators in the mid-1980s when they de-activated the exit doors over the wings and installed additional seats in those areas, thus reducing the number of main deck exits from 8 to 6. The only carriers I can recall doing that were BA and KL but there may have been one or two others.

Although sealing up those doors apparently still complied with emergency evacuation regulations in effect then, there were a lot of comments that the doors were put there for a purpose and reducing the number of exits while at the same time increasing the number of seats seemed incompatible with the highest safety standards. It was a much longer trip to the nearest exit if you were seated in in the center part of the cabin. However I don't think BA or KL were ever required to reactivate those doors. They certainly didn't do that on their 744s.

I recall flying on a few of those BA 741/742s and KL 742s and there was no evidence that the doors existed inside the aircraft. They just installed the usual window panels, except of course there were several missing windows in that area. They were able to install about 4 more triple seat units on each side of the cabin.

Photos of the same BA 747-100 and KL 747-200 below before and after those doors were de-activated. In the second photo in each pair you can where the painted outline around the overwing door has been removed. (The first photo of the KL 742 is also before it had the stretched-upper deck conversion).


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Photo © Tim Rees



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Photo © Paul Kipping
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Photo © Greg George

 
jrheilig
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:38 pm

Does anyone happen to have a close-up photo showing the details of the outside of this door? I'm looking for details of the latch handle, port hole, etc.

Thanks!

JH
 
AirframeAS
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:13 pm



Quoting Jrheilig (Reply 13):
Does anyone happen to have a close-up photo showing the details of the outside of this door? I'm looking for details of the latch handle, port hole, etc.

They look pretty much the same as the rest of the entry doors, and operate the same.
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roseflyer
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:26 pm



Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 14):
They look pretty much the same as the rest of the entry doors, and operate the same.

No they don't operate like the rest of the doors. The mid cabin exit door rotates down. It's hinged at the bottom instead of the side like normal doors.

The slide on the mid cabin exit is also far steeper than the main door slides. The angle is very steep. I wouldn't want to jump out of it. One reason they can get away with that is that if the nose gear doesn't deploy, the exit door won't end up as high off the ground as the rear exit will, so the slide doesn't have to be as long.
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AJ
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Mon Jun 02, 2008 7:04 am



Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 12):
The only carriers I can recall doing that were BA and KL but there may have been one or two others.

Korean Air certainly operated a few 747-300s with doors 3 deactivated.
 
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LHRBFSTrident
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:03 am



Quoting AJ (Reply 16):
Korean Air certainly operated a few 747-300s with doors 3 deactivated.

...and CX - or is my memory faullty?

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 14):
rest of the entry doors, and operate the same.

Operates like a 757 rear emergency exit door, on 8-exit aircraft, IIRC
 
Viscount724
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RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:09 am



Quoting AJ (Reply 16):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 12):
The only carriers I can recall doing that were BA and KL but there may have been one or two others.

Korean Air certainly operated a few 747-300s with doors 3 deactivated.



Quoting LHRBFSTrident (Reply 17):
...and CX - or is my memory faullty?

Correct. It looks like CX did it on 742s and 743s and KE on 743s.

The same CX 742 (their first 747) before and after the doors were deactivated.


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CX and KE 743s with the doors deactivated.


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Photo © Michel Gilliand

 
jrheilig
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Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2006 11:38 am

RE: 739ER Extra Exit Door

Sat Jun 07, 2008 12:55 am

So my question stands: Anyone have a photo showing the external latch handle for that door on the 900ER??

Tks!

JH

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