Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
Quoting NW747-400 (Thread starter): Just curious if any airlines out there allow their first officers to taxi aircraft that are equipped with a tiller on both sides of the flight deck. I'm specifically referring to jet transport aircraft, not turboprop/pistons. This is a random thought that popped into my head today, and I thought "who better to ask than the Airliners community?" |
Quoting Vmcavmcg (Reply 1): There are several that allow FOs to taxi. When I flew for a large well known SE Asian carrier, headquarters located in a well known city-state, our SOP was when it was the FO as the PF, he did all the preflight, start, taxi and taxi in. However, he could not park the aircraft. The rationale was most optic guidance systems were set up for the LHS. |
Quoting pilotpip (Reply 5): The KLM way sounds beyond dangerous to me. At a time when workload (and accident rate) are high, they are diverting attention from the task at hand to switch seats? Sorry, but swiveling a little tiller around isn't that important to me. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 3): BA uses the non-sensical 'role reversal' method of operation, and this time, it nearly led to a serious accident. |
Quoting readytotaxi (Reply 8): How does F/O learn this skill? Is it done in simulator or ground practice with empty plane? |
Quoting 411A (Reply 3): However, this does have a downside when, as happened recently at a Caribbean airport, the First Officer taxied the airplane for an intersection departure (mistake one), then the Captain did not notice (mistake two) and then during the takeoff roll, the Captain noticed not much runway remaining (mistake three)...and the airplane became airbourne just shortly before the runway end. |
Quoting readytotaxi (Reply 8): How does F/O learn this skill? |
Quoting SB (Reply 12): My personal opinion is that not allowing the FO to taxi is just silly. |
Quoting CX Flyboy (Reply 14): Wouldn't it be silly if a 10 year+ veteran of the airline did his/her command course and had no clue how to taxi properly. |
Quoting CosmicCruiser (Reply 16): such as breaking action |
Quoting stratosphere (Reply 2): Don't know if they still do it but I saw a video of KLM MD-11 who had the f/o sit in the capt seat during pushback, start, and taxi to the runway where they then would switch seats with the capt. Don't know if thats a regular practice though. |
Quoting charliecossie (Reply 18): What on earth are you dribbling about? LHR 777 brilliant airmanship. JNB 747 brilliant airmanship. Perhaps you know about something else? |
Quoting charliecossie (Reply 18): Perhaps you know about something else? |
Quoting 411A (Reply 21): Caribbean airport, a BA777 lined up for takeoff at the wrong interesction, and just got airbourne at the end. The Captain is now a First Officer. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 23): Yes, as regards to intersection departures (when the entire runway length is available)...we don't do any. As I'm the ops director, I set the policy. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 21): Two, recently, one I witnessed personally. |
Quoting charliecossie (Reply 26): How many planes you got? |
Quoting 411A (Reply 27): Intersection departures...NEVER an especially good idea with a heavy jet airplane. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 27): t wasn't such a good choice for a Kalitta B747 not long ago...they departed from B3 as well |
Quoting 411A (Reply 27): It wasn't such a good choice for a Kalitta B747 not long ago...they departed from B3 as well...and overran the runway end during a rejected takeoff, and busted the airplane into three pieces. Intersection departures...NEVER an especially good idea with a heavy jet airplane. Smaller (commuter) jets/turbopropeller types, maybe OK, depending. Heavy jets? Sorry, BAD idea. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 27): I have found that many younger pilots have a very minimal understanding of jet aircraft runway performance. Too bad for them. |
Quoting Vmcavmcg (Reply 30): Doesn't your job include passing along experiences to younger pilots so they don't make the same mistakes we have made and seen? |
Quoting 411A (Reply 23): Quoting Max Q (Reply 22): Are you and the other Pilots there faultless ? Yes, as regards to intersection departures (when the entire runway length is available)...we don't do any. As I'm the ops director, I set the policy. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 34): If you don't like my answers, don't ask the question. A simple concept to understand. |
Quoting Vmcavmcg (Reply 30): So, I am still at a loss as to why it's not a good idea. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 38): Again, if you don't like my answer, don't ask the question. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 38): Simply because, should you have an overrun, for whatever reason, the board of inquiry will undoubtedly ask...'excuse me Captain, but just why did you not use the full length of the runway for takeoff, as it certainly was available?' |
Quoting 411A (Reply 38): You, as the not-so-bright Captain would likely be (and most certainly should be) shown the door and told to not let it slap you on the backside on the way out. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 38): .'excuse me Captain, but just why did you not use the full length of the runway for takeoff, as it certainly was available?' |
Quoting 411A (Reply 38): There would likely be no reasonable answer. None. |
Quoting Vmcavmcg (Reply 40): It's not that I don't like the answer. It's just that I think you are wrong! |
Quoting Vmcavmcg (Reply 40): Would love to see you in action in the cockpit |
Quoting 411A (Reply 43): |
Quoting 411A (Reply 43): At three airlines where I worked, one of them now the largest in SE Asia, |
Quoting 411A (Reply 43): You would be welcome anytime. Who knows...perhaps you might actually learn something new. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 32): You would suppose wrongly. One of the primary reasons that we reject intersection departures is so that we can use the maximum engine derate possible. |
Quoting 411A (Reply 46): Quoting Vmcavmcg (Reply 45): I dare say the same is true in reverse!!! Quite likely not. |
Quoting Woof (Reply 48): If you derate to the max, your V1 speed, position and rotation point would be rather similar to an intersection departure with more thrust. What am I missing. |