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TheSonntag
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How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 2:40 pm

It was recently said here that airliners do not have any keys, because usually nobody could steal them anyway (lets not talk about that 727 that was stolen in Africa some time ago).

But how long does it take to get an airliner online and ready to takeoff, if we assume the plane has been sitting on the tarmac during the night. Lets assume two pilots enter the plane and want to "flee" from the airport, how long would it take for them to switch on everything, get engines running and start rolling for airplanes like a 737, 747 or A320?
 
FlyDeltaJets
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 3:32 pm

Well I know it takes about 5 min for the APU to get started and lets just say about another 5 for each engine. Thats about 10-15 minutes. 20 minutes later you should be airborne.
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Starlionblue
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 3:42 pm

AFAIK if you have an inertial guidance platform and it needs to be initialized it will take a bit longer.
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Goldenshield
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 3:45 pm



Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 2):
AFAIK if you have an inertial guidance platform and it needs to be initialized it will take a bit longer.

I could see legitimate companies doing that; however, for the purposes of this thread, I'm gonna play with VFR.  Wink

Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 1):
Well I know it takes about 5 min for the APU to get started and lets just say about another 5 for each engine. Thats about 10-15 minutes. 20 minutes later you should be airborne.

Assuming that you have the fuel aboard to go somewhere right away, and didn't need to be pushed out of a gate, and nothing is deferred that could hinder such a trial, then it would be closer to 10 minutes max. Two to get the APU up and running, 2 to start the engines, and then 3 more to warm them up on the way out to the runway if you really wanted to obey those limits.

Of course, that's in a perfect world. It could very well be done in that time if there was a crew doing it, but if it was done by one's self, then it would take a good deal longer while everything is prepared for the aircraft's departure.

[Edited 2008-05-09 08:49:13]
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Woodreau
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 3:50 pm

It really depends on the airplane, if you were looking at the absolute minimum - then it'll be the time it takes to get an engine started and taxiing towards a runway - you start the second one on the way to the runway.

Flying a 1900 - you could be airborne two minutes from initial engine start to takeoff.

A larger jet - I'd speculate that get the APU running - 2 minutes max - engine started - 2-3 minutes max - a few minutes more to power up to roll over the chocks - so 5 minutes to taxi (assuming your gyros will spin up within the 5 minute timeframe). But that is the absolute minimum - there are other considerations engine warm up - whether your aircraft is contaminated or not.
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DocLightning
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 3:55 pm

What about after a cold soak, like if a modern airliner (say an A340) sits out overnight without any power at ANC in December?
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readytotaxi
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 4:14 pm

Wot about the catering?
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SlamClick
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 4:25 pm



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 5):
at ANC in December?

Or someplace really cold, like MSP or GRB.


Talking about a need to be underway quickly and not a race just for the sake of speed. Most modern small airliners (737 or Airbus for example) I'd be very comfortable with 15 minutes. The IRS alignment from scratch could take about ten minutes and that would be the limiting factor because I would not want to be starting engines during the alignment. Alignment could be commenced maybe 2-3 minutes after I enter the flight deck. Time to establish battery power then start the APU and put its generator on line.

Both engines could then be started and by the time I taxi half a mile to the nearest runway they should be thermally stabilized. I've had plent of time to set up the cockpit, load the flight plan set my bugs and so forth during the alignment. This would be quick but not hurried.
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2H4
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 4:28 pm



Quoting SlamClick (Reply 7):
Talking about a need to be underway quickly and not a race just for the sake of speed.

Sounds good, but how would that process and time frame change if you were actually being fired upon and had to escape?  eyebrow 

2H4
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SlamClick
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 4:34 pm



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 8):
how would that process and time frame change if you were actually being fired upon and had to escape?

Well you asked the right person. About four and a half minutes. Night VMC all the way to the destination. That wasn't a jet, however, but a radial engine and the process was simplifed by the fact that I had no cockpit lighting other than the crewchief's flashlight. (That's torch to you Brits)

Slightly longer if you turn into a revetment instead of down the alleyway.  Smile
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BAE146QT
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 4:45 pm

If your aircraft - jet or otherwise - was under direct fire and you weren't under orders to high-tail it out of there, wouldn't you rather be anywhere else than in a big metal target loaded with fuel which likes to go bang?

I'm thinking maybe a civilian flight where things have just gone pear-shaped without a whole hell of a lot of warning. Columbo Sri Lanka, say, not Baghdad.

What would you do - risk departure under fire, or risk the evacuation?

Obviously I have our veterans in mind for this question, but surmises/opinions/wild guesses are welcome if only out of interest.
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2H4
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 4:49 pm



Quoting BAe146QT (Reply 10):
If your aircraft - jet or otherwise - was under direct fire and you weren't under orders to high-tail it out of there, wouldn't you rather be anywhere else than in a big metal target loaded with fuel which likes to go bang?

This thread doesn't care. It assumes you're trying to escape via your aircraft.  Wink

2H4
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wilco737
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 4:51 pm

From the moment we enter the cockpit until we start the engines I'd say roughly 15 minutes. The longest is the IRS (3 of them) who needs to be aligned which takes around 10 minutes. Then some other stuff to do, prepare the FMS, do some tests, start the APU (less than a minute) and each engine about 45 seconds (on the MD11)...

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BAE146QT
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 5:40 pm



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 11):
This thread doesn't care. It assumes you're trying to escape via your aircraft.

Ah yes, I see.

Well in that case, please to be fitting starter cartridges and RATOs.

Then I'm happy(ish).
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fr8mech
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri May 09, 2008 7:50 pm

Realistically? If you're not worried about navigation and checklists and a walk around. I can be taxiing a B757/B767, on 1 engine, inside of 5 minutes, easy.

Less than 1 minute for the APU. After I have APU air/electric, it would take me less than a minute to configure the flight deck for engine start and then "right to ground". Idle in less than a minute. Taxiing seconds after that. Second engine on the roll.

Now if you want the nav system up and running before takeoff...minmimum 10 minutes...during which you can start the engines. I don't recall if you can program the IRS while it is in align. You can't move the aircraft.
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kbfispotter
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 2:48 am

On a Dash 8-400, you can go from cold, dark flightdeck to engine start in about ten-15 minutes... It only takes about two minutes to power up the aircraft with the APU, even less if you have a GPU...

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FlyUSCG
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 3:02 am



Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 1):
Well I know it takes about 5 min for the APU to get started and lets just say about another 5 for each engine. Thats about 10-15 minutes. 20 minutes later you should be airborne.

And the Dash 8-100/300, maybe 30 seconds to get the APU running. Check your batt loads and start the engines. Each engine start takes maybe 40 seconds. Instrumentation takes maaaaybe 2 minutes to align. I'd say if your sitting at the end of the runway when the shit hits the fan and your already in the cockpit, you could be off the ground in 5 minutes.
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HAWK21M
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 4:13 am

Depending on the Aircraft type,presuming Fuel is adequate & Systems in place.Approx 15 mins should be ideal to start the APU,Engines & taxi out.
regds
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TheSonntag
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 8:39 am

Thank you all for your nice answers. Certainly a small Cessna is better to escape than a 737 then  Wink

During SAC times, the B-52s on ground were on a higher alert, so that this could be done faster, correct?
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 9:55 am



Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 18):
Thank you all for your nice answers. Certainly a small Cessna is better to escape than a 737 then

Thats true.Smaller the Aircraft,less complex is the procedures "normally"  Smile
In todays time,it would be very easy to trace a stolen aircraft,although there have been occasions to Africa which are not well covered.

regds
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Starlionblue
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 12:25 pm



Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 18):
. Certainly a small Cessna is better to escape than a 737 then

Just for the first few minutes. Then the lower speeds are a bit of a liability.  Wink
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planenutok
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 1:40 pm

Our crews can get a CRJ from cold and dark to ready for taxi in less than 10 minutes following the checklist. Our ERJs take a little longer as there is a requirement to let the apu run for 3 minutes before opening the bleeds on them.
 
SlamClick
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat May 10, 2008 3:33 pm



Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 18):
During SAC times, the B-52s on ground were on a higher alert, so that this could be done faster, correct?

If I'm not mistaken they kept the alert aircraft "cocked" which is to say as many systems and controls readied short of putting power on the airplane.

In flight training one of my instructors had been a SAC B-47 pilot and one day he showed us the checklist for that airplane. It started "The Day Before the Flight" The SCRAMBLE checklist was somewhat shorter!
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ajd1992
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sun May 11, 2008 12:08 am

PA-38 can be done (sans walkaround) in about 2 minutes. I can be airborne in 3. With a walkaround, it'd take around 15 minutes, i'd guess. More if it needed fueling.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sun May 11, 2008 12:40 am



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 8):

Sounds good, but how would that process and time frame change if you were actually being fired upon and had to escape?   

Ask Hillary. She's an expert.  duck   Wink

In all seriousness, have you ever watched an airliner take off? Just the takeoff roll lasts a good 30-60 seconds and then there's the climbout. Seeing as how a blown tire is enough to bugger a takeoff, even a half-arsed group of guerrillas could have a plane down before you could even start to taxi.

Now, if there was civil unrest and you weren't being fired upon yet, 15 minutes might be enough time.

Quoting Readytotaxi (Reply 6):
Wot about the catering?
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ex52tech
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sun May 11, 2008 4:52 am

I keep seeing 15 minutes.

With a 727 once the battery is on, and you hit the start switch for the APU, you can have air and elect. power in about 1 minute. You could have an engine up and running in less than a minute, epically a -15, or -17 powered aircraft, crank the other two engines while you are taxiing to takeoff, I have started two engines at the same time on a 727 while bleeding air off of the running engine. We regularly started 6 engines at the same time on a B52 using bleed air off of #4, and #5 engines.....nothing to it. Might as well use the taxi way to takeoff since you are in a hurry anyway. INS, IRU, or whatever you are equipped with would be the biggest snag that I can think of.

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 22):
If I'm not mistaken they kept the alert aircraft "cocked" which is to say as many systems and controls readied short of putting power on the airplane.

Yes.....it was termed "cocked on", and with eight cartridges installed, you could have all eight running in under 30 seconds.
Not all systems were in a power on configuration though, you could take a generator or CSD shaft right off with the sudden loading, saw that happen enough on just a normal aircraft generation.
"Cold soaked" you might not get all engines to idle, and you need some warm up time on the CSDs, or you will not have any power, shears the shaft quite often. The alert airplanes were fueled so they could takeoff on 6 engines if need be.
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tdscanuck
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sun May 11, 2008 5:52 am



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 5):
What about after a cold soak, like if a modern airliner (say an A340) sits out overnight without any power at ANC in December?

Not really a big deal. The APU has to be able to start cold soaked at altitude, which is a lot worse than on the ground, so it really doesn't care.

Tom.
 
airbuster
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sun May 11, 2008 7:55 am

VIVA AHRS!

cut's down all that IRS time guys! i'll be out and away before any of you!

btw, if you have enough bleed, is it not possible to start 2 engines at the same time? that is of course not obeying start limitations.....

rgds

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ex52tech
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 12:13 am



Quoting Airbuster (Reply 27):
btw, if you have enough bleed, is it not possible to start 2 engines at the same time? that is of course not obeying start limitations.....

Yes, it is possible, and no start limits are exceeded. One would obviously have to be above idle with the engine that one would be using as the bleed air source. It is not a standard or commonly practiced event, but it is possible with no harm done. I have been able to do it on 707s, DC10s, 727s, B52s....almost every time we started all eight engines.
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SlamClick
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 12:57 am



Quoting Airbuster (Reply 27):
is it not possible to start 2 engines at the same time?



Quoting Ex52tech (Reply 28):
Yes, it is possible, and no start limits are exceeded.

ONLY IF the start switch does not have to be selected to one specific engine at a time.
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57AZ
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 2:10 am

Modern turbo props and high performance piston twins can be started in less than one minute.
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MQTmxguy
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 3:00 am

ERJ: I'm thinking with 2 people you could be in the air in less than 10 minutes if you were really motivated to do so. Jump in the cockpit, flip the batt and avionics switches, start the APU (while your doing that the AHRS will align). Now by the checklist you need to wait 3 minutes before opening the APU bleed, however there's no real reason you couldn't open it once it APU stabilizes in an emergency (angry militant hippies, Independence Day style alien attack). At this point your about 2 minutes in, another 2 minutes to get the first engine started and stable. Now about another 3 minutes to taxi to your runway while starting the other engine. At about 7 or 8 minutes in you should be at the runway with both engines turning and stable and the aircraft set in take off configuration, plus another minute for your take off roll and you should be airborne. This sequence forgoes alot of ops checks, safety checks, FMS programming, and anything else not crucial to making the plane fly
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flyboyseven
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 5:29 am

I can get on the runway and ready to take off with a walkaround and all the checks in about 45 seconds. That is however in a glider so it doesnt count in this thread.  Smile

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Scooter01
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 6:14 am



Quoting TheSonntag (Thread starter):
for airplanes like a 737, 747 or A320?



Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 3):
and didn't need to be pushed out of a gate

-then you would also need somebody on the ground to remove the red "REMOVE BEFORE FLIGHT" pins/flags and push away the stairs you used to get into the plane, unless you used a ladder you could kick away yourself, -far enough that it would not get ingested in an engine or damage a tire if you'd taxi over it....  duck 

Scooter01
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MQTmxguy
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 6:26 am



Quoting Scooter01 (Reply 33):
-then you would also need somebody on the ground to remove the red "REMOVE BEFORE FLIGHT" pins/flags

Idk about you but I'd quickly do that BEFORE I got in the plane

Quoting Scooter01 (Reply 33):
unless you used a ladder you could kick away yourself, -far enough that it would not get ingested in an engine or damage a tire if you'd taxi over it....

...or just pull it in the plane with you
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Scooter01
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 7:17 am



Quoting MQTmxguy (Reply 34):
...or just pull it in the plane with you

Like this would be nice...

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Chris Sheldon



Scooter01
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2H4
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 4:22 pm

Flightglobal had this to say about the Pilatus PC-12s start-up procedure:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The before engine-start checks took just seconds to complete and consisted essentially of turning the batteries and fuel pumps on and pressing the engine-start button (there are no first-flight-of-day checks and most other test functions are automated).

Light up was instant, the condition lever was placed to ground idle, the flaps set to 15° and the stall warning system tested - and that was it.

We were ready to taxi, with after-start and before-taxi checks complete, fully configured and fully programmed, less than 60s after pushing the engine-start button. On other turboprops, first-flight-of-day checks can take over 60min to complete.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2H4
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A10WARTHOG
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 6:34 pm



Quoting MQTmxguy (Reply 31):
ERJ: I'm thinking with 2 people you could be in the air in less than 10 minutes if you were really motivated to do so. Jump in the cockpit, flip the batt and avionics switches, start the APU (while your doing that the AHRS will align).

Now grated I was not taking an airplane, but was trying to get a plane to the gate when one went tech on us. from BATT on to taxi, it only took me about five minutes. Now granted my right seater knew what was going on and we both knew the checklist like the back of our hand.AHRS is what we normally had to wait on. AHRS 900 normally took five minutes to align, if you are not moving when you turn the BATTS on. AHRS 800 around 90 second.
 
twal1011727
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Mon May 12, 2008 10:05 pm



Quoting Ex52tech (Reply 25):
With a 727 once the battery is on, and you hit the start switch for the APU, you can have air and elect. power in about 1 minute. You could have an engine up and running in less than a minute

If you are trying to **** STEAL ***** a B727, you can have the APU up and running in less than 30 seconds
and 3 engines up and running roughly in 1.5 minutes after APU start.
The B727s didn't have a timer for APU air(unless modified like the MD80s)
so once on-speed - elect and air was immediate.
If you don't give a hoot about checklists and warm ups, you can have it ready for takeoff (runway end) in less than 5 minutes...less if your already at or near the end.

If your doing it by the book and take into consideration all the airline and manufacturer recommendations, then the average is about 10-20 (maybe 30) minutes.

KD
 
miamiair
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Tue May 13, 2008 10:31 am

And...


Hope there are no red "X's" in the logbook!
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josekmlb
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:19 am

So will we be seeing a plane gone missing overnight some time in the near future????
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri Jun 06, 2008 7:53 am



Quoting Scooter01 (Reply 33):
-then you would also need somebody on the ground to remove the red "REMOVE BEFORE FLIGHT" pins/flags and push away the stairs you used to get into the plane, unless you used a ladder you could kick away yourself, -far enough that it would not get ingested in an engine or damage a tire if you'd taxi over it.... duck

Scooter01

Some planes, among then the 747, the DC-10, the MD-11, the A300 (A330, A340) and some A320s and B767 (and I assume the B777 as well), have backdoors for those in the know, to get straight from the ground through the avionics compartment into the cockpit. No external stairs required.
I remember a MNG cargo A300B4, which had a flying spanner on board. He would walk the plane out and, on the taxiway, after engine start, he would use the built-in ladder to climb up from the ground into the E/E bay to get into the cockpit. At another time I have seen a pilot, who was late for his deadheading connection, to climb on the rood of the pushback truck, and from there into the E/E bay (the jetway was already pulled).

I have used the backdoors many times to get into a 747 or MD-11, when I was alone and couldn't be bothered to push a heavy stair to the plane.

Jan
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BAE146QT
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:00 pm



Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 18):
Thank you all for your nice answers. Certainly a small Cessna is better to escape than a 737 then



Quoting JoseKMLB (Reply 40):
So will we be seeing a plane gone missing overnight some time in the near future????

I have been keeping an eye on the news for a missing 727 since the day he posted!  Wink
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HAWK21M
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:40 am



Quoting BAe146QT (Reply 42):
Quoting JoseKMLB (Reply 40):
So will we be seeing a plane gone missing overnight some time in the near future????

I have been keeping an eye on the news for a missing 727 since the day he posted!

Most likely to be traced in todays times.

regds
MEL
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MD11Engineer
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sun Jun 08, 2008 10:12 am



Quoting TWAL1011727 (Reply 38):
Quoting Ex52tech (Reply 25):
With a 727 once the battery is on, and you hit the start switch for the APU, you can have air and elect. power in about 1 minute. You could have an engine up and running in less than a minute

If you are trying to **** STEAL ***** a B727, you can have the APU up and running in less than 30 seconds
and 3 engines up and running roughly in 1.5 minutes after APU start.
The B727s didn't have a timer for APU air(unless modified like the MD80s)
so once on-speed - elect and air was immediate.
If you don't give a hoot about checklists and warm ups, you can have it ready for takeoff (runway end) in less than 5 minutes...less if your already at or near the end.

If your doing it by the book and take into consideration all the airline and manufacturer recommendations, then the average is about 10-20 (maybe 30) minutes.

KD

Not just this: Our 727s had a certified GPS, but no IRS, so there were no gyros to align.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
opso1
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:30 am

In a "survival scramble" situation, if the airfield or aircraft is under attack, you'd be amazed how fast you can get a cold aircraft off the ground when you need to!

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aogdesk
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Tue Jun 10, 2008 12:47 pm

And of course, all of us are wondering at this point what type of aircraft will you choose when you finally "flee" from the airport of your choosing?  Smile
 
wn700driver
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat Jun 14, 2008 7:22 am



Quote:
Well you asked the right person. About four and a half minutes. Night VMC all the way to the destination. That wasn't a jet, however, but a radial engine and the process was simplifed by the fact that I had no cockpit lighting other than the crewchief's flashlight. (That's torch to you Brits)

Sounds like quite the adventure. I have ZERO experience with radials, so pardon my ignorance, but did you all have to turn the prop? I've heard that hydraulic lock can be quite the b!tch with those bottom cylinders.

Also, just out of curiosity, how is the torque on one of those? My very limited experience (recip & t-prop only for actual flying) has shown me quite well how hairy things can get if you get behind on that left-turning tendency. I can only imagine what it might be like to have 9 or more cyls also adding their forces (compression and weight) to the mix. All the same, I've always wanted to try a radial out. . . oh well.
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Soku39
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat Jun 14, 2008 5:25 pm



Quoting Wn700driver (Reply 47):
I can only imagine what it might be like to have 9 or more cyls also adding their forces

I'm thinking it might not be as bad as you think, since all the cylinders are arranged in a circle everything might be completely equal? Except of course for the propellers themselves.
The Ohio Player
 
BAE146QT
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RE: How Long Does It Take To Switch On A Plane?

Sat Jun 14, 2008 6:11 pm



Quoting Wn700driver (Reply 47):
...pardon my ignorance, but did you all have to turn the prop? I've heard that hydraulic lock can be quite the b!tch with those bottom cylinders.

I've seen big radials started without some poor sap pulling on a prop, so I assumed that no, it didn't need to be turned by hand. There should be some big-ass high-torque electric motor doing it. And whaddaya know, for once an assumption was right. I used the terms 'Double Wasp Starter Motor' in Google and found that yes, they had a battery-operated starter that spun them up.

This makes perfect sense of course - have a look at a B-36 and ask yourself how easy it would be to start a 19-foot prop by hand...

Here's a nice little link showing all the bits and bobs with a picture of an accessory box that's larger than a breadbin;

http://www.enginehistory.org/accessories.htm

You know, I think the phrase;

Quote:
Combination Direct Cranking Electric And Inertia Starter With Integral Solenoid Engaging Device


...is sexier than, "I'm bored - go get the video camera". But then I'm wonky like that.

P.s. Here's a lovely potted history of the Double Wasp, for anyone who hasn't seen it;

http://www.aviation-history.com/engines/pr-2800.htm
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