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Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): It cruised at mach .90. |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): It could land at smaller airports very easily. |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): It could climb very rapidly. |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): why was it not just as a success as the 737? |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): The plane had rear air stairs. (why do planes no longer have stairs built in? |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): With all of the features and benefits it had, why was it not just as a success as the 737? |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): Upgrades could have been done to it to make it cheaper to operate, such as glass cockpits and maybe the elimination of the tail engine. |
Quoting kurtverbose (Reply 3): Unlike the 737 it couldn't be re-engined with high bypass engines, so Boeing brought out the 757 - which to all intents and purposes was a 727 replacement. |
Quoting kurtverbose (Reply 3): As for the rear stairs, I think DB Cooper stopped that. To my knowledge many of them were sealed up after that event. |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): Upgrades could have been done to it to make it cheaper to operate, such as glass cockpits and maybe the elimination of the tail engine. |
Quoting kurtverbose (Reply 3): As for the rear stairs, I think DB Cooper stopped that. To my knowledge many of them were sealed up after that event. |
Quoting 737tdi (Reply 5): I don't know of any that were sealed up but we did modify them with what was called the DB Cooper mod.. Picture a spring loaded weather vane that when there was sufficient airflow across it would rotate 90 degrees and physically block the air stair from being deployed in flight. Once the airflow was lost the little vane would rotate back and clear the air stair for lowering. |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 7): There wouldn't be any point in sealing them up as you'd still be carting the weight around and it was basically part of the airframe. |
Quoting akiss20 (Reply 8): Was the rear air stair in the 727 considered a necessary emergency exit on any models? If so, it wouldn't even be legal to seal them no? |
Quoting longhauler (Reply 1): Some airline's B737 had rear airstairs. (some of ours did). It remains an option. |
Quoting kurtverbose (Reply 11): Isn't he far less moody now? |
Quoting BravoOne (Reply 13): Funny no one in Boeing 737 Tech Ops has ever heard of such a thing? Can you provide a photo or some sort proof as it would make for a good beer bet. |
Quoting kurtverbose (Reply 3): As for the rear stairs, I think DB Cooper stopped that. To my knowledge many of them were sealed up after that event. |
Quoting 737tdi (Reply 5): I don't know of any that were sealed up but we did modify them with what was called the DB Cooper mod.. Picture a spring loaded weather vane that when there was sufficient airflow across it would rotate 90 degrees and physically block the air stair from being deployed in flight. Once the airflow was lost the little vane would rotate back and clear the air stair for lowering. |
Quoting longhauler (Reply 16): Quoting BravoOne (Reply 13): Funny no one in Boeing 737 Tech Ops has ever heard of such a thing? Can you provide a photo or some sort proof as it would make for a good beer bet. Rear airstairs were standard on the Combi version of the B737C, and optional on all B737s ... some even had both installed, front and back. They weren't ventral like the B727, the B737's aft pressure dome wouldn't permit it, they were installed on door L2. |
Quoting MD80 (Reply 19): Thanks for posting a photo of this device! |
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 20): The first 737s built, LH's 737-100s, had both front and rear airstairs. |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 22): they looked very heavy ! |
Quoting desertjets (Reply 12): Ultimately 9/11 intervened and the 727s got retired early. IIRC AA, DL, UA and maybe NW still had fairly sizeable fleets of 727-200s in 2001 -- I am thinking around 200-250 aircraft in that time period (maybe less, don't quote me on it). Then they were pretty much gone overnight. But even in the absence of 9/11 their days were numbered. For the most part they were all on the other side of 20 years old and were well used to boot. If jet fuel had not stayed so cheap during the 1990s I feel that the majors would have been quicker to retire them. |
Quoting longhauler (Reply 16): Rear airstairs were standard on the Combi version of the B737C, and optional on all B737s ... some even had both installed, front and back. They weren't ventral like the B727, the B737's aft pressure dome wouldn't permit it, they were installed on door L2. |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 22): Don't remember if they had the front stairs installed but I remember riding on one, looking at the rear air stairs and thinking they looked very heavy ! |
Quoting MD80 (Reply 23): IIRC it was the complexity of the design and the weight that resulted to the fact that this feature was short-lived. |
Quoting BravoOne (Reply 25): Okay I thought you meant aft ventral stairs. I use to operate a B767-200ER with stairs at the L2 door. Watching them extend and retract was |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 7): It was also the sweetest flying jet I've ever flown, the first one I flew and still may favourite, it went through turbulence like a knife through butter. |
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 17): By the time the last 727s in the US were withdrawn from service (late 1990s), the 757 was firmly established as a replacement and the 737-NG family and A320 family were also available for 727 missions. |
Quoting KELPkid (Reply 27): My next door neighbor growing up was a 727 captain, and said it was next to impossible to get a gentle landing in it, though... |
Quoting KELPkid (Reply 27): They were amongst the last ones built, though....IIRC, DL got their last 727's delivered in 1988! Not sure if those were ordered by Delta directly or ancilliary orders from Western Airlines (whom Delta merged with). |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Reply 28): Quoting BravoOne (Reply 25): I am curious now, why did 9/11 accelerate their depletion? Safety? |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): Upgrades could have been done to it to make it cheaper to operate, such as glass cockpits and maybe the elimination of the tail engine. |
Quoting CALTECH (Reply 26): They did. Continental removed them after a while in service. All the -100s had them IIRC. Can see the airstair panel under door 1L..... |
Quoting KELPkid (Reply 27): My next door neighbor growing up was a 727 captain, and said it was next to impossible to get a gentle landing in it, though... |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 31): It wasn't impossible but it wasn't easy without a decent amount of experience on it. It was not a forgiving aircraft in that respect. |
Quoting tb727 (Reply 32): I got lucky my last landing in it, greased it on. The next leg my FO, a guy with 15 years as a Captain on it, absolutely clanged it on, probably the hardest one I felt in my 5 years on it! I was glad to go home with mine. Of course I took the long runway leg and he got the one with the short runway with a hump but what can I say, dealers choice |
Quoting KELPkid (Reply 27): DL was still flying a few in the early 2000's. |
Quoting KELPkid (Reply 27): They were amongst the last ones built, though....IIRC, DL got their last 727's delivered in 1988! Not sure if those were ordered by Delta directly or ancilliary orders from Western Airlines (whom Delta merged with). |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 33): Best wishes and I hope you enjoy your new type, whatever that is ! |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 31): It wasn't impossible but it wasn't easy without a decent amount of experience on it. It was not a forgiving aircraft in that respect. |
Quoting FlyMKG (Reply 35): It flies much better when it's heavy. |
Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 36): The -100 wasn't near as bad as the -200. |
Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 36): if you tried to land it like a normal airplane you ended up rotating the gear into the ground. |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 37): All of the myth's surrounding these 'techniques' and promoting them as being better than a properly flown approach and landing caused Pilots a lot more problems than they were worth. |
Quoting TriL1011Star (Thread starter): Upgrades could have been done to it to make it cheaper to operate, such as glass cockpits and maybe the elimination of the tail engine. |
Quoting Max Q (Reply 33): Best wishes and I hope you enjoy your new type, whatever that is ! |
Quoting longhauler (Reply 38): This is funny! I have to figure you have seen and heard the same "let me try it this way" techniques as me. Some of them resulted in pretty spectacular landings! Now that I am a Training Captain on the B767, often I have to dispell these bar learned theories before they try them on the aircraft. |
Quoting longhauler (Reply 38): I just tell them. "You want to land a B767 well, just slowly ease the nose up, as you slowly ease the thrust off, keep the damned thing straight ... and you'll be fine!" |
Quoting longhauler (Reply 38): compared to the B737, the B727 is a truck. Slow to roll and LOVES the ground, both on take-off and landing. |
Quoting CALTECH (Reply 39): They did that, first with the 757 and then the 737. |
Quoting CALTECH (Reply 39): The 727 was so good, they were going to make the 777 look a lot like it. |
Quoting tb727 (Reply 41): Thanks Max Q! Yeah, it's French and not as "automated" as the 727 even though everyone thinks it is all fancy and does everything for you. I feel that I have to do everything in the new plane. At least the 72' was all voice activated |
Quoting tb727 (Reply 41): Thanks Max Q! Yeah, it's French and not as "automated" as the 727 even though everyone thinks it is all fancy and does everything for you. I feel that I have to do everything in the new plane. At least the 72' was all voice activated |