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MNMncrcnwjr
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Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:40 am

At a county run airport in michigan, a lineman who has been charged with sumping 100LL and JET A tanks daily is found to NOT have done so in 10+ years and it is discovered that the sumping equipment has never been used, the 100LL tank has 6 inches of water and sludge, and that the lineman has initialed the fuel logs and falsified data entered in the logs, even on days he was not working. If you were on the six member commission board, would you vote to relieve the lineman of his duties?
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pilotpip
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:35 am

Has your commission ever had to pay for an aviation-related civil lawsuit?

No brainer for me. Fuel contamination is no joke. I managed weekend QC at an FBO during college. Sumping tanks isn't a difficult job and the best part was saving up a couple gallons of Jet-A over the course of a month for the Kerosene heater in my family's lake cabin.
DMI
 
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fr8mech
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:26 am

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Thread starter):
If you were on the six member commission board, would you vote to relieve the lineman of his duties?

Vote to relieve him of his duties? I would turn him over to the FAA for prosecution. He knowingly falsified fuel logs and put people in danger.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away, or may not come at all.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
rendezvous
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:41 am

This sounds straight out dangerous and negligent. Why is there any question about this? If this person isn't dealt with and someone crashes, how are you going to feel knowing nothing was done?

Aviation safety is a serious matter. Mistakes are one thing, and they will always happen - but this is a person's disregard for the safety of others.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 9:06 am

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Thread starter):
If you were on the six member commission board, would you vote to relieve the lineman of his duties?

The person in question does not realise how his laziness or dishonesty could be a serious situation for the Aircraft & those on it.
When you are employed by an organisation to do a job,The signature on the completion sheet is a committment by that Individual that procedures had been followed.
This is a serious offence here.
regds
MEL.
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
MNMncrcnwjr
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:55 pm

Thanks for the input! The situation is as stated and the commission split the vote 3-3. the line man was reinstated with back pay and faces no disciplinary action at this time. This is a direct result of political pandering and the reason a county should not be in the day to day operations of an airport...
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ajd1992
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:34 pm

I'd have him prosecuted with reckless endangerment.

That's horrifying.
 
b78710
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:46 pm

happens all the time all over the world.
 
N243NW
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:48 pm

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 2):
Vote to relieve him of his duties? I would turn him over to the FAA for prosecution. He knowingly falsified fuel logs and put people in danger.

This is exactly why I sump my tanks EVERY TIME anyone fuels my aircraft. It doesn't take much to cause an engine to quit, and it only takes 30 seconds to check. Plus, you never know when bozos like this guy are taking care of (or not taking care of) the fuel tanks, especially at self-serve pumps.
B-52s don't take off. They scare the ground away.
 
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fr8mech
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 8:46 pm

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Reply 5):
Thanks for the input! The situation is as stated and the commission split the vote 3-3. the line man was reinstated with back pay and faces no disciplinary action at this time. This is a direct result of political pandering and the reason a county should not be in the day to day operations of an airport...

Call the FAA: 1-800-255-1111. It's for Air Carrier employees, but you can start here. I'm sure someone will be interested.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away, or may not come at all.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
KELPkid
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Wed Dec 01, 2010 9:40 pm

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Reply 5):
Thanks for the input! The situation is as stated and the commission split the vote 3-3. the line man was reinstated with back pay and faces no disciplinary action at this time. This is a direct result of political pandering and the reason a county should not be in the day to day operations of an airport...

The man has no business anywhere near an airplane or airport. I hope word of this spreads like wildfire through the US GA community, and people quit buying fuel at the field in question...
Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
 
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tb727
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:36 am

Exactly why we check our fuel every time we fuel up regardless of where we are and who is fueling us.
Too lazy to work, too scared to steal!
 
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CARST
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 1:56 am

Quoting tb727 (Reply 11):
Exactly why we check our fuel every time we fuel up regardless of where we are and who is fueling us.



How do you do that? Is their some handheld-device available for pilots to test the fuel? It would have to be small and light to carry it around with you in your small GA plane or a small bizjet. And who is selling such devices if available?


Carst
 
DiamondFlyer
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:05 am

Quoting CARST (Reply 12):
How do you do that? Is their some handheld-device available for pilots to test the fuel? It would have to be small and light to carry it around with you in your small GA plane or a small bizjet. And who is selling such devices if available?

Don't have the answer for JetA, but Avgas is easily tested. Look up a GATS jar. Basically the size of a soda can. Very easy to use, once you know what to look for.

-DiamondFlyer
From my cold, dead hands
 
Mir
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:12 am

Quoting CARST (Reply 12):
How do you do that? Is their some handheld-device available for pilots to test the fuel? It would have to be small and light to carry it around with you in your small GA plane or a small bizjet. And who is selling such devices if available?


The metal pole is for sticking into the sump to make the fuel come out - it drips into the cup, and you visually inspect it for contaminants. Simple as that. Costs about $25 maximum for a fancy one (about the size of a soda can but a bit taller, and with a filter through which you can pour the sampled fuel back into the tank), weighs practically nothing, and you can get one at pretty much any pilot shop.

There are several varieties of sample jars, but no fancy electronics or anything like that - all you need is a way to make the fuel come out of the sump, and some sort of clear collecting device in which to catch the fuel so that you can look at it.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
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tb727
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:12 am

We have a hydro-kit we carry. We have to take a sample of fuel after the filter, usually from an overwing nozzle but some trucks have a sample sump. Not many carriers test fuel.

http://www.fischer-robertson.com/downloads/Velcon/Fuel/1752.pdf
Too lazy to work, too scared to steal!
 
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CARST
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 3:09 am

Very interesting, thank you for your answers!



Carst
 
411A
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 3:16 am

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Thread starter):
and that the lineman has initialed the fuel logs and falsified data entered in the logs, even on days he was not working.

SaudiArabian had a similar problem with one refueler many years ago, who falsified fuel uplift logs, which resulted in a fifteen ton fuel imbalance in several line aircraft.
Said refueler went to jail for six months, and then was deported...after paying a ten thousand dollar fine.
 
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airportugal310
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 3:26 am

I guess this begs the question if airliners (for arguments sake, Airbus and Boeing) have sump drains somewhere easily accessible by flight crews? I'd really like to know...
“They bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash.”
 
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tb727
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 4:23 am

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 18):
I guess this begs the question if airliners (for arguments sake, Airbus and Boeing) have sump drains somewhere easily accessible by flight crews? I'd really like to know...

They do have sumps but flight crews have no business messing with them!
Too lazy to work, too scared to steal!
 
pilotpip
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 4:51 am

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 18):
I guess this begs the question if airliners (for arguments sake, Airbus and Boeing) have sump drains somewhere easily accessible by flight crews? I'd really like to know...

No, but this is the reason that every air carrier has an established fuel QC program and makes regular audits of their fueling facilities. Once every 8-12 months we'd see reps from the carriers that we serviced and they would inspect our fuel holding tanks, trucks, logs and observe while we fueled their aircraft to ensure we were doing things right.
DMI
 
bohica
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 6:19 am

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Thread starter):
If you were on the six member commission board, would you vote to relieve the lineman of his duties?

Why should there be a commission board to vote on whether or not to fire someone who is lazy, reckless, and has no integrity? It's a no-brainer. The idiot should be fired.

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Reply 5):
the commission split the vote 3-3. the line man was reinstated with back pay and faces no disciplinary action at this time.

There are three people on the board who are as reckless and has as little integrity as the lineman. By any chance are the three who voted in favor of the lineman friends or relatives of the lineman?

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Reply 5):
a county should not be in the day to day operations of an airport...

Slightly disagree. In this case, there is gross mismanagement of the airport to allow what happened to take place. However, many airports are operated by local governments and are managed properly. It's too bad one county run airport makes all the others look bad.
 
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pwm2txlhopper
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:03 pm

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Thread starter):
At a county run airport in michigan, a lineman who has been charged with sumping 100LL and JET A tanks daily is found to NOT have done so in 10+ years and it is discovered that the sumping equipment has never been used, the 100LL tank has 6 inches of water and sludge, and that the lineman has initialed the fuel logs and falsified data entered in the logs, even on days he was not working. If you were on the six member commission board, would you vote to relieve the lineman of his duties?

When I use to be a ramper at PWM, we had a guy on night shift. After things got quite late at night, would unlock the fire gate and drive his '84 Chevy Crown Vic out on the ramp to the ground equipment fuel pumps. He'd put about 20 gallons of gasoline in the tank and then falsify the fuel logs. He must have done that at least once per week, and never got caught to my knowledge?
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:13 pm

Quoting PWM2TXLHopper (Reply 25):
He'd put about 20 gallons of gasoline in the tank and then falsify the fuel logs.

Corrupt people should never be tolerated............Didn't his Engine get overheated.
regds
MEL.
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
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pwm2txlhopper
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:52 pm

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 26):

Corrupt people should never be tolerated............Didn't his Engine get overheated.
regds


Nope, it was just regular 87 Octane gasoline used for ground equipment. He always claimed it actually ran worse, because it had a big powerful engine and ran best on the premium gasoline.

[Edited 2010-12-02 04:54:10]
 
KELPkid
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 4:05 pm

Quoting PWM2TXLHopper (Reply 25):
'84 Chevy Crown Vic

Crown Victoria is a Ford  

The big Chevy equivalent was the Caprice Classic (out of production since the late 1990's)  
Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
 
DiamondFlyer
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 4:19 pm

Have we established that what actions took place had an effect on a large carrier, or is this just at a small GA field? If I was going to bet, it would be on a small GA field, considering the original post mentioned a county run FBO type operation.

Anyone know what the specifics of the case are?

-DiamondFlyer
From my cold, dead hands
 
b78710
Posts: 311
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Thu Dec 02, 2010 8:09 pm

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 18):
I guess this begs the question if airliners (for arguments sake, Airbus and Boeing) have sump drains somewhere easily accessible by flight crews? I'd really like to know...

yes they do, at least one per tank, at the lowest point of the tank.

we do our fuel drains once a week.

flight crew don't get involved in any way what so ever, unless, as already mentioned, they spot one leaking.

its just a little poppet valve on the under side of the wing, spring loaded, we have a tool on a hollow pole with a bottle at the bottom, push the valve up, the fuel flows out. spring closes the poppet when you release

water sits at the bottom, fuel on top. you can easily see if you have water in there. our airbus' are pretty bad for it, never had the slightest bit of water out of a jumbo
 
lowrider
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Fri Dec 03, 2010 1:48 am

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Thread starter):
If you were on the six member commission board, would you vote to relieve the lineman of his duties?

If he was properly trained and instructed in how to do his job, then I would vote for immediate termination. If not, then I would go with time off without pay, followed by training. Then I would fire the person responsible for his initial training.
Proud OOTSK member
 
tdscanuck
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Fri Dec 03, 2010 3:08 am

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Reply 5):
The situation is as stated and the commission split the vote 3-3. the line man was reinstated with back pay and faces no disciplinary action at this time. This is a direct result of political pandering and the reason a county should not be in the day to day operations of an airport...

If this airport were ever to have a fuel related event, they've just sunk any chance they had of pinning the liability on one rogue fueler. I'd hope any good plaintiff attorney would go after the commission board as well.

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 18):

I guess this begs the question if airliners (for arguments sake, Airbus and Boeing) have sump drains somewhere easily accessible by flight crews?

"Easily" is in the eye of the beholder. There are sump drains, but you need a ladder to reach most of them. As others noted, they're for maintenance, not flight crew. The FQIS will pick up water and some types of contamination anyway.

Tom.
 
MNMncrcnwjr
Topic Author
Posts: 26
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Fri Dec 03, 2010 3:56 am

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 26):

The lineman is a 25 year employee. He was trained by the latest fuel provider two years ago. The trainer indicated that the requirement to sump was daily. During the latest inspection by said fuel provider the representative, and the orig trainer, noted discrepancies in the log nation and then realized that the same initials were in the log each day even over the weekend and for everyday for every month for the past two years.

The representative made his findings known to the airport manager, new airport manager, who was not informed that this Lou was being kept due tonthe firing of the previous manager and no transitional orientation. When questioned by the airport manager and county attorney the lineman changed his story three times and finally admitted to not sumping.

The commission chairman and the airport manager went to find the sump equipment and found it scattered around the maintenance facility in pieces and covered in heavy dust and cobwebs. they could not find the needed extension for at least a day. Once peices were found and a sump process began nothing but brackish muddy h2o came out at first.

The tank cleaning service estimated that 4-6 inches of h2o were in the tank and that other filters and equipment needed to be changed out. approximately 800 gallons of 100LL were removed with approximately 250 gallons of water.

The service was $5000 and the cost of approximately 800 gallons of 100LL. They inspected the JetA tanks and noted no contamination even though that hadn't been sumped either for two years (unofficial guess was due to high usage of JetA compared to 100LL)

The airport bylaws require a majority of the full 6 member commission to fire an employee.... This lineman was also fired and due to procedural commission errors, reinstated for inappropriate use of county airport property for personal gain as he allegedly worked air freight flights while on county time and used airport property in doing so, as he was also paid by the freight company for the same time. A practice that had gone unchallenged by the former fired airport manager.

This is a political mess and the local county DA has missed procedural items in this process. The good commissioners are ready to toss in the towel and some pilots are looking into moving their planes to another airfield 20 miles away.

Thanks again for all your replies!
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tdscanuck
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Fri Dec 03, 2010 4:36 am

Quoting MNMncrcnwjr (Reply 30):
unofficial guess was due to high usage of JetA compared to 100LL

The Jet-A distribution system also has water monitors and separators at multiple points...any water coming through should have been stripped at several points, and any high water level should have tripped the water monitor prior to uplift (unless the fueler was shirking that maintenance too).

Tom.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:56 pm

Quoting b78710 (Reply 27):
we do our fuel drains once a week.

On what fleet.
Out here Fuel draininging for water contamination is every 24 hrs & the Fleet consists of B737/757s.
regds
MEL.
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
b78710
Posts: 311
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:21 am

RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:27 pm

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 32):

On what fleet.

b744 and a340-300/600
 
tdscanuck
Posts: 8573
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Sat Dec 04, 2010 1:35 am

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 32):
On what fleet.
Out here Fuel draininging for water contamination is every 24 hrs & the Fleet consists of B737/757s.
regds

Sumping schedules are *extremely* environmentally and operator dependant, since how often you need it depends on how you operate, where your fuel comes from, what the climate is like, and a couple of other factors. OEM recommendations are to start with something like once a week then go up or down based on what the findings tell you. Once a week might be entirely fine for aircraft running long haul with clean fuel supplies in cold climates, daily might be necessary for high-cycle aircraft in humid locations.

Tom.

[Edited 2010-12-03 17:36:06]
 
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pwm2txlhopper
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RE: Falsifying Fuel Logs

Sat Dec 04, 2010 5:17 am

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 25):
Quoting PWM2TXLHopper (Reply 25):
'84 Chevy Crown Vic

Crown Victoria is a Ford

The big Chevy equivalent was the Caprice Classic (out of production since the late 1990's)

Thanks for the correction. Cars aren't my thing! When other kids played with their matchbox cars, I played with my toy planes.

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